Angry Guy of DE

@ Fatal I think one of the lunches causes poison or something? One of them has a purple aura that should be avoided because it does not give meter. I also don't know how much meter you get from it, probably just 1/3 to 1/2 so you can't call assist > build 1+ bar from lunch. Also I think the Ryuuji Mop assist procs when hit by a projectile. He gets pissed off and gets a red aura and doesn't have to go off-screen to do the attack. Also once he goes off-screen Ryuuji seems to be guaranteed to do the attack on the way back even if you are hit. Seems to do 5-6 hits before disappearing so its easy to confirm into a combo, burst, or super. Also that dude has a very short cool-down for the mop assist version.

Well Celica's doll doesn't seem to be tied to a gauge so those normals involving the doll are still directly connected to her. Damage per combo < ability to get a hit to start combo. Though I wonder how sad some of Celica's hit boxes will look once we can see in hit box viewer. Probably not too many disjointed hitboxes that we might've thought at first, in fact she's probably a fat chick like Rachel with how wide her hit boxes are.

6B when it is jump canceled is safe, it just means that your pressure has ended to a certain extent. I also have to ask who are you playing that shows no such respect for your strings to be ready to crank out a dp after blocking 6B? Even videos of 2.0 Kagura don't get disrespected to that level so anyone that does that on the drop of a dime should be baited more than attempted to use 3C to catch mashing. Would 3C be better if it was safe? Sure. Is that really something Kagura needs for his gameplan? I don't think so in my opinion. Trying to use 3C to catch mashing is such a bad idea since it is so far down the options of moves you can chain into that you are asking to eat a dp by using that to catch jumps or normals. His 5B being even on block with the additional ability to naturally gatling into 6B while holding a [4] charge is strong enough as is. Hell I know that if you are daring enough 5DA can armor through a lot of reversals for a FC like Litchi's dp if you know they are willing to mash a reversal instead of blocking. His 6B would be the better candidate to make a move safer on block with since you want to be close enough to continue your pressure with his T-Rex arm range A and B normals. 3C is just a combo tool that should be hit confirmed into or used as a punish on things you know like Kokonoe's fireball super on block: 3C (CH) > 6DA midscreen to get a solid punish and avoid the fireball as it comes down.

Well Ragna's Hell's Fang is kind of weird to say because that thing can hit near the end of it and I swear it seems less than -4 before IB. I just don't see 3C getting improved to the point of being safe aka "cannot be 2A'd IB or no for CH punish" since it's function is for combos. I think it would be great if it was Hakumen or Hazama levels of safe but those don't really convert to combos outside of CH (Hakumen) or done very close (Hazama). Kagura's 3C also in the corner combos into CT so it is able to be used more in combos for damage. 3C doesn't need to be a safe since you don't need to commit to it from 6B with it being jump-cancelable on block. I do agree that it would be nice if more of Kagura's normal were in-fact true airtight strings, but I've found that 2A into 6A or a slightly delayed 5B catches people when they are conditioned to expect the overhead. My point is 3C doesn't need to be safe because it should just be used for hit confirmed combos or to do drive strings on characters that have to respect it since they have no reversal option.

25 frames...if it wasn't a full screen move then that would be a rather awful overhead. I think Ragna is better because he has better juggles with Berial Edge not being as situational and his damage is plain better. His better confirms tend to end up doing 4K meterless with corner carry, and he still has good normals to roll with so yeah.

I doubt we'll ever have a 3C that is safe on block, especially since 6B is jump cancel-able on block. Knowing how they do stuff it would end up as a one or the other; 3C is safe or 6B gets to be jump cancel-able on block. I did wish that 3C had a better hitbox above him, the animation would make you think that it could be a pseudo anti-air. If 3C does have improved recovery will the frame data stay the same for how it is on block?

What the hell did they do to 6DA? That invul looks nutty when its beating out Plat's bat, like 6DB's invul during the teleport behind is understandable but that looks weird. NOT COMPLAINING. Though now that you mention it, 3C does seem faster. We Hakumen now with 8 Frame 3C? If more things can be punished with 3C for CH then that's more 6C's and 6DA's into combos for us. I guess we have more rushdown to make up for the weakened oki from the past.

The wiki doesn't mention it so I just went with that, if it did get head invul in either 1.1 or 2.0 then that's a bonus. Though like you said it does require some prediction to use effectively against people, which is why it often goes to the wayside when I opted to do [4]6 A or B orb and then 6C to catch attempted airdashes over it. The other problem it had was that on non-CH you normally don't get a combo off of it and even on CH the pick-up can be dicey depending on where you are in relation the wall that they bounce off of.

I don't think it has any head invul. frames in 1.1 at least. What it does have is a generous hitbox when it's out as well as probably lowering Kagura's own hurtbox while he's swinging. Hitboxes are funny with some of his moves, like his 5B actually has his upper-body hurtbox go back slightly during the animation (since he in fact does lean back a little when he does the kick). Spaced correctly you can dodge the launching hit of Koko's fireball super and still CH her with your 5B. Of course Kagura also is somewhat low to the ground during some of his stance poses and even in his neutral animation so who knows. I would rather have 5DC have faster start-up than head invul. since the respect it forces once he starts swinging can catch people that don't know the range of the second hit of it.

*checks jourdal for videos* ...Is it just recent in this version that she can do 3C into 5A on characters? Okay I can see what you mean where its better as is now. Outside of designed graviton-less combos she would normally only use probably 2 units of graviton with the most extended combos going as high as 4-5. This is reins in her neutral (or lack of respect for neutral) more where gravitons would be tossed around. Neat. Though I wonder why she seems be even rarer to see in 2.0 than the likes of Amane and Kagura?

While Koko's Graviton gauge isn't as complex, when a graviton is out is also drains the gauge in 1.0 and 1.1 versions. Was that removed in 2.0 and plain has x number of times graviton can be used until it regens? It just seems like a bad decision overall, especially when summoning and activating the graviton take a stock from her.

Maybe this whole time the gauges for fireball and lightning corridor were bugged all this time and now in 2.0 it actually matters. I still don't get the reason to change the graviton gauge to numbers. Imagine if Carl or Relius's doll gauge was converted into numbers instead of a gauge. How long can Relius pressure you? The gauge says six.

Tager is considered low on the tier list and now Lambda as well... Is it just me or is Kokonoe actually not that great of a scientist where she can only make low tier characters? I mean the other guy in Sector Seven was considered top tier and he could just lift!

Nu match-up in a nutshell: How to make the opponent butt-hurt so they just try to airdash at you full screen.

Until Kagura gets the hint to swing his sword out during his jump like Hakumen his air game will always be lacking. It also didn't help that his 6C still doesn't have head invul so his only valid anti-air options meterless are his [2]8 B and C moves. He's a momentum character, either you make the right moves and win or struggle trying to make headway. Such is the fate of the man who doesn't look at his own explosions.

Well this is a significant change for pretty much every character, so this is a melting pot of discussion, so salt being added is a given. People are just wondering things with their character; Is my character better, is my character more fun, and does this make sense with my character? Most information we get is just from videos and the less used characters generally get talked about more because of the three things stated above. Combos will change in some degree but this will always be a game where a Ragna can go 5B > 5C > Hell's Fang > 214D Follow-up. It is still fresh in the arcades so people will talk about character changes, once a console release is revealed and confirmed as a DLC patch or a straight new game people will discuss things like "Am I really going to want to pay for that?" The Wheel of Fate is Turning...General Discussion...Action!

Now that you mention it Seo...Kagura is able to barrier while in stance now right? 5DC might be more useful now as a poke since it got better in 1.1 with range and so long as it is almost an airtight string into 2DB Kagura could control a good amount of the air by approaching and having barrier out while air-stancing into moves. That alone might make some match-ups with zoners a little better by barrier blocking a hit and then getting closer with 6DC or 2DB. Come to think of it I wonder what the frame data is on just canceling the first hit of 5DC into other moves are...is it massively minus or is it a potential frame trap option?

Pretty much [4]6B is no longer used in combos since the changes in 2.0 make it useless in the corner. As far as integrating [2]8C in corner combos the charge should be able to be done during... 6DC and just slide to 3 to have a down charge started. Of course this is all theory since we can only watch videos. A orb oki will still be strong depending on the match up, I think the timing will change or we should try to catch people trying to roll out more often with... 6DA. Or something.

I refer to it as "Stance" since it happened often when trying to explain it to a person face to face and people getting confused when they didn't know how his drive worked. If it causes confusion here I'll make a point to just explain it as 5DA and so on. One thing I'm noticing in videos is how the wall stick and potential combo follow-up of 2C is dependent on how high the stick is applied. Probably spacing will be needed to know what moves in a corner combo will do it high enough. It also doesn't help in most videos that Japanese Kagura players mess up oki by not delaying the orb now...now that I think about it there really weren't many good Japanese Kagura in 1.1 ...

Not as far as I know, but 5B has only 8 frames of start-up and has comparable range to both 5A and 2A. Each normal has a good use when you look at it: 5A : 5 Frame Start-up, even on block, Will whiff on most crouchers. Able to gatling into 6A 2A: 7 Frame Start-up, -1 on block, can confirm into itself, Able to gatling into 6A 5B: 8 Frame, even on block, hits low, On hit allows good combo into Stance 2B with orb oki. Even max range 5B still allows the optimum midscreen starter into orb oki. I don't mention 2B simply because it has a start-up of 12 frames so even with IB people can jump away or even mash 2A unless they are very much negative after a move.

I took Terumi's playstyle as having good speed and effective enough normal to poke and pressure and then confirm with meter to continually do damage and have meter to use supers at the end of combos or in response to opponent's attempts to get away. Terumi's pressure would be scary if his throw range wasn't horrible (get your hands out of your pockets) as his run speed combined with a + 2A and 5B can keep him close. THAT SAID, 2.0 seems to get more use of j.D but the change to 6D can put you in a situation where you aren't on the opponent again when they get up. 236D's change I think can still be good, Terumi's 5D became a legit poke in 1.1 and you had adequate time to confirm into a 236D on hit. Terumi isn't going to be a flexible character in most areas especially without 50+ heat for supers, but his punishes and OD can turn a fight in the blink of an eye with the right reads. As far as Makoto goes...her viability would go up if she got some of her old hitboxes back, that change from CS 2 to Extend was bordering on CT to CS1 Rachel drop in tier position.

Chzchan noticed it in a video but Stance 6C seems to have projectile guardpoint properties instead of super armor. Checking other matches Kagura doesn't seem to take damage while going through projectiles (Hazama Chains and Kagura orbs), I don't know what limits they have as far as damage capacity as vanilla Stance 6C had no limit of armor while 1.1 had a limit of 1.5K health armor. With the improved run speed Kagura players will now likely opt to IB strings more and be able to micro dash 5A, 2A, and 5B with added range to start his own pressure. Confirming crouched opponent combos are more valuable mid-screen as Stance 2C into Stance 6A combos on a crouching opponent since Stance 2C puts them in a spinning state now.

Well that's all based on the p1 of the starter and the p2 as well. 5B : p1 85 / p2 85 5BB / 6B : p1 100 / p2 89 I don't think its as much of a difference as over 1K between 5B starter and 6B but better starters = better potential damage. Hell in 1.1 a good CH 6C with its p1 of 100 meant that Kagura got 5K meterless corner carry midscreen against everyone besides Jin and Valk because of their sliding hitboxes.

I'm referring to combos that have 5C into [2]8C, no stance. How much does Stance 6C knock a dude up compared to now? Also, I'm pretty sure most combos actually result in better damage that go 5B straight to 3C and ignore 5BB. Something with the prorate of 5BB or something.

Okay I'm gonna really need to see some footage of how [2]8C is used in combos. Also not sure how you sneak in enough charge to flash kick after some things like 5C and stance 6C.