Fame96

They took out the 2D change ......... i'm already liking CF more just with the little bit i saw. I just hope that some of the weirder changes get addressed before launch.

decided to do some digging through twitter and found a jp player's notes. It could have some stuff we don't know about and i saw some sample combos in them. If we can find someone to translate that would be great. the twitter is @ren8938

Maybe he wasn't close enough, but we won't know until the game is released. I still think most of the followups are the same except for maybe OD 22C. I wish i was in japan so i could test it myself ; ~ ;

at 15:38, terumi confirms 214C, orochi b wallstick, into 5C for a valid combo. At the very least, we have 11 frames to follow up, possibly more.

Wait, J.D doesn't knock down airborne opponents now. The fact that it doesn't knock down airborne opponents is what makes driveloops possible.

Overall it seems they want to let us get bang for your buck with our meter in terms of damage, but the 236D change still makes no sense to me. We'll just have to wait for more info.

Another stream, another patch of changes. I most likely didn't catch everything but i'll post what i saw. 6C- animation speed up slightly and bounces on the last hit. Not sure if you can follow up meterless. J.D- slight startup reduction? 6D- only has 2 meter slashes. Meter gain is still about the same. 2D- still ass 4D- confirmed to be at least 9 frames or slower. Terumi tried to followup OD soutenjin with it and it didn't work. Launches them straight up. Decent untechable time. If we still have driveloops, this will be the perfect move to set it up with. 236D- now has a minimum height requirement for the whole move to animate blowback hitstun is decent though. 214D- still ass 22C- drastic change. Final hit now launches them and is special cancelable. XX, 22C, 214C, stuff did 3.5K despite the terumi player not finishing the combo. 214C- alot of untech time on air hit. New central combo tool. 41236C- R.I.P No longer has strike invuln (jin player 2A terumi during the active frames) increased untechable time on the ground version. 63214 B & A- WALLBOUNCES MIDSCREEN!!!!!!!! Followups are very easy since they land right in front of you. Wallsticks in the corner. Overall it looks like they are going the buff the offense and damage, but nerf the neutral route. These changes combined with the 5D nerf makes it to most likely be the case. We're still not out of the woods yet. I'll be sure to watch the stream tomorrow and lookout for more footage. (o_o)7

R.I.FUCKING P

Terumi - stomp supers A and B both corner wallstick now *i don't know how to feel about this, it's good for the A version, but might be alittle problematic for the b version. - air messenga has so much recovery you can't combo afterwards *RIP - j.2D is + on block We got our pressure reset option back! \o/ -ground messenga has more float allowing 5B to combo *seems to be a mix of the current version and 1.0 messenga -6C floats on hit *this sounds very problematic as a combo ender and OD combo brancher. But as a regular combo extender........IDK i need footage of this. I was able to catch a very quick peek at terumi's new moves on stream and a few changes. 214C- his overhead. On twitter it is said to be a moment starter. On air hit can at least be followed up by a 3C. Doesn't really look that fast, but sounds like it will also be a important new combo tool. RC and dd cancelable. 4D- his new drive normal. Terumi does a really quick upward kick that launches and gives meter. As i just said this move looks VERY fast, and most likely is another important combo tool. Range looks pretty bad though. Make sure that you follow @HiagoXYZ on twitter. He's one of the main ones translating changes from the loketest. A true hero (;~;)7

Trying to play footsies in netplay. You predict the normal, but your punish gets blown up due to delay.

Again i personally think using 50 meter just for alittle oki is a no no. Unless you need that side swap from messenga or the carry from 6C or stomp super, don't use meter to get oki. For low airdash mixups, that's honestly your call. It's a decent mixup, but does poor damage. I wouldn't rely on it too much though. Focus more on getting your netural and pressure better and score hits from that.

Here are skd's closed loketest impressions. There is a bit on terumi. But it's good to know the rest too. http://www.teamstickbug.com/2015/08/26/skds-closed-loketest-bbcf-info-and-impressions-writeup/

Somebody fucking shoot me....

it acts as both a projectile and a physical attack. It can hit opponents while negating low level projectiles at the same. J.D also acts like this. This is why it gets blown up by any type of counter and why it can negate projectiles.

Here is noel vs terumi http://www.dustloop.com/forums/index.php?/forums/topic/11368-noel-vs-terumi/&do=findComment&comment=932169

I've been working on putting my matchup notes on DL here's terumi vs jin.

Guess i'll put in my fill. Going to be doing it from terumi's perspective. I find that being just outside of terumi's 2C's max range is the prefered positioning for him in footsies. Reason being is that this makes jin's 5B and 5C whiff and you are still in a good position for a whiff punish. He can also walk up 5B for a high damage counterpoke at this range since jin extends his hurtbox quite often. Jin is not helpless by any means because you are put into the position of his 5D and 2D. The only difference is that terumi is going to be sitting on alot more meter than jin is most of the time, allowing him to get damage more often on long range confirms. His ice sword is also always an option however if terumi has a read, he can stuff it with 5D, messenga, or Jarin resouga if he is feeling ballsy and you try to throw a sword from at least half screen away. When it comes to anti airs, terumi gets access to a situational anti air againest jin in the form of 2C. 2C can anti air all of his air normals except for J.2C and J.D for alot of damage, but considering the risk, it is best to stick with 5A, 6A, or J.A. Jin can answer againest terumi's J.D with his J.C, 2D, his ice wave super, 623B, or a well placed ice sword. J.D cannot be overabused in this fight. Terumi can run under J.C and TK ice swords for free for a big punish if he has the read. Jin can't overabuse them unless he is desperate to lose. Once Terumi gets meter. Terumi's 6C becomes very threatening and he gains access to messenga. This allows terumi to whiff punish jin VERY easily. Jin runs a high risk of getting punished hard if he attacks at the wrong time. Whenever it is during neutral, or either's players pressure. Terumi holds alot more control when he gets at least 50 heat. During terumi's pressure he can use either the 2a whiff OS, a properly spaced 6B, or a 6B feint to bait gale. It is highly recommended for jin to use EX dp instead. Other than ex dp and supers, he lacks an answer to 6B without IBing and hard reads. He can constantly switch up his frame traps to make it hard for jin to escape without taking a risk. When terumi gets pressured by jin, it is similar story, except jin has an easier time opening terumi up due to his throw game and the fact that he has a standing overhead. If jin uses his 6D in pressure. terumi can use 6A to trade if he doesn't have meter. Jin will be blown back and you will return to neutral. If jin uses 6B anywhere but after a 6C that is not IBed, you can 6A him for free. Depending on the normal, you can even 5B him. If you have 100 meter, you can kill him for even trying 6B with counter super, or almost any of his other supers. If he tries to end his pressure with an ice sword, it depends on how far he is from you. If you are near point blank, you can just block it and get away from him and return to neutral. If you are farther away, you can avoid the sword depending on the move it was canceled from. With meter, ice sword in a blockstring can be punished with messenga. If ground messenga is blocked (which is -9 on block), jin can dash up 5B (i'm not sure how fast his 2B is) if you need terumi closer, you can barrier block messenga but it will become -8 on block. If terumi air messenga's and you didn't already press anything, you can use gale for a good punish. 623B loses and 2C is very hard to time. You cannot punish him on block when he does air messenga. IMO, this fight is pretty even. both sides have good answers to each others tools. It boils down to whoever can play a better neutral game than the other. Jin players feel free to put in your perspective in case I missed something.

while it can be hard to press buttons on terumi without a dp, you have to bear in mind that mixup options are limited until he gets meter and even then said options don't do alot of damage unless he has 50 more heat for the combo. His gateways to mixup are from 2C, and when he has meter, 5C and J.2D. 2C is his only way to get a meterless 50/50 and without heat, the damage on the overhead is near non existant and if you block the OH his pressure ends. If you were barrier blocking, the low will whiff and you can punish him. 5C with meter leads to a legit 50/50. If you default to blocking high, he can either fakeout low/throw or jab high/low/throw. Cannot mash on him even if you ib 5C if he does the OH option, other options can be mashed on.Downside is again the damage is poor. terumi's 2a is +1, 5b is +2, and 6B is +3. Unless you IB them, don't mash when you block these unless you have a dp. In all honesty all you need to do is just be patient and bid your time. Terumi may be keeping you in blockstun but he can't mix you up that well without resources. Just block, lookout for a grab or J.2D. Then return to netural. Terumi punishes you heavily for getting too greedy and being too anxious to escape. Don't let him put you through the mind game.

I posted the matchup from terumi's viewpoint here. If you feel like i missed anything. Feel free to correct me.

I'm mainly going to be talking about the matchup from Terumi's point of view. Terumi wants to stay just outside of his 2C max range. At this range, Terumi can harass her with his 5D and both noel's 5b and 5c whiff at this range. If she does whiff you can get a quick whiff punish with 5D, 6C, or dash up 5B for damage and/or meter. At this range, she either has to be patient and wait for an opportunity to inch within her preferred range, or take a big risk. If Terumi is any closer to noel, Terumi will need to start using 2B, 5B, and 2C due to 5D's startup. He can counter poke with 5B on a good read, and his normals are pretty fast with better priority than noel, but noel can properly fight back at this range and doesn't need to take as much of a risk unlike if you were farther away. Noel can have a hard time dealing with Terumi's J.D at times due to her short reach. If she tries to challenge it without a really hard read, she is just going to feed Terumi free meter and counter hits. 2D's arc and slow startup makes it a poor option without a hard read(she has to use 4D before Terumi even jumps for it to work). 3C can catch the landing recovery but only if the Terumi does J.D early in his jump, if the Terumi does it late in the jump, noel's 3C gets stuffed and Terumi can get a confirm into a free 48 heat or 3k+ damage. Terumi's godlike 6A wrecks her jump ins and her 2D. Noel's J.D does bait pretty well but only when she does it from higher up. If she does it from an IAD, Terumi's 6A stops all of it. Her super can make him second guess using 6A however, so he can't disrespect noel too much when she has 50 heat. When Terumi starts his pressure, he does need to keep noel's 4D in mind, However he can adjust his pressure to where 4D becomes a non factor. J.2D blows up 4D. His command grab blows up 4D (even when canceled from 2A), and by properly spacing 6B in his blockstrings, he can make noel's 4D whiff completely, wait for the noel's drive followup or reload animation and punish accordingly. He can also use his great 2A and 5B for nasty stagger if noel choose to mash her other normals. 632146D allows her to disrespect his pressure more consistently when she has meter however. Despite all of this, Terumi is not as threating as noel during pressure due to his lack of mixup options without meter, and when he does have meter, noel's mixup options often do more damage than his. Terumi has to relay more on mindgames to open people up, which can make getting damage on offense harder than it should be. If Terumi gets put under pressure. Noel's offense can be a pain to deal with. When it comes to her drive pressure, it really depends on how they flow through their strings that determines how many opportunities you have to get out of there, but without meter, it is far too risky to mash on her, and his CA is not reliable at all. There is usually a gap when she tries to go into chain revolver, imo it is his best chance to get out when he doesn't have meter. If noel blocks ground messenga (which is -9 on block), she can micro dash 5B for a punish. (it is a 1 frame link though) She can deal with air messenga by using her 6A after the super flash (if she wasn't pressing anything before hand) IMO, Terumi has a slight advantage due to noel's lack of options in the neutral game at Terumi's preferred range. Terumi controls his space fairly well and can even fight as good as noel in her comfort zone. As long as the Terumi player's footsie game is on point he can dominate in this fight. Terumi's biggest problem in this matchup is when noel finally gets in. Terumi has to be ready to guess on the mixup when he is forced to block. Without meter due to how risky it can be to mash, he can be very difficult to escape once she starts using her drives. With meter, he can use one of his many reversal options to try and turn the tide. Noel players please leave your point of view of the fight if you want. Your opinion is very well appreciated

it does work but spending 50 meter just for some oki is not exactly the best idea. Especially since his oki is much better when he has the opponent cornered.

I tested it out. Like you said the timing is weird. Since you can only use it off of a 6C ender, use of this can be rather limited but it is a good thing to keep in your backpocket.

hmm.... I gotta test that. Thanks for the info. PS: terumi is not THAT bad. Him being absolute garbage is a bit overexaggerated.

Due to 2C's hitbox and low profile, you can use like like a jin would use 2A in specific matchups but due to how good 6A and 5A are and how risky it can be, it is no where near as practical as say a Jin 2A ghetto anti air.

Added my fill to the strategy section and added a few more details in the movelist section. I may add more to the offense section later.