fogelstrom

Yes, and even then my numbers end up at +4 on crouching and +3 on standing. Even if it is 5F and is 1F link I should have hit it at least once by mistake from trying. Also if it actually was possible to link I'd tink we'd see JP players using it, but they don't. If it is possible I just want someone recording and showing since I wasn't capable of doing it once and my numbers says it's max +4 on crouch. You did not mention CH but then it's common knowledge. However still, for my own personal style, I don't see 6K fitting in as a pressure tool. Since you get nothing there's not much to be afraid of hence, in my meaning, not really worth other pressure options. But as I said earlier, if it works out for you I by no means am trying to tell you not to use it. I just simply think there are almost always better options at hand than 6K.

I did some number crunching. I can only see 6K as +4 if you hit the last active frame wich means you can't ever link it. You got any footage of it? If you could link of meaty 6K it would be useful but I can't see it possible frame wise. I sat down in training trying to do it but never got a link once. First attempt on It's Late meaty setup. I just don't see why 6K would ever be better than It's Late in pretty much any situation. But then again I can't link it.

There is a reason for 6K to almost never be used by Taka and Hase. It's simply because it has barely any uses. There is no reason to use 6K for overhead purposes when you have dust and It's Late. If you use it in your play and it works for you I'm not gonna tell you not to use it. But it has more or less zero use in my play. I don't see how anyone would "fear" getting hit by a 6K. It's 22dmg and I don't know the frames on crouching/standing hit but even if you get combo from it still has 80% forced proration as well that isn't in no way warranted. You could say that I'm just a hypocrite going on about how Helter Skelter is valuable but I just don't see any value in 6K.

Yeah but he might have meant that 6K would put you far away enough for not getting c.S and 2K being to slow. Then your options would be 2P/5P and just maybe 2S, 2D would be possible then. I don't think the theorizing is even necessary since I don't think they'll make it possible to link stuff after it but making it + on block or +-0 would at least make it have any use at all. Since atm the only use it has at this moment is to steal wins of people with very low hp that will die from the single hit.

Dno what you are smoking but Helter Skelter is way better than what you are making it out to be. There is 0 characters you can't combo against BUT you have to hit Helter Meaty on late frames to hit j.H combo on Faust and May. I've done it loads of time. If you learn the single j.H timing on characters you can get j.H, c.S, f.S, 2D or j.H, 2K, 2D. Character specific but still. I don't have damage on hand but at least Helter Skelter doesn't have any Forced Prorate and you can link DHD on normal hit on the whole cast. If you have 100% meter you can even link DoT from DHD stagger to lock out burst completely. Or you can go c.S, j.D, DHD, c.S, f.S, 2D/Mappa (character specific as well obivously). I don't think Slayer desperatly needs to be able to link anything from 6K. Obviously it would be nice if he could but I can understand how they reason with 6K since it has retained feint properties but throw tech has been removed. Since this is a throw game.

You won't be needing j.HD at all probably. Helter Skelter j.H, stuff, 2D will probably be alot easier. Slayer getting lower altitude however will not make May's or Faust's hitbox higher. We might be able to hit them before the hitstun runs out this time around with some luck. Also on blocked Helter Skelter it will probably be harder for people to punish as well. I assume they wanted to make the move more useful and used.

I... I... I don't know what to say. It's beautiful. If all of these changes were final I would be really happy with Slayer without going into stupid wish-listing. j.H prorate removed? Thank god. Forward momentum retained when jumping canceling any forward dash and not just long dash? This is what I get from reading the changed and that's extremely welcomed. Going to be easier to move around quickly. Better prorate on 5K. Not much but it's still more dmg from 5K, Mappa, RC combos. I really hope console doesn't get shafted for ~half a year like they do on BlazBlue series.

Elphelt has same 27F on face down and face up on down. 27F is a bit high for both but she's by no means anything out of the ordinary during wakeup. If she for some reason had lower body invul on wakeup or during 2P people would most likely already know about it and rage about it as well. Even with your confidence on hitting meaty I can only see you missing your timing. Sure you're not just hitting people after they already stood up and not on the first frames available? Most easy to notice is against shoryu characters when they hit your with shoryu without it being reversal.

The obvious fact is that you are just missing 2K meaty. It only has 2F active so it's not easy to time it. The foot animation however is longer than 2F that's why it might look like your feet are on her and wiffing. Hitting 2K meaty is though so I'm not surprised by the fact that you are mistiming it. I couldn't hit meaty 2K consistently if I even tried to. The gap between UP and IL is big enough for 2P hit between so it's legit tactics. It's not uncomming for good Sol players to hit 5K between because they can OS it so the risk is minimal for them. Even if you do UP wiff I find it slightly difficult to time so that you get throw and not delay It's Late. You can BDC stuff after UP/wiffed UP as well. There are alot of options and sometimes you have to do stuff like that endlessly to condition people. Any character that can chain 2P into itself will probably mash 2P vs dash mixups. I use it myself in mirrors. Using dash throw is my best solution against it.

What? Why would a meaty 2K wiff on Elphelt? You're saying her hitbox vanishes low on her first 1-2F frames after wakeup? Or that she somehow has lower body invul on 2P startup? Elph has no reversal options outside of overdrive, blitz and backdash like many other characters. Meatys are always free against her unless she does aformentioned. Sounds like you are playing against someone just mashing 2P all the time on oki. I'd suggest any meaty outside throw range. And if the person never uses throw you can just do meaty IL every oki to either CH or +1 on block

Her revolver chart/gatling table is really good with 2HS and shotgun stance. I mean 2HS alone is -2 and you can cancel into 2D/5D and 2D is jump cancel and special cancel... she can just be in your face and destroy you in neutral all together. The patch will make it slightly more bearable. The only thing Slayer has going for him in this matchup is abusing BDC/BDJC. You can more easily and safely escape shotgun stuff if you got good timing with backdashes. You can 6P air bridal but you have to have good sense of timing since it can beat out 6P due to the angle. The more you use it the easier it gets but be prepared to get nailed a lot in the beginning leading to good dmg for Elph.

I'd like to add that Bridal is super duper horrible for Slayer to deal with. I'm still upset by the fact the hitbox is low enough for 6P to not work. Would make a huge impact on the matchup. Wishful thinking. However like Drake already mentioned Bridal is fort the most part minus on block even so it can be difficult to deal with. Her 2P is 4F startup as well, doesn't make things easier. You also have BDC stuff as options. BDC Dandy, BDC Mappa, BDC Bite. BDJC IAD j.S(x), j.K works fairly well if they only use 2P mash after but c.S/f.S will blow you up.

Looking at frames if you play against Chip/Sol the only 2 characters with 3F normals that I know of you have 1F window for blowing it up. If they press on IL Startup 12F they'll get hit since it will trade on 15F. But you can still be grabbed on 14F (throw OS). And there are a number of characters with 4F normal like Ram, I-No, Elph, probably more. For these it's a 2F window and vs 5F normals it's 3F window. But in reality you can add 1F on each of these since if you trade it will always be in our favour. My point is just if you look at the raw data and crunch numbers it's actually not that big of a window that you actually "need" to hit. Though if the person you are playing know the first thing about Slayer and risk vs reward pressing buttons vs IL (except after blocked UP) is not a good idea.

Using 214P-S-S as they start to wake up could work for a small amount of specific characters. You also have to make the gap small enough to not get mashed out by fast normals. If they catch on that your timing is so off that they can do 5-7F normals before your It's Late active frames comes into play it's bad oki on your part. Better players tend to realize that this oki isn't meaty and thus attempt to hit buttons. Sol 5K comes to mind. I try to hit as late frames as possible. I even speed up It's Late to hit with active frames after a while but as soon as I get thrown I go back to startup frames again. For me as a player I don't like super hard reads as doing DoT in someone's face. If you are going to attempt to bait a throw you should at least do TK DHD instead. Both get's punished but DHD not as easily. And if you have 100% meter it's 200+ dmg if you hit (besides Faust+May). Also I have tried using Blitz to stop reversals, mainly against Sol, but yeah, it's a hard read so my results haven't paid off for obivously bad shoryu reads. Oh also if you wanna do hard read with overdrive I would even recommend EW over DoT since it has invul startup. Since DoT can be hit at the initial 7F startup. You can combo fine after raw EW in corner for a good chunk of dmg even without CH.

If you play well in neutral and have the meter to spend you can use YRC on oki or just at any point you'd think he'd use shoryu. The timing is rather impossible at that point to actually perform it and once he looses charge there's nothing he can do but wait again. It's worth knowing if you have knockdown and willing to spend the meter to "lock out" a shoryu and cluth a win.

You'll just have to learn how to perform it against all various characters since there is a 10F difference in wakeup times. Easiest and most common setups are after 2D and any air combo into j.D. You can delay It's Late cancel quite a bit if you recognize you did UP a bit too early. Once you get the hang of it you'll get a lot of IL CH for huge dmg. Against people who think it's okay to just mash throw on oki just because someone is close. And for SolAscension on 5D I just cancel into 5D from practically everything to check people. Since me and my opponents isn't anyone of the gg gods it hits more than it is blocked. You can just gatling into it form any move. c.S, 5D. c.S, f.S, 5D. 2K, 5D, 2K, c.S, 5D.

You can just do c.S, f.S vs Pot and Bedman otherwise. Then you'll get the same as on everyone else except you can't add j.2K, j.PD at the end so you'll get Throw, RC, c.S, f.S, j.SHD2K, j.K, dj.(K)SHD where as the extra K is optional. Depends if you delay j.D or whatnot. This is what I use for throw RC on the heavies atm anyway. Also for UP, c.S, f.S you can't get the ender because of the amount of hits at the beginning.

I most often do BDJC IAD j.K and hitting the j.K low so link into 5K is easier after landing. Obviously if your opponent figures out to deal with this you have to switch things up like BDSJC and use j.2K to alter your landing or whatnot. The footloose YRC thingy is just that if you input YRC while doing IAD Footlose like 66214K, P+S+HS and YRC at a certain point you retain all momentum right after YRC and fly fast over the whole screen. Yeah 5 is 'obvious' since 44 and 66 can't be done otherwise but your input is correct, 63214547HS.

Online session from yesterday. Was playing some various people so I cba to edit around highilghting etc so there's some need for scrolling around the clip. Also the Ky matches can be skipped, I think there is only 3 of them. vs I-No, Sin, Potemkin, Axl https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05Xc1AIglOo

What you want for your character and the vision ASW has are completely opposite of the universe. If they want to keep Slayer low tier they will. They probably feel rather happy about how he is. I prefer this cautious way of altering things rather than BlazBlue totally revamping every character with ever balance patch throwing the whole game off balance. They probably worked very hard with the initial balance and don't want to mess around too much. This is still GG so even with Slayer being bottom of the barrel he still could easily whip up wins if you are good enough. If you want easy mode there's still GG+R and S-tier Azrael in BB

Backdash, BDJC, FD to make people whiff moves of their blockstrings or force them to add dashing thus creating gaps. Also learning to use Blitz effectively has helped me in a lot of ways. But all in all a solid defense is really important. Some pressure is really hard to deal with for example Elphelt or Zato. That takes more matchup specific knowledge than just basics imo. At lower levels you can abuse the hell out of BDJC because most people don't know how to deal with it.

Just to explain it easily enough you cancel backdash and forward dash into a jump. But you can also perform a specal move before the jump comes out so you get the special instead of jump. So the easiest is backdash cancel to Mappa. Input is 44, 2147K. So you get a backdash but the mappa comes out before the full 28F of the backdash. You wait for Xrd 1.1! No but seriously that question should be discussed in the matchup specific forums.

Should be and is are two different things! The pushback in Xrd is pretty severe so you'd never know. It's worth questioning. You have less advantage when hitting standing characters? I'm not good with all the system mechanical data thingys so I since I can't explain why it would be harder to link. I've been told you have +2F advantage when hitting crouchers and I know for a fact it's easier to link stuff such as f.S, 5K on crouchers but the data behind it I'm not good at.

Great minds thinks alike no? I'd just assume the link would be harder but if it's still do-able and isn't 1F. I'd also think meaty IL, 2K, 2D should work on everyone with maybe a few exceptions. But I don't really know if anyone has that weird of a hitbox standing? Crouching I know but yeah... even with the IL loss you could essentially do UP wiff, 6K instead now. If you can combo from it that is. But you are missing out on CH IL. For the level Hase and Taka plays at I can see meaty IL doesn't force crouche makes more a difference than US/EU scrub level ^^;

I don't see why It's Late not forcing crouch is a huge issue. Even if they are standing and you do meaty IL to 2K link you should be close enough to hit 2K, 2D on every character. And if you RC IL you should go to CWH midscreen and 6D in the corner anyways. So maybe I'm missing something? Less advantage on hit? As long as it's still +1 on normal block. CH P PB midscreen then or in corner as well? Sounds weird that you'd wont even get anything in the corner since you are somewhat forced to use P PB to make call outs. I'd even settle for a dmg loss just so I get a combo and oki.