chzchan

Is it really because of the easier execution that this will be more possible? Did they make the D projectile faster like the regular projectile?

Oh man, I remember watching this as well. Usually have a bunch of Tsubaki videos in pinned tabs that open whenever I open my browser and this is one of them that I have kept open for the longest time. I could have just watched the video again. I really hope that the 6A change will turn into something that is combo efficient, but I really doubt it. Is that because of the jumping attack proration changes?

Probably should have tested it in training mode first, huh. Neutral air tech into block has happened at least 80% of the time online, so I never experienced a forward air tech after doing it. Does 2C > fireball leave them high enough in the air to allow for air teching? I'd turn on the PS3 right now to check myself, but my roommate is sleeping.

Just recently I began cycling through different corner ball oki enders, and, though the j.236A one is the one I had been relying on the most, I have found myself using one that I used to just throw in for fun much more often. After the 22B in the corner, it would be the usual 5D > 5C > 2CC, but instead of jumping, I'd just throw out a ground fireball right there. Of course it loses to delayed techs, but it catches the hell out of neutral air techs and it just feels a lot safer, especially when going in for a command grab right as they touch down if they blocked. I wonder if anything will change with 1.1's faster ground fireball.

What do you think it should have done?

So like not getting magnetized or not getting cornered by Wolf Mixup™? Oh and after reading I realize now that if a Mu never decides to go on the offensive and you haven't dealt a sufficient amount of damage, you lose. I have only run into a few of them online that actually try to win using the round timer like the one I described earlier, but when it does happen I want to rip my hair out.

Just had a fun fun fun match where the Mu just sat on the other side of the screen and spammed D. What do you do against this if you have no charge? I had to look for tiny gaps probably created by latency where I could charge for a split second until I hit 2 stocks. I got a nice 4[6]D > 236D counterhit, but they just bursted and I ended up in the same position again and they spammed D until my health was just below theirs when the timer ran out. I even cycled between barrier and regular guarding to try and prolong my demise, but nope. What do you do in this situation?

But is that the reason why it was given the faster recovery? Just so if you're in Overdrive and you aren't doing a combo, you have slightly safer pressure? I want to understand it from the developer's point of view. I just want to think of situations where it would come in handy that don't involve a respective mistake during a combo that causes it to drop or using it as a reversal. I just don't see the extra pressure potential as something that warrants it being used just for that. It seems more like a thing on the side that's there, but isn't the main reason why you would use it.

I have been wondering for a while, but what is the purpose of 5D/2D/j.D having faster recovery in Overdrive? It can't be just for that one challenge CH combo.

Oh no this isn't something to rely on at all. Not a trump card or anything. Just something you can throw in if it feels right. Just another part of her sort of crappy arsenal. I guess I shouldn't have used "familiar with the matchup". That isn't exactly what I was going for. It's like if they expect you to do things, like finishing combos a certain general way. I don't exactly know how to explain it. It's like using their predictions and expectations against them to hopefully mess up their reaction time.

I've been able to use it against higher level people online, but I really doubt that means anything. I would never recommend using this in, lets say, an official tournament. I did state my worry about the impracticality. You still have time to charge after ending with a grab. You just don't get the benefit of increased charge rate, but I'd gladly give that up for damage. Oh and the irregular ender thing I guess ties in with the TRM prediction fun stuff I was talking about at the bottom. The only difference is that you just wouldn't go for an initial purple grab and instead IAD after 5C > 2CC or 6CC. See, I've been looking at this from a different perspective though. I like to gamble, so I don't mind not having guaranteed damage. As long as the possibility of something exists, I want to take advantage of it even though there is not a 100% chance of it happening. For example, using Tsubaki's overhead against anyone and not getting grab/5A mashed out of, or trying to land a hit on Azrael without trading hits every single time. Again, this is something I'd use maybe once or not even at all during a fight, usually in the heat of battle after doing a fair amount of pretty similar looking combos. Definitely not something to use at the beginning of a fight unless you think your opponent is familiar with the Tsubaki matchup.

Been screwing around with mid-combo purple grabs and rapids recently. These are all really really dirty, but they seem to work so long as you don't use them too often. Actually, these are more of one-time-use tricks. I'll just throw out a few examples because I am still incredibly unsure about the practicality of these combos in terms of bang for your buck and there are a ton of them. [No special requirements] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4048 DM] [29% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.214X [3975 DM] [28% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC {> 236C > 214B > 22B(w)} [3877 {3986} DM] [27% {28%} HG] Air knockback ender to create space Air knockdown ender if you really want to SMP on 214B in the optional ground ender causes air tech to happen fairly close to the ground If your opponent is prone to neutral air teching, you can dash into a grab or a command grab after 22B(w) because of how close to them you end up If they air tech backwards or forwards, you can attempt for an IAD grab in whatever direction they choose to go, but you will most likely not be fast enough If used in the corner, backwards air tech no longer becomes a problem and neutral air tech into a grab no longer requires a dash, but forward air tech will leave you vulnerable if they have good crossup attacks If they choose not to air tech, you'll just have to deal with whatever they end up doing on the ground Ending simply with 6CC will leave you with more time to react to the direction your opponent decides to air tech at the loss of some damage and the effectiveness of neutral air tech grabbing because the distance between where the tech happens and the ground is larger without the 236C > 214B and it isn't as misleading if you have conditioned them to expect the full 236X >214B >22B to happen all the time. Grab > 214B(delay) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4156 DM] [29% HG] Air Grab > 6CC > 214B > 22B(w) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4612 DM] [33% HG] Ground enders don't work for either Regular grab starter might require an air dash after 2CC depending on how well timed the 214B(delay) was Adding the mid-combo purple grab to the old reliable chargeless air grab combo adds on a whopping 1200 damage and 9% heat gain [Air Grab] > 6CC > 214B > 22B(w) > 5C > 2CC > j.CC > j.236A > j.214A [3380 DM] [24% HG] [Corner] 5CC > 623C > j.214A(delay) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > 214X [4552 DM] [32% HG] 5CC > 623C > j.214A(delay) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4522 {4457} DM] [32% {32%} HG] Distance between the ground and where an air tech can happen if you do 22B(w) is so small that every air tech option they have will leave you in a position to grab or command grab without even having to dash. Starting with anything other than 5CC will just reduce the total damage and heat gain by a bit Starting with 5A/2A will make any followup after 6CC whiff Doing any gatling combo with more hits than 5BB > 5CC will cause the air tech window to be as early as the previously mentioned 6A starter combo 5CC > 236B > 214B > 22B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4194 DM] [30% HG] 5CC > 236B > 214B > 22B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.214X [4134 DM] [29% HG] Ground ender air tech window too early to take advantage of [1 charge] 5CC > 236B > 214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4492 DM] [32% HG] 5CC > 236B > 214D > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4332 {4273} DM] [31% {30%} HG] 5CC > 236B > 214B > 22D > 6CC > Air Grab > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4366 DM] [31% HG] 5CC > 623C > 236D > 214B(w) > 2B > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.236A > j.214X [4475 DM] [32% HG] 5CC > 623C > 236D > 214B(w) > 2B > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.214X [4371 DM] [31% HG] 5CC > 623C > 236D > 214B(w) > 2B > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4431 {4366} DM] [31% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4406 DM] [31% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214D > 2CC > j.CC(IAD) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4453 DM] [31% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2C > 236D > 5C(dash) > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4294 DM] [30% HG] Grab > 22D(full) > 6CC > Air Grab > 6B > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4535 DM] [32% HG] [1 charge + Corner] 5CC > 623C > j.214D > 5C > 2CC > 236C > 5A > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236B > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4824 {4795} DM] [34% HG] 5CC > 623C > j.214D > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab [5175 DM] [37% HG] Not really too much you can do after the air grab in the second version because of SMP, but it does a bunch of damage I guess you can try to put out a fireball right after hitting the ground when the air grab ends to catch rolls or something 5CC > 22D > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [5185 DM] [37% HG] [2 charges] 5CC > 623C > j.214D(delay) > 236D > 5C(dash) > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4951 {4894} DM] [35% {34%} HG] 5CC > 623C > j.214D(delay) > 236D > 5C(dash) > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.214X [4934 DM] [35% HG] 5CC > 22D > 236D > 5C(dash) > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4786 {4713} DM] [34% {33%} HG] 5CC > 22D > 236D > 5C(dash) > 2C > 214B > 5C >2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4993 DM] [35% HG] 5CC > 22D > 236D > 5C(dash) > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4720 DM] [34% HG] Dash 5C will whiff if not done from at least absolute center midscreen because of no cornerbounce from 236D after 22D 5CC > 236D > 214D > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4906 {4883} DM] [35% {34%} HG] 5CC > 236D > 214D > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.214X [4840 DM] [34% HG] 5CC > 236D > 214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [5113 DM] [36% HG] 5CC > 623C > j.236D > j.214D > 2CC(dash) > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B{(w)} [4941 {4863} DM] [35% {34%} HG] 5CC > 623C > j.236D > j.214D > 2CC(dash) > Air Grab > 6CC > j.CC > j.214X [4827 {4863} DM] [34% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > [4]6D > 236D > 6CC > 214B > 22B(w) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [5063 DM] [36% HG] 6A > 5CC > 6BB > [4]6D > 236D > 214B(delay) > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4732 DM] [33% HG] [2 charges + Corner] 5CC > 623C > j.214D > 6CC > 22D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab [5325 DM] [38% HG] 5CC > 22D > 6CC > 623C > j.214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab [5350 DM] [38% HG] 5CC > 623C > j.214D > 6CC > 214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab [5391 DM] [38% HG] Fireball is best option once again 5CC > 22D > 6CC > 214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [5416 DM] [38% HG] [50% heat] 5CC > 236B > 214B > Rapid > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B(w) [3664 DM] [16% HG] 5CC > 236B > 214B > Rapid > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [3774 DM] [16% HG] 5CC > 623C > Rapid > Air Grab(dash) > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B [3868 DM] [17% HG] 5CC > 623C > Rapid > Air Grab(dash) > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [3992 DM] [16% HG] 3CC > Rapid > Air Grab > 6CC > 214B > 22B(w) > 5C > 2CC > j.CC > j.236A > j.214X [4213 DM] [18% HG] This one gets reacted to quite often so use it with caution 3C > Rapid > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B(w) [4025 DM] [14% HG] 3C > Rapid > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4145 DM] [15% HG] 623C > Rapid > Air Grab > 6CC > 236C > 214B > 22B [2981 DM] [10% HG] 623C > Rapid > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214A [3023 DM] [10% HG] Straight out of a successful DP, this series works pretty reliably for some reason Great for when you are lacking charge or optimal screen positioning [50% heat + 1 charge] 3C > Rapid > 214D > 5C > 2C > 214B > 5C > 2CC > Air Grab > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214X [4830 DM] [22% HG] There are actually a lot more of these "dirty combos" I could list, but I am much too lazy to do that. These really come in handy sometimes, but it makes me feel strange that I have to resort to using these cheap tricks in some matches in order to do big boy damage. I guess that's just Tsubaki, though. Fun thing you can do if you actually get one of these off in a match is just never use them again. If your opponent anticipates that you will go for a purple air grab after, lets say, 5C > 2CC or 6CC, just drop the combo right there and they will more than likely be in a Throw Reject Miss state so you can grab them when they hit the ground.

That was beautiful.

Recently, when I have tried to go into the 2BB sliding crossup after ending with 214B or 214B > 22B(w) I have been getting grabbed out of it. Does this really lose to grab mashing or am I just going in too late?

Man I feel bad for Kuresu. That Kagura DP spam is just terrible because it actually works.

Just learn a few of the simple charge-less combos you can do depending on what move you land and then learn the corner oki combo with j.236A. Learn the 1 charge 5B/5CC > 22D > 6C > CT corner combo because of how little resources it requires for the damage you get. Maybe learn a counter hit 1 charge mugen combo for punishment. Don't focus too much on combos, though. Learning short, safe blockstrings and how to alternate them while incorporating charge cancels is way more important because all the combos are meaningless if you never get to use them. Not doing the same set of attacks in a predictable order can take some getting used to if you say that auto piloting is your problem. You should also take advantage of being able to delay follow-ups like 5CC and 5BB for use as frame traps. But, you really need to fix your auto piloting in order to implement the frame traps because it requires conditioning of your opponent to expect certain things from you. Like if you charge cancel after 5B during a simple 5A > 5B twice at the beginning of a round, you should try 5B > Delay 5BB to catch them when they try to attack you thinking you will charge cancel. Get an early start on learning some frame data so you can know when it is safe to attack and which attacks you will be able to use. Also, learn where you can throw your command grab into the mix because the 2 charges it nets you are incredibly helpful. Good luck subbing Izayoi, though. You're going to have an incredibly difficult time playing her.

They could have made her acorn a command move instead of going with the percentage chance of it appearing as an alternate taunt. Pretty sure it could be put to practical use in some way.

Yeah there's that, so it really really doesn't work on attentive players or players that already know that 22D max charge guard crushes in mugen. I just really want to make something out of it. It is one of the tools in her arsenal after all.

Just screwing around with 5 charges and 50 heat; if you get a successful guard break every time after the initial, you can do three independent 6C > [4]6D > 236D > 22D [max] which net about 2172 damage each. Then you end with 6C > 6CC > 214B > 5C > 2C > 2CC > jc > j.C > j.CC > j.236A > j.214B which does 2706. This is not already counting the initial CH 5C > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D > 22D [max]. So that's 2990 from the initial CH, 2172 x 3 from the three independent guard crush setups, and 2706 from the ending charge-less combo. That's 12212 damage from five independent combos that seemingly string together. I mean, the chance of having 5 charges and getting a counter hit while having 50 heat are incredibly slim, but this seems pretty fun. It requires them to wakeup from the stagger four times in a row, though, so I really don't think this will work on attentive people. Then there's the ability to just burst out of it as well. Imagine doing this while in Overdrive, though. Hell, there's enough time to go into overdrive safely before going into 6C after the first guard crush. Oh boy, I wonder how many more setups I can fit when at 50% health. Gotta figure out some use for it I guess.

Welp, guess I gotta throw all that out the window. Still, I really want to make some sort of practical use out of 421D > 236D > 22D [max] guard crush setup on the ground while in mugen, especially because of the 1.1 adjustment. Back to the training room I guess.

Just recently discovered something about the knockback properties of j.214X after j.236A. So normally there would be the choice between using j.236A > j.214X or j.214X alone to end an air combo because the former blasts your opponent across the screen while the latter grounds them and leaves you right in front of them so that you can continue the pressure. This is because the j.214X has different attributes when it is used to follow up j.236A (or 623C) Now if, instead those two options, you decide to use a lone j.236A, you will go into this falling arc backward on your way back to the ground. You can choose to hold D for some nice and unsafe charging as you descend, or you can actually choose to use a delayed j.214X. The discovery I made, while seemingly impractical, has to do with this delaying of j.214X. Apparently, even if you delay the j.214X, the move itself retains the follow up attributes of knocking your opponent flying even if j.236A was not part of the combo. So this is where it seems to get a bit impractical. See, what you're able to do with this is end an air combo with j.236A and then delay the j.236X until you see what they choose for their wakeup. If they decide with neutral or forward, then you get to take advantage of j.214X's active frames until landing to either catch the roll or hit them right at the end of the neutral. If they roll backwards, then you just appear either right in front of them or right behind them depending on what you want. See, this is pretty ballsy because the j.214 series is like super negative on block, but the beauty of this is that you don't really need to predict which tech they will use because you can make your decision the moment you see your opponent make theirs. This decision is, of course, whether to use A, B, or C. C is usually the choice for neutral or backward with B or A being mainly for forward. At midscreen or if you have your back to the wall, getting the hit with this will get you not much more than the 1000 damage that any of the j.214 series follow ups do and about a screen length of space between you and your opponent so you can charge, but if you are in the corner everything changes. See, all the non-D j.214 series follow ups actually share the same P1 and P2 values which actually make them pretty good combo starters. If you land this in the corner, you have to use a rapid, but the combos you can pull off actually net you a good amount of damage depending on how many install stocks you have. j.214X [follow up] > RC > 2C > 2CC > 236C > 5A > 5C > 2C > 236A > 214B > 22B for ~2.8k Actually, it really isn't worth it if you don't have at least 1 stock. j.214X [follow up] > RC > 2C > 2CC > jc > j.C > jCC > j.214D > 6C > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.236B for ~3.2k j.214X [follow up] > RC > 2C > 2CC > jc > j.C > jCC > j.214D > 6C > CT > 5C > 2C > 2CC > jc > j.C > j.CC > j.236A > j.214B for ~3.8k Haven't done enough testing yet, but there are more combos.

Have been trying out some minimum resource Mugen combos recently without doing the second [4]6D 236D because it's going away in 1.1 because of the SMP nerf. The good old reliable midscreen CH Mugen combo that only required 1 charge but netted 5.6k-6k damage depending on the starter needed the double [4]6D > 236D in order to work. CH 5C > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D [x2] > 5C > 5CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214B for 6018 CH 5B > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D [x2] > 5C > 5CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214B for 5593 I think I have a workaround, though it is fairly unreliable. It takes advantage of the guard crush property of a fully charged 22D while in mugen, so I'm sure this won't be very astounding to many of you. I say it is unreliable because I am still unsure if it is possible to barrier guard on wakeup from being in a stagger state. It will actually be a bit more reliable than it is right now because of the change to 22D in 1.1 so that it retains its guard crush properties so long as it was started in mugen even if the install meter is empty and mugen ends. CH 5C > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D > 22D [max] > Guard Crush > 6C > 6CC > 214B > 5C > 2C > 2CC > jc > j.C > j.CC > j.236A > j.214B for 2990 + 2706 = 5696 CH 5B > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D > 22D [max] > Guard Crush > 6C > 6CC > 214B > 5C > 2C > 2CC > jc > j.C > j.CC > j.236A > j.214B for 2735 + 2706 = 5441 So the combo can go one of two ways, you can either get the guard break and go crazy with whatever no charge combo you have or continue with a blue combo if they choose not to recover. Even the blue combos do a considerable amount of damage. CH 5C > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D > 22D [max] > 6C > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214B for 5918 CH 5B > 6C > Mugen > [4]6D > 236D > 22D [max] > 6C > 6CC > 623C > j.236A > j.214B for 5499 Of course, in 1.1, the [4]6D inputs will be replaced with 421D. These two part multi-path guard crush combos are pretty fun. Makes me want to come up with more of them.

Kuresu (TS) vs 8C (PT) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HcZdtQN3Xo at 2:30

Jesus. How much faster did they make her GA dash accelerate?

Oh golly that new 236236D OD ender.