Dirty Magic

Yeah, you're probably right. Idk if it is the perfectionist nature in me or what, but I do this for all characters I play Dx . "What? That Hazama/Noel combo can't be the best, it lacks microdashes and so and so", "Why would I use a 66C 623B route with Seth off a standing 5A confirm when I can go into his 6C j.236B j.214A route?". I guess I just worry about doing something obsolete or less effective to the point of pushing too hard. I think it's because I love the hard stuff and execution isn't a concern, so I skip past the basic or intermediate junk and go all in too much.

I've seen that, it's defn good for getting basic cover for various situations but I'm hoping for something a little more in-depth. Just trying to 1-up my game, but tyvm for the link regardless ^^

So I'm not sure if it's laziness on my part, but why is it some players seem to switch up their combos so much? Like, I understand in some cases with hurtboxes and the floatiness of the character one might opt to do j.P j.H instead of j.S j.H, or even omit a j.S before j.D IAD; but I haven't learned the rhyme and reason. I'm basically going through and while watching Nakamura and Woshige play am writing down every combo confirm they do to see what the overall pattern is; but it's pretty tiring. It seems like in the corner they like to omit j.S before j.D after landing disc mixup, always jumping back to do j.D for likely a meatier or more advantageous disc/SG setup, but I was wondering if there was already a character list or writeup expressing optimal or 'best' confirms to use. Between midscreen and corner, character and starter specific, I'm feeling a little daunted trying to figure this out on my own... Who knows maybe I'm overthinking it. Like it seems midscreen vs Venom a j.P j.H ender is used, but between adding j.K's to pop opponent's up higher, omitting moves, different starters, and changing enders I'm just getting a little confused on what works and what works better. Just hoping to optimize or up my game. Hope I portrayed my question decently enough >< Thanks.

Heya, idk if the chat is still going but I would appreciate being added! mumbles_and_incoherent_sounds is my skype.

You need to work on your notation, you're even confusing yourself hahahah. It's important too, because besides many people disliking SF4's weird notation (Being harder to read and not being universally effective), f.S means something COMPLETELY different from f.MP in SF. Anyways, 5K is great as a meaty tool, I tend to abuse it on wakeups. It's 9 frames active, so borderline impossible to mess up, and will stuff opponents trying to throw often. Of course if you do it point blank and your opponent nails the 1f window you're hooped, but I have only been grabbed roughly 1/100 times on face to face wakeup. It also sets up frame traps, easy confirms into knockdown, other setups, and great/easy damage. 5K (c.S) 2S -> stuff. However it is a slower start up, so really it's best used with oki imo. 2P is our go-to poke. 5P whiffs on crouchers so that essentially kills it's use. I 5P as an AA and if my opponent is airborne.

I don't suppose you'd know the frame gap offhand hey Luna? The wiki shows overall frame advantage but between cancelling 5H into Digitalis I don't know what exactly I can/cannot bait. Also stagger pressure feels easier to disrespect than BB, it's mildly upsetting. I'll have to play around more, I figured using 2P might be better since it's +2 as opposed to +1 but I lose the low, so I'm trying to gauge its use but I'm not optimistic. Almost feels like using the P button is a lot cause save situational use mostly reserved for 6P.

So what do you guys do for frame traps? A lot of people get button happy online, especially vs Millia so I'm trying to force respect. Also any chance 2P could be useful for stagger pressure or is it too easy to be disrespected with throw?

Not afaik, you just have to maths it. http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Millia_Frame_Data_(GGXRD) Just posting the link for posting it's sake, best bet is to lab it out and share findings.

I thought that CH combo was like, one of Sin's first trials. Positive I've seen it, but too lazy to check right now. Still I guess between BLEED and JT we have to pick what we can get, it'll be exciting to see a Sin player pull ahead and take dominance.

It still has it's uses, but that's why FAB always does double HFB to close the distance instead.

It's actually unsafe on /hit/, but he can cancel it into specials so it's essentially safe. Still, he has to drop some calories to make it work.

I'm bad with him so no hahahah, still trying to refine my pressure.

Hahahah! Seriously? The low version is that bad on block? Must try it out, wow. To think I was wasting YRC to fly across the screen.

hi hi! Figures, I was getting on a guy's case for using abc, and now here he's got me doing it rofl. Hmm, it's strange because I have stood point blank next to my opponent and I know they've tried to throw but my 5K have gotten them everytime... *shrug*. Thanks for your feedback. New question, what is the best way to deal with Axl? He doesn't seem that bad but I feel like I'm likely missing out on easy punishes or tools to use vs him. I just do the usual make my way in cautiously, slidehead if he gets cheeky with Sparrowhawk, HFB, ICPM yrc, et cetera.

Mm yeah, so just meaty with it. Also I have never seen anyone successfully backdash my 5K, I thought they'd get caught in the active frames, but I'm not sure how the wakeup window works I suppose. I mean heck I don't even get grabbed =S Hmm, I'll defn give that a try thanks. This will sound silly, but if I get the j.B hit what should I lead into? Assuming 6K stuffs corner, and probably a short confirm into heat knuckle mid? Also I read earlier that if it gets blocked I should just go into 2A, so I could do 2A 2S 6K frame trap stuffs.

Thanks for the reply! "- Safe jump j.S is really solid, you can use it off a bunch of knockdowns but the timing changes on every character. Really obvious ones are off Buster (you can superjump off that one) and Slidehead (you've got all the time in the world). 2D you use a normal jump, I don't recall if it's 100% safe on everyone or not. Hard knockdown Heat Extend in the corner you get a normal jump setup IIRC." Okay but what is the timing and the like? Buster 29 at the earliest second falling j.B at the last second? Am I just trying to meaty time it by feel? Because I've imitated it but I've been beaten out so I figured maybe there was a visual or timing cue I wasn't using. "- 5K stuffs things really well, but they can reversal backdash or DP or super or whatever to beat it. It's not a bad option but be aware of it's limitations." Reversal backdash? Are they invincible from frame 0? Doesn't seem like that should/could work to me but perhaps I'm ignorant of something. For some reason I didn't get a reply notification, I thought I was following this thread after I made a post in it =[ Anyways thanks for the help, still working on 6K loops but the YRC stuff I seem to have added to my deck. Trishula pls

So I'm a new Potemkin player, and I'm in love. Watching FAB is disgusting, his playstyle is right up my alley and I've already got quite a few notes added. However, I feel like I might be missing some simple key elements in my game that would tighten things up. I have more or less read every post in this thread, although perhaps I missed some info. -I'm unaware of his safejump setups. I've seen FAB do jumps and strangely enough superjumps into a falling j.B ~ stuff; but I'm not sure of where of what it works. -Mostly off of 2D I've been doing meaty 5K and either I get away with murder or it stuffs everything including grabs (sans reversals). -So past setups, 2-3 OS', and misc tech is there anything I should always be doing in regards to Oki or pressure? FAB seems to use something like 2A 2S 6K, which seems to be a frame trap and gap closer. -Is Trishula useful for anything besides Trish YRC? Likely something very situational to warrant using it (Like Ky VT bait)? It's a cool move but it'd be disappointing if it had little utility in place of other moves or options. -Also... What does I.C.P.M stand for Dx Instant Crazy Potemkin Murder? Thanks!

Mmm, what she said is right it does not matter if you hold 6 after 2366 or not, but you MUST /not/ input 236~66. You will get 6HS. 236 tap~6. It's actually pretty lenient, you can under and over perform it, but adding a third forward input will kill it. It's temping, because it's like (Oh why don't I just dash after). But now, it has to be spot on, mess around with it.

Instead of jumping forward try neutral or back.

So who are good Sins to watch in general? Anyone making waves with him?

Yeah, my style is similar, but with the shaft between the fingers I can roll the stick very fast. My hand is relaxed so it's not committed to any position and it gives a lot of free movement. I can also put pressure or restm y hand weight on my pinky, which gives a foundation or anchor to put pressure off of with the other fingers.

I found the most success with having the shaft between my pinky and ring finger. I like it because all I need to do is flick my wrist for left inputs and I can use my fingers for right inputs.

Oh hey I didn't know that part. Yeah it's like Astral from BlazBlue in a sense, atleast if you want a proper IK. Otherwise it's usually just trolling or meter waste to try anything beforehand. That and trying to legitimately combo into IK will be a feat in itself. You'll also know if you have the freeze because the otherwise red 'flames' that exude from your character will be gold in colour.

So not sure if we have a list for IK combos, but one easy confirm is 6K 236S RC IK in the corner. If you already have disc oki and hit with your high/low you can confirm into it as well. Super fun, ez pz. Not sure what you could do midscreen past grab or a full proper combo, but I'm not worried otherwise.

236K 236HS would cost 3k calories.