Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 yea, try not to 3c 3c, and 236A is ok, not all that quick, good in combo to some exstent but most commonly is a waste of a hit. but yea, 3c is not good for oki, if you get hit it puts you in crouch and it has 30 frames of recovery best to do a j.C really close to the ground if you can.
A.X.I.S. Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 yea, try not to 3c 3c, and 236A is ok, not all that quick, good in combo to some exstent but most commonly is a waste of a hit. but yea, 3c is not good for oki, if you get hit it puts you in crouch and it has 30 frames of recovery best to do a j.C really close to the ground if you can. noted, i still use it for hitting max range.
MisoSowee Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 people don't always block low on wake up Why wouldn't they? Are they gonna block high? Overheads are NOT that fast in this game. They block, they punish. just tip them with it, what they are gonna do? jump? they get hit before they can, No, they're gonna block low and punish you. they try to use a DP, your too far, if they block low (lol) IB or no free punish, that shit is so free, but only at max range, any other spot and its stupid. 3c is not too far that DP's won't hit, last time I checked. Though it'd depend on which one. I don't use 3c enough so if you're positive of it then whatever. 6B has slow start up and your risking a DP and its minus 1,000 frames on block meaning wasting meter to make it safe lets not go further on that lol. 6b is start-up 13 and -9 on block. 3c is 9f and -16 on block. Math pwease. Oh and 6b is anti-low, if you didn't know. not saying 6B is a bad move but why use it when your job is not even getting that close in the first place, i only wanna get that close if i'm gonna throw. Did you even read my comment? I'm talking about using 6b as an anti-mash, or to stuff predictable lows during a guard string. Sorry if I come off rude, I'm just doing this stupid long (113 question!!!) biology study guide and I'm annoyed :\
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 No, you don't seem all that rude, but 6B isn't to great either, although it is a critical counter it has a lot of proration, along with the fact that you have to be really close. I really suggest that you end combos with blast away moves (214B, j.2C, 632146C, 236A wall bounce > 6C) and be aggressive on wake-up by throwing j.C really close to the ground, and hold 1 so that when you land it cancels the move and you block there shorys or whatever they throw. if it lands you just j.C > 5C > 623AA > jc > falling j.C > land > 2C > hjc > j.2C > airdash > j.C
MisoSowee Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 That's true. I guess both moves have their merits. Though I think we agree 3c on oki would be super situational :x And is the aggression really working for you? In that situation I'd float around the knock down'd body pretending to be aggressive and just IAD backwards/play "jump footsies" Oh the meter :3
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 that's really not a good idea, cause your giving your opponent the upper hand again, and the chance to do whatever he wants. most chars... well all char, do much better than hakumen from a far range and can get in close, much easier than him. so you should try to stay close.
MisoSowee Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 But at the same time them coming to you; isn't that just getting close? Sure they have somewhat a battleplan, but I can catch careless aerial entrances with 6a/throw/early j.C whatever. It probably is better to try to be aggressive. One question though, if they block the j.C what do you go into?
A.X.I.S. Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 people don't always block low on wake up Why wouldn't they? Are they gonna block high? Overheads are NOT that fast in this game. They block, they punish. depends on the character, sometimes i get punished sometimes i don't lol. just tip them with it, what they are gonna do? jump? they get hit before they can, No, they're gonna block low and punish you. they try to use a DP, your too far, if they block low (lol) IB or no free punish, that shit is so free, but only at max range, any other spot and its stupid. 3c is not too far that DP's won't hit, last time I checked. Though it'd depend on which one. I don't use 3c enough so if you're positive of it then whatever. 6B has slow start up and your risking a DP and its minus 1,000 frames on block meaning wasting meter to make it safe lets not go further on that lol. 6b is start-up 13 and -9 on block. 3c is 9f and -16 on block. Math pwease. Oh and 6b is anti-low, if you didn't know. wait isn't 6B a low hit so how is it a overhead? only ground overhead haku has is zantetsu. not saying 6B is a bad move but why use it when your job is not even getting that close in the first place, i only wanna get that close if i'm gonna throw. Did you even read my comment? I'm talking about using 6b as an anti-mash, or to stuff predictable lows during a guard string. wouldn't it be better to counter in that case if your blocking i mean if your blocking assuming what your saying then using 6B isn't all that good unless it has frame one invul to lows, if you mean while you poke then i just rather use 2B as my low it doesn't fuck me in my ass on block. Sorry if I come off rude, I'm just doing this stupid long (113 question!!!) biology study guide and I'm annoyed :\ its a debate i really don't mind the rudeness i'm only here to learn anyways. yo leonil whats a good way to build meter while aggressive.
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 pressure sting 6A 6B 623AA jc barrier block, and play off of reaction from there. my main plan with haku is to break barrier and do max damage 3 stars or less combos, because haku doesn't benefit from combos with more. with the exception of a 6C shippu. IB, IB, IB, and IB. also it doesn't take that much meter to dish out 3700+ combos with hakumen. just make every hit count with combos like any thing 236A 623AA or go straight to 623AA if you can. Also, it not about gaining the meter, it's about managing it. the best combos use 3 or less mag and do over 300 damage. Note: j.C land 6A 6B 623AA is a real block string, and moves the libra a lot, also people get inpatient when they are being pressured by haku since he only has like 2 block stings, they try to jump, backdash, shory, and about any other thing you can think of, since this is his only gattling it can also be combo-ed at any point. j.C > 5C > 623AA combo 6A > 623AA combo ( i use 6A for tech traps and mix up instead) 6B > 623AA combo 623AA combo
MisoSowee Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 6b is a low, but it's also anti-low attribute. It'll do whiff circles if you get attacked by a low. Kinda like how anti-airs will beat out all air attacks, because it's anti-head/air attribute. And yeah 2d would work, but if you're being baited 6b is slightly safer because they'll just block it. In no way am I saying it's foolproof: you have other options. I just mean to say it's much better than 3c. (and if you're at a time where 2b is guaranteed, just use 3c because it's the same start-up.)
Slayer Alucard Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 623AA jump cancel on block is an awful spot to be in, even while barriering imo. If you can't react fast, then you eat an air throw. You'll be taking pressure too if you're blocking. Even using 623AA during block strings is a bad choice to me.
MisoSowee Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 It's not perfect, but if you've conditioned 'em to jump at you for an airthrow, throwing out an early j.C will stuff it. Or you could TK a hotaru for j.2c loop. Though just doing it vanilla without any before-thought is less desirable. Sometimes I won't jump cancel at all just to see what would happen for kicks. (I get mashed on a lot if I catch myself on ranked lol)
mAc Chaos Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 623AA jump cancel on block is an awful spot to be in, even while barriering imo. If you can't react fast, then you eat an air throw. You'll be taking pressure too if you're blocking. Even using 623AA during block strings is a bad choice to me. I know what you mean. I tried it on my brother once and without him ever seeing it before he just jumped up and air threw me. I was surprised, but liked it. However, what I noticed is that with most people, they try to mash out or think you're done after the 623AA gets blocked and end up getting hit. It seems more like a psychological thing.
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 i think the 3C oki vs 6B oki is stupid cause there both really bad, if you wanna oki game, j.C close to the gound and mix up j.C land 6B 41236C > anything j.C land 5B 2147C > what i like to do 2147C > 2B > 236A > step forward > 5C > 236A > 6C
Slayer Alucard Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 I occasionally try 214B right a little bit after 236AA, and it works often enough. I don't like doing that though unless I'm near a corner. Hotaru after the jump cancel could work, but I'd rather not use that meter and then have it all be blocked. I just feel safer on the ground, considering that's where all the 66/TK specials happen :P
mAc Chaos Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 I occasionally try 214B right a little bit after 236AA, and it works often enough. I don't like doing that though unless I'm near a corner. Hotaru after the jump cancel could work, but I'd rather not use that meter and then have it all be blocked. I just feel safer on the ground, considering that's where all the 66/TK specials happen :P Oh, I love doing that! Leonil said it was tricky. Half the time they end up just getting hit by the 623AA and I just 214B the air though.
Slayer Alucard Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 How often does j.C land 5B 2147C work? I'd imagine the 5B just whiffing or be too far if they crouch (although you could just go straight into overhead if they're turtley after j.C). I could see it working on big guys though.
Slayer Alucard Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 Oh, I love doing that! Leonil said it was tricky. Half the time they end up just getting hit by the 623AA and I just 214B the air though. That's why you can wait a little. The slight pause in between the specials makes them hesitate too.
A.X.I.S. Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 hey can 623A~A>jc>djc>cross-up work or haku is just too slow.
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 lol you said eat an air throw, like you can't tech those, but yea thats just the way i run my pressure game. and on the way up i throw j.A cause on counter hit you can raising j.A CH > j.C > land > 2C > hjc > j.2C > airdash > j.2C
Sophisticat Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 it's a 9 frame start-up with good range, shory punish. An do you remember what i sent to you miso, 3C noels that run in and throw anti airs, always land counter hit. Oh, as for 5A counter hit 5A hjc j.A j.B jc j.2C best no mag or 5A jump installed j.214B land 2C hjc j.2C airdash j.2C I've never land 3C CH > 5C Awesome, I'll work on these. H_Knight19, i was watching some of your vids, you need to learn you limits and learn better combos. here's a list i helped out with, http://s1.zetaboards.com/blazblue/pages/hakumencombo/ Oh, don't take anything uploaded before the december vids too seriously. I got a lot better since the october stuff. The most I blow now is [Whatever] -> renka (1) -> Zan -> Gurren -> 6c, supposing I'm not in the corner. I guess I could post all the combos I use and we can see what I'm doing wrong, though...
Slayer Alucard Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 No, I said "If you CAN'T REACT FAST, then you eat an air throw"
MisoSowee Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 How often does j.C land 5B 2147C work? I'd imagine the 5B just whiffing or be too far if they crouch (although you could just go straight into overhead if they're turtley after j.C). I could see it working on big guys though. You could do jump up j.C too on the bigger characters and hit confirm into hotaru. It'll net you more damage than TK 214c, which you only get 3c off of meterless :[ @leonil i never said anything about doing 6b on oki...
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 that's cool, i'll be more than happy to help you.
Leonil_Requiem Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 J↓↙←C Combo * Unless stated otherwise, J↓↙←C has to be done close to the ground, such as →→ > J↓↙←C (3) J↓↙←C > ↘C (4) J↓↙←C > C > ↓↘→A > →C (5) J↓↙←C > C > →↓↘A,A > jc > JC > land > ↓C > hjc > JB > jc > JC (5) J↓↙←C > C > →↓↘A,A > hjc > J↓C > JC > land > ↓C > hjc > J↓C > J↓C > air dash > J↓C > J↓C > J↓C ^ corner combo, skip a J↓C before air dash on Carl, Taokaka and Arakune (5) J↓↙←C > ↓↙←B > ↓C > hjc > J↓C > JC > land > ↓C > hjc > J↓C > J↓C > air dash > J↓C > J↓C > J↓C ^ corner combo, skip a J↓C before air dash on Carl, Taokaka and Arakune (6) J↓↙←C > ↓↙←B > ↓↘→A > ↓C > jc > JB > jc > JC (8) J↓↙←C > C > ↓↘→A > →C > →↘↓↙←→C (8) J↓↙←C > C > →↓↘A,A > jc > JC > land > ↓C > hjc > JB > jc > JC > J↓↙←C j.214C > j.214B > jc >falling j.C combo
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