[AC] AC: Matchup Guide/Discussion

[JOFan]

for the baiken matchup what is the range JO wants to be in throughout the round? is it still mid-distance? i find that if i play keep away i cant really do anything when she start abusing iad j.s dust/ tatamis.. at mid-range i think at the very least JO can somewhat limit baikens option if she jumps, preempted mist finer p will keep her pinned. if she blocks into ouren i can cancel short strings into coin what do u guys think?

[render]

It's not a Buffer, just a manip with SlashBack+OD. Or a buffer of 2 frames, therefor it's a sort of nonsense.

It doesn't matter WHAT it is, it's awesome, and potentially very useful. I can see it being a good option against Venom's Dark Angel, Jam and Chipp's rush-up-and-hit-you-a-bunch supers, and potentially others.

...and actually, that's totally a buffer. Why is that not a buffer?

[SuperFX]

Sure you can. I'm doing it right now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0wOpp2RjSo

that's cool, and certainly useful.

thanks for the heads up:eng101:

[Camo]

It doesn't matter WHAT it is, it's awesome, and potentially very useful. I can see it being a good option against Venom's Dark Angel, Jam and Chipp's rush-up-and-hit-you-a-bunch supers, and potentially others.

...and actually, that's totally a buffer. Why is that not a buffer?

It's just an option with the Negative Edge. Nothing more but it's interesting.

But I don't sure you go to try this in match.

If you miss-->Bye Bye

[Xaphiel]

I'm having some trouble with OR. About how should the flow of the match go for JO? In addition, what are some good points to stop his offense and put the momentum in your favor? I handle myself well for a little while, but at some point I just get rushed down and pinned with moves that I don't know how to punish properly. Also, damn his short jump, I don't want to throw out random 6P's to catch him, but if I wait to see the jump, I'm often too late. Any info will be greatly appreciated.

[Mitsurugi]

Random pointers that work for me :

OS

- 5K is my main ground based poke. It beats his poking Rock It. You can do it on reaction pretty easily. You don't have any damage, knockdown or coin after it but it gets in his nerves, makes him lose the pace. If you predict it or have enough time, you can also 6P it and maybe IAD > little combo depending on your distance.

- When you wake up, do not try to throw him, his 6K is throw invincible and you'll get CH'ed into combo. Learn to block his Gunblaze cross-up when you wake-up or you'll suffer pain.

- 2S poke can stop his rushdown. Beware of his 2D.

- 5H can be used as a poking tool and as an anti-air thanks to Order Sol's small jump. Knowing how to zone him is really important. He has to come right IN you, to be very close while you don't. When he is in, it does not mean loss. Keep blocking and when you see a real gap (not a frame trap), escape or counter him (the risky 2H for instance).

- 3H on his wake up and with a certain distance and timing will beat any of his reversals, including his Storm Viper (shoryu).

- While zoning, do not let him build his level up to 3 by staying helpless in your corner. See below.

- When across the screen he charges manually and he likes to Charge burst, I often IAD KJ FRC to trick him into Charge Burst. The KJ should miss due to OS being invulnerable but he will be in recovery while you "fall" after the FRC. For instance falling j.HS into ground gatling then whatever (j.HS > land > 5K > 2D > coin/214P, j.HS > land > 5K > 5H > MF(2) combo etc).

- As already mentioned by LM_Akira, still across the screen, if he does his whiff Blockhead Buster (the "flaming ball") special into Action Charge, you can KJT~KJ to punish him on reaction if he does not FRC it.

- Keep an eye on his level meter and know how his specials are affected by it. For instance, don't rush after a whiffed Lv 3 SV since after the actual shoryu, it has an ending part hitting downward with his feet.

- When blocking, do not mash button since he has really good frame traps. Be aware he can Charge Cancel, kinda like Mist Cancel but for Order Sol.

- Use FD to gain extra space between you and him when guarding his attacks. That will make his pressure more difficult and expose him some more. Do not mindlessly hold the FD as he can run and throw you.

- 2H can kill his pressure game when you see gaps but you'll get eaten alive if he baits it. Risky but useful nonetheless.

- When if whiffs a special, he can Action Charge (AC) it and FRC to trick you. For instance, SV AC FRC, 2D. The AC makes you think he is airborne, waiting him to "normally" fall without the ability to block but then he FRC immediately (or almost) making him land, catching you offguard and he hits you with a low.

- When you are cornered, he is likely (not necessarily) to throw you since he has good combos there. Learn his tick-throw games.

- You can yourself throw him using string > MC > hop > Throw or Wave Dash > Throw. As silly and obvious it may be to repeat it since it is viable for everything, do not get predictable.

- His FB is a low hit ! It may look weird at first but you'll get accustomed to it. As soon as you hear FB noise or see the FB sparkle, either block low (safest choice most of the time) or escape if you are far enough. Careful as it may be a low, it can still hit higher than it seems, specially when close.

- When jumping in, do not perform a slow hit too late (mistimed j.HS is a common mistake) as his 5H will welcome you to hell with a CH. But if you do it too early, he'll GB you for the same treat.

Feel free to correct, complete or discuss.

[Kayin Nasaki]

Don't think I should make a thread just for #R Matches so I'll ask here. Whos favor is #R Jo vs #R Robo Ky and what should a this pimp be doing to stop this robotic madman from stealing all the wimminz? It seems a difficult matchup to me.

[ManinBlack]

Hello community, hope you are all well ^_^. I hope this hasn't been covered before and if it has sorry. I was playing a Axl yesterday and it was impossible for me to get in close enough to do anything and ended up losing most of the time, though when I was in and able to stay there and keep the pressure he crumbles. He can hit low/mid/high and ariel that long chain of his. There's no way I can out poke him, it keeps me from closing in. Is there a strategy against Axl that I can use to get around the insane range and pokes he has or is this just something out of a Johnny players control. Thanx ^_^ Isaac

[4r5]

Is there a strategy against Axl that I can use to get around the insane range and pokes he has or is this just something out of a Johnny players control.

Lots of patiences and a watchful eye. When he attacks, you evade and work yourself in a little closer. In a neutral situation, don't try to take to the air, you'll just get a chain in the face before you get anything started. It's not so bad, like it was pre-AC, since the second hit of his chains pull you in on block.

If you haven't noticed already, many of Axl's moves extend his hitbox forward more then what the graphics would lead you to believe. For example, 5P: from just outside of 5P's range, you are close enough to tag Axl with a 236K if he throws out a 5P. If you are closer you can 6K, 6P, or OD it. Similarly, you can 2HS his 2P from a lot further then it would seem.

[Chomite]

Would well placed Ensenga beat Axl's poke or at least nullify it?

[4r5]

You can tkEnsenga over stuff like 2P, 2HS, or GreenChain if you're quick enough, or you anticipate it. Or is there another situation you had in mind?

[A3Religion]

Axls normals -5p countered by Jo's 6p that leads to easy IAD combos and 6k works very well for the counterhit -2p countered by a well anticipated IAD into HS Also throwing out an occasional random coin keeps an Axl player at bay. The air is no Johnny's land that will end you early in a fight or give you no tension to work with later.

[frcflyingjohnny]

Alright guys I went through gameacho's 178 videos and got all the JO vids out of em. I will continue to do this at a later time unless you guys want to go on ahead of me. Once I saw how J.D. posted a youtube video on his article "Top Player Mentality", I got this idea to go through the gameacho videos and guide us through em so we don't have to watch any in-between videos. I gotta go home now, and I don't know when my next chance will be to sort through more of them, but I think you guys should do the same as I have. I ENCOURAGE YOU GUYS TO DO THIS!! Everytime I come online I wish there were more JO vids to watch, but sorting through them is a PAIN, so a collaborative effort on this type of thing would be NICE. If you guys want to start going through them and doing the same thing I did, we can discuss VIDEOS in depth and really get down to business why things work vs. certain characters and crap like that. I will post in Eddie topic now REAL quick.

[Killerwatt]

Alright guys I went through gameacho's 178 videos and got all the JO vids out of em. I will continue to do this at a later time unless you guys want to go on ahead of me.

Once I saw how J.D. posted a youtube video on his article "Top Player Mentality", I got this idea to go through the gameacho videos and guide us through em so we don't have to watch any in-between videos. I gotta go home now, and I don't know when my next chance will be to sort through more of them, but I think you guys should do the same as I have. I ENCOURAGE YOU GUYS TO DO THIS!!

Everytime I come online I wish there were more JO vids to watch, but sorting through them is a PAIN, so a collaborative effort on this type of thing would be NICE. If you guys want to start going through them and doing the same thing I did, we can discuss VIDEOS in depth and really get down to business why things work vs. certain characters and crap like that. I will post in Eddie topic now REAL quick.

I like this idea. I'll help out where I can too.

[frcflyingjohnny]

Alright well I think I went through all gameacho's videos. I'm gonna have to go elsewhere now. You guys know any pages where there's tons and tons of videos??? Like I remember awhile ago there was this dude who was just uploading TONS of JOYBOX. Anybody remember where those videos are located?

[vedasisme]

http://www.youtube.com/user/bigooooooohh

[frcflyingjohnny]

Alright looks good. Two things are about to be spammed, Johnny Matchup threads, and youtube's bandwidth.

edit: 4 thousand of his videos are the same 7 over and over. That's pretty bad.

[4r5]

btw, the johnny matches on my youtube channel didn't go anywhere (though I only have matches up to Jan 22, 2009). You can just search my uploads with "Johnny Slayer" or whatever.

My channel probably has a lot of overlap with bigoooohh.

[frcflyingjohnny]

Well I'm pretty much on a roll right now, I'm cycling through all bigOOOOOOOOOO's videos and keeping track of where I leave off so that I don't lose my place. None of the videos I link to from bigOOOO should overlap with themselves, which I think is a good thing (unless someone else starts linking to bigOOOO videos too). ...I think he uploaded almost every gg video in existence so I think it might be good if I continue at my pace. I should finish going through them within a week or two. Maybe there might be some videos on there that people missed or forgot about. The old videos I think are very good and a good technique must not be lost.

[qwerty]

For what it's worth, I'll shoot off my own matchup chart. Summaries will come in due time.

5.5-4.5: Anji, Order-Sol

5-5: Baiken, May, I-No, Robo-Ky, Sol

4.5-5.5: ABA, Axl, Bridget, Chipp, Dizzy, Eddie, Jam, Slayer

4-6: Faust, Ky, Potemkin

3.5-6.5: Testament, Millia

3-7: Venom

2.5-7.5: Zappa