ghaleon109 Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 Is j214B an overhead if you TK it? And if it is, can you follow up when you RC? No it's not an overhead.. And the recovery really blows on it so I'm betting it's only going to be seen as a combo ender. Hows the hitbox on his flash kick? Sometimes I see some players getting hit by it even when theyre almost at Hazama's back. Also does it seem easy for Flash kick and Jayoku to get a FC? You have to charge 214DB to get a fatal counter so I wouldn't count on it being "easy" as it can be read... especially if your trying it a lot. The recovery blows on it too if you wiff so you could be eating combos if you try it too much. But the hitbox on it is pretty sweet as you've noticed. Any counter will cause 236236B to be a Fatal Counter tho btw, and you'll probbably only be using it as a reversal or as a combo extender so yeah I guess it's "easy" in that sense as any counter is going to get you the FC.
Moogster Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 No it's not an overhead.. And the recovery really blows on it so I'm betting it's only going to be seen as a combo ender. Damn, would have been pretty good if it was an overhead.
testament101 Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 so I've never really thought much of BB and I still don't but Hazama just looks too cool to pass up on playing. Anyway, got a few general questions. 1. Does he have a considerably good oki game? Most of the combo's I've been seeing on vids just knock the opp. down right beside him? 2. Does he have any real damage? Maybe it's just me but I see him hit somebody and it just doesn't look like it hurts at all unless a super's in there somewhere. 3. How is his poking game compared to the rest of the cast. Thanks in advance for the info
Shiawase Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 2. Does he have any real damage? Maybe it's just me but I see him hit somebody and it just doesn't look like it hurts at all unless a super's in there somewhere. Thanks in advance for the info From what I can see you have to use some meter in order to get the really good damage with him. I think if you can play a good defensive game along with the mobility of his drive you can get away with low damaging combos.
Moogster Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 2. Does he have any real damage? Maybe it's just me but I see him hit somebody and it just doesn't look like it hurts at all unless a super's in there somewhere. As far as I can see from the videos, he gets at around 2-2.7k with his combos which also gets him lots of meter.
bjholmes2 Posted December 7, 2009 Author Posted December 7, 2009 Uh, I accidentally deleted the video thread and I don't have the ability to recover it. I've told the super-mods, so it should be fixed, but in the meantime, sorry!
Digital Watches Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 I accidentally UN-deleted it. Weird coincidence, huh?
geist Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 combos into 632146C gives Hazama some great damage off of Fatal 214DB and 236236B. I don't think I've ever seen a Hazama rapid though. (But really though, does he ever need to off of anything? ) only situation would probably be if you JUST got enough bar to super after j.214B combo ender can you rapid 623D? seems like you might be able to get some nice damage if you did...well...even if you can't, you can probably always dash 3C jayoku and get more damage >_< edit: in the new videos dio vs ??? hazama RC's after the wallbounce...kinda hilarious that I haven't seen anyone do this and the moment I ask the question the answer is presented in the first video I watch after
testament101 Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 only situation would probably be if you JUST got enough bar to super after j.214B combo ender can you rapid 623D? seems like you might be able to get some nice damage if you did...well...even if you can't, you can probably always dash 3C jayoku and get more damage >_< edit: in the new videos dio vs ??? hazama RC's after the wallbounce...kinda hilarious that I haven't seen anyone do this and the moment I ask the question the answer is presented in the first video I watch after I've seen it once. I think Zakiyama over at Gamechariot did it once. Did some nice damage. On another note...about Jayoku Hotenjin...does anybody know exactly how fast the start up is? I'm seeing some players (mainly zakiyama) instant block stuff like Ragna's c.A and JH him for it.
comoesa Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 I watcged some of zakiyama vids on gamechariot..and I think Im in love. He seems have a very viable turtle game. I kinda expect his damage to be on te lower side due to this, but thats fine.
testament101 Posted December 7, 2009 Posted December 7, 2009 I think Zakiyama is the best Hazama atm. Also, another problem I'm seeing is Hazama's mixup and oki. Just based on what I've seen so far from vids, it's like he doesn't have hardly any of each. Most of the damage I'm seeing is coming from random CH with his Drive or (in Zakiyama's case) CH Jayoku Houtenjin.
comoesa Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 He dont have any oki/mixup game he's a poking/zoning character.
geist Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 He dont have any oki/mixup game he's a poking/zoning character. he DOES have a shit ton of gimmicks though couple I've seen from air, opponent on ground D(whichever will hit) D (maybe C?) command/regular grab...seems to come out really fast...dangerous obviously but if you've been training them to react to D~A's and D~C/D j.Bs/2Cs doing this will be almost guaranteed damage I'd like to see some one 3C 214DD 3C...seems like the cancel is fast enough
Digital Watches Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 No mixup? Seriously, if you don't see mixup potential there I dunno what's wrong with ya. I see I-No mixup potential there with latch-jumps, no prob. That and tick throws. You can probably do some badass tick throws, what with the fast jab and the mist-cancelling and the fact that he's got a command grab and all.
Shiawase Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 No mixup? Seriously, if you don't see mixup potential there I dunno what's wrong with ya. I see I-No mixup potential there with latch-jumps, no prob. That and tick throws. You can probably do some badass tick throws, what with the fast jab and the mist-cancelling and the fact that he's got a command grab and all. Um, mist-cancelling?
4r5 Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 Um, mist-cancelling? oh wow, neat. didn't know we had this stuff on the server http://www.dustloop.com/ggac/char/johnny/jon-str.html Though, Hazama's Ja-cancels don't look to create a huge frame differential like Johnny's Mist-Cancels do.
testament101 Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 No mixup? Seriously, if you don't see mixup potential there I dunno what's wrong with ya. I see I-No mixup potential there with latch-jumps, no prob. That and tick throws. You can probably do some badass tick throws, what with the fast jab and the mist-cancelling and the fact that he's got a command grab and all. The only reason I don't see the I-no like mixups is that I would think that nobody would let him do a chain point blank to do an instant overhead, other than that, when he does a chain and flies toward you, you know he's airborn. I'm sure there's more to it than that but maybe I'm overestimating everybody. But regardless while he's got potential, we just haven't seen it yet. Zakiyama's probably the closest showing what he can really do so far.
Shiawase Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 oh wow, neat. didn't know we had this stuff on the server http://www.dustloop.com/ggac/char/johnny/jon-str.html Though, Hazama's Ja-cancels don't look to create a huge frame differential like Johnny's Mist-Cancels do. Oh well I knew about Johnny's Mist-Cancels. I guess I just didn't make the connection because I haven't got the chance to play Hazama yet. Sorry for my scrubiness.
g.Bauer Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 Am I the only one that really wants to see a new combo from hazama? xD I love that "shi shi shi" BnB but... I'm eager to see some ouroboros madness in play during the combo besides what we've already seen. Gotta give time to the players I guess =/
Shiawase Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 Am I the only one that really wants to see a new combo from hazama? xD I love that "shi shi shi" BnB but... I'm eager to see some ouroboros madness in play during the combo besides what we've already seen. Gotta give time to the players I guess =/ To be honest the Shi Shi Shi Shi thing bothers me a bit. It kind of reminds me of Jin's...
kid viper Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 The only reason I don't see the I-no like mixups is that I would think that nobody would let him do a chain point blank to do an instant overhead, other than that, when he does a chain and flies toward you, you know he's airborn. I'm sure there's more to it than that but maybe I'm overestimating everybody. But regardless while he's got potential, we just haven't seen it yet. Zakiyama's probably the closest showing what he can really do so far. Ertai is closer than zakiyama. Zakiyama plays more of a safe hazama. Ertai is aggressive and shows why the japanese put hazama so high on the tier list so early. Hazama is by no means a zoning/poking character given the moveset he has. Can he zone? Sure. Should he? I would hope not Chains can be cancelled into moves very quickly so you can't tell how he will fly/where he will land. Jasetsu stance is a mixup on it's own because you really don't want to do anything otherwise you'll eat flash kick, if you move he can close in with the overhead kick and put you back in block stun or he can cancel and throw chains to pressure you from a distance where you can't attack him. You can throw chains in their face given the right blockstring and because of the various followups they really don't have a choice but to sit and block, and when they get too comfortable blocking you can open them up with command grab which don't forget has invincibility on the latter half of it. Jayoku can be used in combos and to get the aggressive players off you and make them play more cautiously when you have meter.
koun Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 Ertai is closer than zakiyama. Zakiyama plays more of a safe hazama. Ertai is aggressive and shows why the japanese put hazama so high on the tier list so early. Hazama is by no means a zoning/poking character given the moveset he has. Can he zone? Sure. Should he? I would hope not Chains can be cancelled into moves very quickly so you can't tell how he will fly/where he will land. Jasetsu stance is a mixup on it's own because you really don't want to do anything otherwise you'll eat flash kick, if you move he can close in with the overhead kick and put you back in block stun or he can cancel and throw chains to pressure you from a distance where you can't attack him. You can throw chains in their face given the right blockstring and because of the various followups they really don't have a choice but to sit and block, and when they get too comfortable blocking you can open them up with command grab which don't forget has invincibility on the latter half of it. Jayoku can be used in combos and to get the aggressive players off you and make them play more cautiously when you have meter. so do you think of him as semi rush/with good mix up with the ability to zone or in better terms control his space.Because it seem than you really need to know when it time to back off and when you need to get in there.his 236D has not be used at all i think it not as useless as every think right now and now i think rapid may be very usefully with him in a vid i saw Ertai or Zakiyama rapid to follow when you can only do it in the cnoner without rapid and get 4052.So yea i think Hazama has i lot more to show us all.
Moogster Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 I noticed in the gamechariot vids with Ertai(Hazama) vs Buppa(Noel), when he cancels out of his stance, he gets hit every time by Buppa. Does this mean that canceling isn't actually safe or he isn't just blocking?
JinSaotome Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 No mixup? Seriously, if you don't see mixup potential there I dunno what's wrong with ya. I see I-No mixup potential there with latch-jumps, no prob. That and tick throws. You can probably do some badass tick throws, what with the fast jab and the mist-cancelling and the fact that he's got a command grab and all. ^ this for you guys saying he doesn't have mixup/oki because he's a zoning character, let me remind you that v-13 had godly zoning and oki AND great mixup. anyway, D~C allows for j.2C and j.B crossups on wake up. D~D allows you to zoom in and go for high/low/throw, etc, etc. His oki is fairly average, but he's definitely not lacking in mixup.
testament101 Posted December 8, 2009 Posted December 8, 2009 Right now, I'm just saying Zakiyama is better just b/c he has better combos and takes good advantage of how good Jayoku DD is. I believe Hazama will turn into a more aggressive character in time. We just haven't seen anything yet. I'm still only seeing damage come from counter hits with D or something like that. Haven't seen any "in your face" mixup yet from the vids I've watched so far. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure it's there.
Recommended Posts