njmamm Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 ahh i c... wow, nice...thx a bunch, that helped... XD he actually doesn't seem all that complicated when u break it down... and umm one more question lol... what's the point of 6b, i mean, i understand that it could cause the opponent to second-guess themselves b/c of the nature of its startup animation but i doubt that'll work often...
Ouroboros Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 Actually, you might be able to get a blocked chain to work. I've seen people get away with a blocked j.6D > j.B > 2AxN to push the enemy back, and they don't seem to get the timing to do even a 5A. But that might have been the enemy being on the defensive. To be on the safe side, don't fly in on a blocked chain but if you do then you gotta be quick about it and get the hell back as fast as you can. If the enemy is blocking low a 214D~A might work... overheads and fun. EDIT: 6b is a low hit. Apart from being low it breaks a prime guard... which is kind of nice.
Arifureta Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 6B is punishment for failing the input to Jayoku. :V Also trolling. Although you never know when the pressure might get to your opponent and s/he'll get flustered and get confused by a standing low. 6A is the overhead. Pretty useful to throw out from time to time if you have the meter to follow it up. No, seriously, never fly in on a blocked chain. You can salvage it with a j.B if you're lucky, true, but there's no need to take the risk. Just keep up the pressure and wait for a proper opening. Or if you really want to fly in, do it before you hit the opponent. It'll at least give you time to barrier if he looks like he'll go for an anti air.
Ouroboros Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 Safe on block? I don't quite get what you mean. If you mean it is unblockable, then no. 6a is an overhead, which means people can block it if they are standing but can't if they are crouching. If you mean that if it safe to use it when someone is blocking (while standing) then no... I don't think so, there isn't much follow ups to that move to keep pressure going. I wish you could though. How cool would Hazama be if you could cancel 6a,6b, or even 6c into other moves? One can only dream...
Arifureta Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 They're all, like, here. Get learned. :V http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?8496-Hazama-Frame-Data So no, 6a isn't safe since it's -5 on block, plus not to mention that it doesn't gatling into anything. Although 6A and 6B are distortion cancellable, and 6C is comboable on CH.
ZhePrime Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 is 6a safe on block? || MOVE || DMG || P1 || P2 || Cancel || Block || LV || Attr || Sta || Act || Rec || SD || CH || UT || || 6A || 600 || 75 || 80 || DR || HA || 4 || HB || 22 || 3 || 21 || -5 || 33 || 19 || 23F Hit stun on ground hit [TN: Forces 'Bend Back'; forces crouch maybe?], Slams Down on Air hit, Cannot Emergency Roll, Breaks 1 GP Frame Data Terminology (scroll down a little bit)
DF2K Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 6b is the god of uselessness. Unless you want to be a dick and guard crush someone that way.
Soriphen Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 I don't get why they had to add 6B...at least make his j.214B an overhead .
njmamm Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 Hmm...I see... Damn...BB is complicated lol i've nvr rly looked at frame data b4 but the terminology sheet helped, thx Ok, does 632146C stop time? What I mean is, the difference between Litchi's All Green, and Carl's Fermata (where time actually by goes as normal after the super flash as Nirvana charges up her punch), cause I was fighting Haku-men and when he did Mugen from across the screen, i did 632146C on reaction, hoping it would work. And to my satisfaction, I scored the CH XD So is this actually foolproof, or is it just the AI being retarded? Though I do believe Mugen has a bit of recovery...
Black Onslaught Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 Like someone said 6B is punishment if you whiff the Jayoku command. 6B has it's moments, it's animation is extremely similar to 6A so if you're lucky you'll get a free low hit ( that you need meter to follow up on. . . )
Eclipse Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 You see. 6B has never looked similar to 6A to me. I guess my eyes are too amazing to be deceived, :/ Haha. Anyways, Mizuchi Rekkazan (632136C) doesn't stop time. I know the auto-combo on hit doesn't anyways. And can be used to kill time if you're trying to win by timeout. The beginning may, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't. All Green definitely does.
Arifureta Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 6B's saving grace is that it's standing low. Although since most of Hazama's moves can be stuffed by guarding low, it's not really as useful. Yeah, Mizuchi doesn't stop time. AI probably mashed something. :V
Fireryda Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 Mugen has recovery afterwards. You can Rekkazan on reaction and get it off I think. It might actually be too slow and they were mashing something. But you can punish mugen for sure.
Arifureta Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 I'm pretty sure the startup for Mizuchi won't catch out Mugen since, even on reaction, the move's only going to come out after the animation for Mugen's done. ALSO, no sane Hakumen player is going to Mugen from fullscreen. :V
njmamm Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 ALSO, no sane Hakumen player is going to Mugen from fullscreen. :V Wait, why? :3
Arifureta Posted July 21, 2010 Posted July 21, 2010 It's a waste of full meter. What is he going to do, spam Shippu?
Fireryda Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 Yes! Shippu Zoning and Tsubaki on jump-ins! also Unlimited Hazama.. Houtenjin travels half the screen..!!
njmamm Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 It's a waste of full meter. What is he going to do, spam Shippu? Yes. Hey guys what's the best way to follow up Jakou midscreen without the use of any heat? Wait, before that, can you even follow up Jakou midscreen?
Fireryda Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 yes with the j.6d combo with the right positioning (check faq). also with the right positioning dash 2b > 5c> j.c ... if you have heat you could rc j.6d on everybody or dash 3c > jayoku.
Ghost Beef Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 What would you guys say Hazama's best match opening options are? The obvious pick seems to be 3C but it comes out too slowly, and would be too predictable. Is dash in 5B viable? Or do most of you guys start out back dashing/jumping?
Fireryda Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 depends on the character. Tager Stance. 214D~B beats out everything of his and he's too slow to punish it. Litchi / Jin Back-dash. Would jump back air-dash j.6d but their AA options are pretty rape. My local Litchi likes to open with Itsuu. Arakune 6D. Everybody else Either dash 2a/3c, j.9d or if i really feel like some ghetto stuff dash 214d~b. works better than it should ><;
Arifureta Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 I just hold back. I don't want any nasty surprises at the start of the round. :V And then pick and adjust subsequent matches afterwards.
DF2K Posted July 22, 2010 Posted July 22, 2010 I only really use Mizuchi if it's going to net me a KO, the minimum damage on it is pretty solid, not to mention it's entirely burst safe. There's no oki, and it puts Hazama back to zoning again. Maybe below 20% health it would be useful to end a non-death combo since you gain meter automatically when you're below 20%, but that's pretty impractical. As far as openings, I'm with Arifureta, I play defensively and zone until I get a clean hit. I was messing with something today. Remember Hazama's Mission 10 combo where he needs to use j.b+c after 5d-d to stop the vertical momentum? I think this could be utilized as a mind game. For example, doing 5d and then d right before it hits the opponent, then using b+c midair to get him on the ground quickly again to psych them out and dashing in for a throw or quick 3c, etc. What do you guys think?
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