The "Picking a Main" thread

[Chris Chaos]

I always want to punch people when they say this.

It's like crossups suddenly never existed.

Jin does have Mix-Up but it's lacking, Jin also doesn't have true cross-ups. Most of his stuff can be seen and blocked easily and you can punish him for it. Jin has "Tricks" or "Gimmicks" as you could call them but they are so strong it makes people believe they're legit.

(ex.) Jin's cross-ups as you would call them work on your opponent's reaction's to get them from blocking in the 6 direction to switching guarding the 4 direction, but Jin jumps back to the original side he began and forces the opponent to move toward him getting a free freeze, making it appear to be a cross up.

Either way, if you want someone who's strong in Mix-up, go with Makoto, she's easy to learn and her mix up consists of Hi/Lo which is easy to pick up. Bang's Mix-up comes with his bumpers which makes his mix up strong but without it, his mix up is pretty lacking (lol 2a, 2a). Or if you like taking a steep learning curve you can go with Litchi who has excellent mix up but her learning curve would be frustrating to a beginner especially if this is their first fighter.

[Airk]

Bang also has decent overheads, nail pressure into command grab, and a mighty fine crossup game of his own.

Not ALL of Jin's crossups are of the 'double fake out' gimmick variety - airdash j.D can be fairly confusing. That said, it's a fairly safe statement to say that Jin has no TRADITIONAL mixup. (Though his gimpy overhead is actually the fastest 'normal' overhead in the game AFAIK, it just has no reach and doesn't combo into anything without CH or Rapid Cancel.)

[Chris Chaos]

Bang's overheads consists of 5c, j.c, j.b, IAD > 4b; Most of which involving him to jump and 5c isn't too fast to neutral block on reaction and you can easily AA bang for trying to hit you with a jumping overhead.

Nail Pressure into command grab is flawed because anyone can jump out.

So yeah, Bang has a good mix-up game because if the tools are used right (Aerial AA, 5C, Bumpers), it can rattle the opponent's brain and expose them to a lot.

I never said ALL of Jin's cross ups are "Double Fake Out" but with the way I posted, I can see where the confusion would lie, I'll apologize for that.

Jin's IAD > D is literally jumping to the other side and freezing you so switch your block to 4, most Jin players will do this. sometimes others will stay above you and you will have to continue to block in the 6 direction, if you watch Jin's sprite, it's not that hard. Jin's OH is not that great and most Jin players don't use it for that reason (Except myself). The OH won't be useful unless it's used in pressure and if it's thrown out, it's pretty obvious.

But for someone just starting the game, I guess it would be hard but for those with experience playing fighting games, they are used to this because there are other character in other games that can pull this off.

[SolarMisae]

I always want to punch people when they say this.

It's like crossups suddenly never existed.

I guess I just never saw crossups and mixups as the same thing, thus...why they have different names. But thats me.

[ReachForTheEnd]

Learning curve has never really scared me. It takes quite a bit to frustrate me. Right now Litchi looks really fun and her combos look satisfying to pull off. Everywhere I am reading Makoto gets a lot of hate....like a lot of it...

[Airk]

Bang's overheads consists of 5c, j.c, j.b, IAD > 4b; Most of which involving him to jump and 5c isn't too fast to neutral block on reaction and you can easily AA bang for trying to hit you with a jumping overhead.

Nail Pressure into command grab is flawed because anyone can jump out.

So yeah, Bang has a good mix-up game because if the tools are used right (Aerial AA, 5C, Bumpers), it can rattle the opponent's brain and expose them to a lot.

I never said ALL of Jin's cross ups are "Double Fake Out" but with the way I posted, I can see where the confusion would lie, I'll apologize for that.

Jin's IAD > D is literally jumping to the other side and freezing you so switch your block to 4, most Jin players will do this. sometimes others will stay above you and you will have to continue to block in the 6 direction, if you watch Jin's sprite, it's not that hard. Jin's OH is not that great and most Jin players don't use it for that reason (Except myself). The OH won't be useful unless it's used in pressure and if it's thrown out, it's pretty obvious.

But for someone just starting the game, I guess it would be hard but for those with experience playing fighting games, they are used to this because there are other character in other games that can pull this off.

To summarize:

Everyone has crap offense if you have perfect reactions.

Fortunately for BlazBlue, most of these tricks work at least some of the time.

[StarGazer]

Learning curve has never really scared me. It takes quite a bit to frustrate me. Right now Litchi looks really fun and her combos look satisfying to pull off. Everywhere I am reading Makoto gets a lot of hate....like a lot of it...

Its true but Ignore them, if you really love Makoto as a character then go for it... if not then leave her as lot of character can give you a performance just like her with 0% hate.

Also don't take things by a mathematically aspect... its just wrong

[Fluck]

Crossups are a type of mixup. It's like saying 'running' is not 'exercising' cause they have different names. However, Jin is not a mix-up oriented character.

Saying anyone can jump out of 12-13F command grabs is ridiculous. Everyone can block high against 12-13F instant overheads, I guess they aren't too useful then! Both types of mixups are a complete guess because you can't react to them, and in fact they are probably the strongest kinds of mix-ups in BB.

Strong mix-up isn't necessarily the same as a large variety of mixup either. Makoto's mixup is very strong and she can win plenty of matches with just different strings into 6B if she wants to play safe, but you wouldn't really call that variety compared to characters like Bang. So it really depends on what exactly you want.

[ReachForTheEnd]

Okay...I need help again...I want to play a heavy offensive character. Like super offensive. My friend mains Ragna and I have trouble defending well enough to win. So the best defense is a good offense. Again I have nothing but time and learning curve does not scare me. I have been leaning to Carl, Litchi, Noel, or Valk. Litchi is who I am leaning more towards right now. Again this is my first fighting game...ever...So I would love something that tells me all the basics and the such.

(I know Carl isn't offensive. He just looks stylish to play)

Edited September 6, 2011 by ReachForTheEnd

[Fluck]

Okay...I need help again...I want to play a heavy offensive character. Like super offensive. My friend mains Ragna and I have trouble defending well enough to win. So the best defense is a good offense. Again I have nothing but time and learning curve does not scare me. I have been leaning to Carl, Litchi, Noel, or Valk. Litchi is who I am leaning more towards right now. Again this is my first fighting game...ever...So I would love something that tells me all the basics and the such.

(I know Carl isn't offensive. He just looks stylish to play)

Defense comes with experience, so you shouldn't alarmed that you can't defend well yet. I'm not sure what you mean by your last statement, but I'm sure Carl is considered an offensive character by most people. His defensive options are extremely lacking and he has little HP and only 4 primers. On the other hand his mix-up is good and can kill you in one "combo" thanks to his unblockable loops.

Other characters besides Carl who are always aiming to go on the offensive are Valkenhayn and Taokaka. They don't like being made to block and they have good mobility to ensure that they start their offense.

[ReachForTheEnd]

I never know Carl was that offensive...I might have to try him out.

[mAc Chaos]

He wants a strong rushdown character.

Bang is pretty much get in their face all the time, every time, although he's all about the player improvising ways to get into the head of the opponent. He has nowhere to go but forward. Notice that even his drive is a counter of sorts, but he uses it to teleport into the opponent's space to continue his offense.

Edited September 6, 2011 by mAc Chaos

[Fluck]

He wants a strong rushdown character.

Bang is pretty much get in their face all the time, every time, although he's all about the player improvising ways to get into the head of the opponent. He has nowhere to go but forward. Notice that even his drive is a counter of sorts, but he uses it to teleport into the opponent's space to continue his offense.

Yes, you're right. Bang is fine too, I just didn't want to mention all the offensive rushdown characters cause it's extremely broad and consists of a large part of the cast.

[mAc Chaos]

I don't think of Carl as a rushdown character, either. Same with Litchi. They're more about positioning and mixup, imo. But anyway...

[StarGazer]

pick someone you like as a character and forget about his gamestyle and tier placement.

if you don't have anyone in your mind then pick Valkenhayn, he never gets old, his mix ups are aweeesome, nice damage output (his 2c gives you 6k meterless midscreen), he have a lot of options to get in, also he is underplayed because he is hard.

i started by playing Carl, Mu, Valkenahyn and Rachel but soon i dropped them and picked Makoto because i love her tho i realllly hate rushdown characters and love to play with characters that give you to much options to approach and set ups...

[Manta]

Rushdown happy? Tsubaki is worth a look, her combos can be a bit fiddly to learn as they involve a lot of inputs but as of CS2, her game is pretty damn solid. But your logic of using an offensive character to counter an offensive character is flawed, you'll find it even more frustrating since you'll have even more trouble getting out of pressure when it happens. Perhaps you want more mistake-punishing character like Hakumen or Tager, they crush anyone with a reckless offence (Not sure how experienced this Ragna you go against is).

[Airk]

Yeah, I agree with Manta - the idea of picking an "offensive" character to try to counter someone rushing you down with Ragna is just going to result in a lot of really stupid matches where you die hideously, or he does. Picking an "offensive" character isn't going to help you get out of Ragna's pressure, it just means that if you can start your pressure first, things will be going your way. I'd definitely suggest going for a character with more defensive options rather than less if this is your problem. Tager, Hakumen, Jin (he has right nice reveral options), maaaaybe Bang or Tsubaki. Definitely NOT any of the characters that have no "easy" way out of pressure without 50 heat (Carl, Tao, Valk, Arakune, Lambda).

[ReachForTheEnd]

Okay guys thanks for all the advice. I am going to try out Haku, Valk, and Carl. I had never even thought to try out Haku...Valk is just a BAMF and I like Carl because of his musical references and I like the idea of playing two characters.

Edited September 6, 2011 by ReachForTheEnd

[Kujikawa]

I already know my beautiful main, however a friends wants to have some other opions on who he should main:

- Med to high exection level, 5K needs to feel like an achievement to him.

- Good Pressure

- Good Corner carry, high damage in corner.

[Airk]

Tsubaki? She's definitely high on the execution scale for her good combos, she has fierce corner carry, and good pressure.

Alternatively, Makoto probably fits that bill too.

[Fugu]

I already know my beautiful main, however a friends wants to have some other opions on who he should main:

- Med to high exection level, 5K needs to feel like an achievement to him.

- Good Pressure

- Good Corner carry, high damage in corner.

Sounds like Litchi to me.

[Linear04]

not in cse

AHAHAHAHA

[SolarMisae]

I don't remember if I posted before, but I've come full circle and now I'm back.

So I've got my main, and she's not going anywhere. But now that I'm fairly comfortable with Mu, I feel like Im ready to pick up a regular sub. I've "subbed" Platinum for awhile now, but as much as I love her I don't completely like how random her drive is. The inconsistency bugs me a bit, and I've tried to adapt but I can't find it in me to want to sit in training mode with her. :<

That said, I'm now venturing about and not sure what I want in my sub. I like characters with combos that aren't braindead but aren't insane in terms of execution, so intermediate level. I like good mobility and decent lockdown, I find being able to keep people immobile very rewarding and fun. I like having decent range too, but that isn't a deal killer, and I've decided I can deal with shorter range if the character is fun.

So far my top picks are Hazama, Makoto, Rachel, and Hakumen. I love Hazama's high mobility with his chains, and his high damage combos are attractive and flashy. (I'm a sucker for flashy combos) and don't feel very difficult in terms of execution. The only thing that bothers me is his mobility without using chains, I'm not used to characters that don't have a continuous run.

Makoto's pressure and combos are interesting and decently challenging but not infuriating, and her overall gameplay is pretty fun to watch. She's the rushdown character I'd play if I wanted to go full tilt opposite in regards to my usual character achetype (zoners) she feels heavier that Noel, and not quite as (sorry Noel players) braindead to play as. But her range kills me.

Rachel is probably the closet thing to my current main in terms of playstyle. She seems to have great mixup and her okizeme is awesomely fun. Her execution is pretty damned intimidating though, and her drive is so very strange to me.

My last pick (to some extent) is Hakumen. I really like his style, and how he's a tank who can kill you with the right read. He's my alternate pick to Tager (Who I do enjoy but...no dash, I can't 720 for shit...D: ) but his combos feel so damned awkward to me. I didn't let this rule him out though as I'm sure i would adjust to it with practice, but it's still a huge leap from what I'm accustomed to.

Anyways I'm heavily leaning towards Hazama and Makoto at this point, but I can't decide. I figured I'd get some input before deciding for sure.

[Manta]

Anyways I'm heavily leaning towards Hazama and Makoto at this point, but I can't decide. I figured I'd get some input before deciding for sure.

Depends somewhat on if you like the idea of being a character that fewer people use. Hazama and Makoto are popular, and therefore more opponents know their tricks and how to counter them. If you like someone rushdown like that fewer people know how to fight against, try Tao, her style is more about being too fast to react appropriately to rather than strong Oki or pressuring.

[SolarMisae]

Try Tao, her style is more about being too fast to react appropriately to rather than strong Oki or pressuring.

Yeah I fight Tao once a week so I definitely know what her style is, that cat drives me crazy lol. She was my first choice in CT, but it didn't last very long.

Anyways, popularity of a character doesn't really factor in, and isn't something I consider in the least when picking characters. That said, we have all of 1 Hazama in our scene and one person who mains Bang and subs Makoto so for lack of a better way of putting it, at the present time, even if that DID matter to me it wouldn't matter...if, that makes sense. xD