Yuushiro Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 against good ragna, try to poke him on long range, jC is your best bet.... to stay away from him when the round just start, I say don't try to run up to him, let see how he try to get in.... if he jumps in , DP him or 2C or some other AA if he try to dash in , do 5C or 2A..... or just run away.... B and C fireballs are dangerous, use it sparingly even on max range cause of the recovery when you do get in, try to make them impatient.... use 6B, 6D, 6A, throw....... jin mixup sucks so make them worry about hi/lo and throw too when you get them in the corner... rapid from 3C or 6C is also good to get your pressure going if your enemy is not a masher.... if they are a masher just frame trap them. 5C>jump barrier is good for baiting their DP....
lxMetalSonicxl Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 After instant blocking Ragna's 2B in CT, you could stuff any followup. Is this still possible in CS?
Yuushiro Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 so dangerous, they can sweep you and it will be counter hit of anything you can throw at him except for C / D DP and it will whiff on good range for C DP case.....
BANGER Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Methinks his 2B is the worst time to try to break out since 2C is what's usually next in a blockstring. His 2C is safe and is very good for intimidation (especially in corner), and if you can't react fast enough, has fast enough recovery for him to 66 5B into another block string. I say look out for his slow overheads once he gets frustrated. GH is a given, his 6B you can 2A or 3C out of. If he 2As, there's a good chance he'll tick grab, so watch out for that too. Usually your best bet is to see what blockstring he likes to use, and just IB it and look for a chance. You can also try baiting DPs after 5C jump cancel.
Leonil_Requiem Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 I don't get it, he can wiff normals into my ib dp and block. He can wiff 2C and still beat me out. He can throw moves at my dp to fuck with me (As 2B 5B 2C 5C death spike) WTF IS UP, this is insane, (fighting Seon btw :vbang:) this match-up is free.
smooshman Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 C DP sucks...... just wait for an opening and run the fuck away.... or something.... maybe wait for enough heat for a better reversal
Leonil_Requiem Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 alright, i'll ib and block his mix up till i got 25, not really all that hard, the ib part.
smooshman Posted July 30, 2010 Posted July 30, 2010 okay after being able to fight Ragna for a long time..... how the fuck can I get in? I try dash cancel my way in, I eat 3K; I ice sword, IAD'd over and I eat shit; 2D, which + on block, and I still get stuffed, WTF? I just can't get close at all..... and when I do I still get murdered..... I miss CT 5C's range.....
Nov Ganon Posted July 30, 2010 Author Posted July 30, 2010 your going to need alot more than 5c to get in smoosh... learn to use Jc effectively hes not bang so u dont have to worry about him auto guarding u into a huge combo....becareful when throwing out 2D also leairn to bait ID , its a free fatal and it can def turn the tides against him
Roldy Posted July 30, 2010 Posted July 30, 2010 Don't air dash in unless you're far away enough. His 6A is a godly anti-air (unlike a certain hat boy). I believe Jin's 5A or 2A can stuff Ragna's 5B. If Ragna is airdashing in, either do a DP or 2C. You can also bait airdashes by doing 236A or 236C. Don't do any slow oki moves (like 236C), he can quick tech and Inferno Divider; do a 2A to make sure you stuff any rolls he attempts, and if he neutral techs, just stay on guard (hopefully he takes the bait and does Inferno Divider). If he does anything else, just make sure you're ready for it (i.e. grab, overhead).
Nov Ganon Posted August 4, 2010 Author Posted August 4, 2010 ok guys ive been messing around with yukikaze in matches and ive been baiting ID on wakeup with it and it wont connect. so yukikaze on ID is a no go guys. edit:if you IB the 2nd hit of ID and they rapid into a Jc then u can counter:eng101:
mvken Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 5C's range is still adequate enough to beat ranga's 5D when it's still starting up, so for a normal ragna blockstring like 5B>3C>5D you could CH 5C>2D after his 3C. Of course don't do it when in the corner since the start of ragna's 5D can hit you if you're too close to him. Also be careful if he notices and switches 5D into 214B X/
xlolxlolx Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 Most Ragna's with half a brain would do a slightly more elaborate blockstrings than that....most of them do 5B>(2B)>5C>(2C)>5D>214A to keep blockstun then bait a CH or try and continue pressure. CH 5C>2D...........you serious? CH 5C>6C>DC>5C>6C>DC>air combo is what you should be doing from a CH 5C.
Nov Ganon Posted August 4, 2010 Author Posted August 4, 2010 hey when your in the corner and he 5d's u and uses its not over yet is it smart to tech right away?
mvken Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 well that blockstring was just one of many examples, I'm not saying you should 5C everytime after a ragna 3C or to think that every ragna uses that blockstring. And the reason I say 5C>2D is because for that situation after being pushed back a bit by ragna's attacks, a 5C>6C either won't reach or the follow up air combo won't. Of course if you are well within range then go for whatever combo you deem best. My point is although ragna's 5D may seem unstoppable, a well timed attack during it's startup can give you a CH.
Ice Cube Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 CH 5C>6C>DC>5C>6C>DC>air combo is what you should be doing from a CH 5C. Please don't make statements as if they are facts (especially when they are wrong). Midscreen, 5C>6C>2D>stuff gives better heat gain, better damage, better oki. On topic: if you don't tech 22C immediately, you risk eating (blue beat) 5B>3C>22C. 400 more damage, same setup. So tech immediately is a must. IB 5D's first hit and you can sneak in a 623D / yukikaze. With good hands, of course. Any tips on defensive anti-air? I do 5A against max range j.C, 5C if he's on top, 2C if he jump mid blockstring (after 6A or 3C), run under > 2A if he is high above (j.B seems to beat this one though). Should I 2C after I block an ID RC?
Nov Ganon Posted August 5, 2010 Author Posted August 5, 2010 whats a good way to punish a blocked BE from high in the air.... like if hes using it to get close to u i block it but hes to far to 5c him
Black Onslaught Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 IB BE puts him at -7, I think. Jin doesn't have any good distance moves that start up in 7 or less frames, so he's free. Alternatively if you know he's going to TK BE, or just jump and BE you could 623B/C ( depending on timing ), or further alternatively is to get the hell out of the way.
Yuushiro Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 Please don't make statements as if they are facts (especially when they are wrong). Midscreen, 5C>6C>2D>stuff gives better heat gain, better damage, better oki. On topic: if you don't tech 22C immediately, you risk eating (blue beat) 5B>3C>22C. 400 more damage, same setup. So tech immediately is a must. IB 5D's first hit and you can sneak in a 623D / yukikaze. With good hands, of course. Any tips on defensive anti-air? I do 5A against max range j.C, 5C if he's on top, 2C if he jump mid blockstring (after 6A or 3C), run under > 2A if he is high above (j.B seems to beat this one though). Should I 2C after I block an ID RC? just keep blocking after ID C RC if he recovers in the air the block stun is long enough for him to continue attacking and if you mash something you might get hit instead.., if he is far enough in the air maybe you can try to do DP A. or just back dash away and create a better momentum
Nov Ganon Posted August 5, 2010 Author Posted August 5, 2010 IB BE puts him at -7, I think. Jin doesn't have any good distance moves that start up in 7 or less frames, so he's free. Alternatively if you know he's going to TK BE, or just jump and BE you could 623B/C ( depending on timing ), or further alternatively is to get the hell out of the way. i kinda figured that lol thanks tho
smooshman Posted August 12, 2010 Posted August 12, 2010 fought my first REAL RTSD Ragna..... fuck hell's fang being only -4.... fuck 5B,5C,3C..... fuck Jin's 5C being short goddammit. okay on a calmer note.... how can I stop him from putting me on defensive? or atleast get back the offense... is there a good way I can punish gauntlet hades? (besides IB because that's the answer to everything) what can I do to get out of his pressure? doing 1A and 1B don't work well.
xlolxlolx Posted August 12, 2010 Posted August 12, 2010 fought my first REAL RTSD Ragna..... fuck hell's fang being only -4.... fuck 5B,5C,3C..... fuck Jin's 5C being short goddammit. okay on a calmer note.... how can I stop him from putting me on defensive? or atleast get back the offense... is there a good way I can punish gauntlet hades? (besides IB because that's the answer to everything) what can I do to get out of his pressure? doing 1A and 1B don't work well. rofl i did too last night...and christ....dead spike on wakeup in corner is just freaking retarded......avoiding 4.5k+ combos is nearly impossible and omfg guard break like crazy with 2D and etc. You can B DP ragna's GH if you see it coming early on and c or d dp to escape through the holes in his block strings like the hell's fang opening
smooshman Posted August 12, 2010 Posted August 12, 2010 You can B DP ragna's GH if you see it coming early on and c or d dp to escape through the holes in his block strings like the hell's fang opening yeah, but I was so scared ;_; I've never been so violated, it was like "okay I could DP.... but if I miss I'll eat a 4K combo..." and then I would try stuffing 5D with 5C.... but I messed up the input (yes really) and got 2C.... but any way.... the only thing I learned is that you shouldn't zone Ragna.... ever. airash back JC>2D got me murdered (or course) and ice swords were pointless. the only strategy I found is that you should try to gain the offense, immediately, because it's hard to get the offense when he has it, don't give him any room... and don't take any big risks (6C>6D pressure comes to mind) because he'll murder you... don't give up oki, and if he gains offense, run the fuck away. this matchup sucks, whoever has the offense wins.... and he can gain it better than you
demonicZERO360 Posted August 14, 2010 Posted August 14, 2010 Thank u for this this monster has been gettin on my nerves for the longest!!!
Nov Ganon Posted August 17, 2010 Author Posted August 17, 2010 well only throw ice swords if hes far lol i think its best you learn some ragna blockstrings most of them like to go for a high low mix-up.... but the real reason this match up is so bad is our 5c man.... -some ragna's like to 214a then wait for u to attack then ID your ass -overhead kicks usually show up after 2a,2b,6a, after jump-ins -i personally think this match up is about knowing all his possible options
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