soujiro seta Posted April 17, 2011 Posted April 17, 2011 Hammer is +0 on block, it's safe so long as they don't instant block (making it -3). You can combo the quake from a pretty decent length, I'd say max distance is a little over half screen. And yes, it works on tech rolling. Thank you. A little over half screen?? Works on tech rolling too? Really? Wow, that's nice. When you have someone in the corner, I wonder if on their neutral wake up you could make them block a bubble, and right when they come out of blockstun they get hit by slidehead. Knock them in corner, step back a bit, bubble, wait a bit, jump up and do j.D, opponent blocks bubble on wakeup, blockstun end before j.D hits the ground, and then eats slidehead. Something tells me this could work on tager especially, or characters with tall crouching/wide hitboxes (assuming they crouch block after neutral tech). It might work on everyone if they stand block after neutral tech. I don't know I'm just tossing this out there.
soujiro seta Posted April 17, 2011 Posted April 17, 2011 (edited) Hmm, so she technically has an option select with 16t hammer in the corner off j.D/5D Score a kd in corner, wait a bit, j.D/5D. If they tech roll they eat j.D/5D/slidehead for a free combo If they neutral they'll probably end up blocking the 2nd hit of j.D hammer or first of 5D, which is safe on block as long as it's not IBed, so you can continue pressure afterwards. Ofcourse they could always mash out a reversal, but you get where I'm going with this. Edited April 17, 2011 by soujiro seta
Cirno Posted April 17, 2011 Posted April 17, 2011 Well, you can't combo off of 5D or j.D hammer without a CH, and the quake may be difficult to time properly, but it may be possible. I'll test it out a bit later. In the meantime: Good Tsubaki, you're lookin' kinda cool.
Starlight777 Posted April 18, 2011 Posted April 18, 2011 This is gonna be one long month ain't it? Especially now that we have a guess of when to expect her.
Cirno Posted April 18, 2011 Posted April 18, 2011 I'm not bored, I'm just being lazy and not recording the last combo I need to to start on a new video.
soujiro seta Posted April 18, 2011 Posted April 18, 2011 Well, you can't combo off of 5D or j.D hammer without a CH, and the quake may be difficult to time properly, but it may be possible. I'll test it out a bit later. In the meantime: Oh that's right i forgot. Btw, do 5D bombs have to be blocked standing? Cause madoushi kept using 5D bombs and 3C on his opponents wakeup. They try to block bombs standing but get hit by 3C and take the bombs anyway or vice versa.
soujiro seta Posted April 18, 2011 Posted April 18, 2011 This is what I'm talking about. Here and here
toanenadiz Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 Oh that's right i forgot. Btw, do 5D bombs have to be blocked standing? Cause madoushi kept using 5D bombs and 3C on his opponents wakeup. They try to block bombs standing but get hit by 3C and take the bombs anyway or vice versa. No. They can be blocked low. Don't forget you can just check out the frame data for something like this
Hurricane Rev Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 (edited) EDIT: toanenadiz beat me to it Edited April 19, 2011 by Hurricane Rev
C0R Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 3C is -8 on block, he was probably using the bombs to apply a later instance of blockstun to make the mixup more safe, similar to how you can use Jin's delayed swords or Mu's lasers.
suzumiya4ever Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 Sorry if this has been posted already, but I really don't think I have time to read 242 pages worth of posts and search function wasn't very helpful either :D So what rank is Platinum tiered in? I heard she was pretty low tier but I just want to have confirmation of whether if there is official tier list for CS2 from jap or something. Much appreciated thanks.
Cirno Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 A post from the BB gameplay discussion thread: "May issue of Arcadia has two ranking lists from two different players. List 1: S: Makoto, Tao, Hazama, Jin, Noel A: Carl, Rachel, Lambda, Litchi B: Tsubaki, Ragna, Arakune, Mu, Valkenhayn, Hakumen C: Platinum, Bang, Tager List 2: S: Makoto, Valkenhayn, Jin, Noel A: Hazama, Carl, Tao, Mu, Arakune, Tsubaki, Rachel B: Lambda, Platinum, Ragna, Litchi, Bang, Hakumen C: Tager Done by two different players, the first list I can't read the person's name, the second I think is goroo. Some variation, but generally agreed between the two of them that Mak/Jin/Noel are top, Carl is high, Ragna and Hakumen are mid, and Tager is bottom." Otherwise, there's LK's tier list, which I personally agree with so far, but is hardly official.
Yggjrasil Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 idk I'd say Ragna's a bad match-up against her. or 5.5-4.5 in Ragna's favor.
SoWL Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 idk I'd say Ragna's a bad match-up against her. or 5.5-4.5 in Ragna's favor. Agreed. I've played quite a lot of matches against my friend's Ragna, and it all comes down to whose defense is better. Most of the time, it's Ragna and his Dividah.
Starlight777 Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 I can tell I'm going to hate playing against Ragna STILL! If it wasn't for his deluxe get out of jail free card this matchup would probably be even.
TD Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 not even. as good a dp as it is, it was -really- good due to the risk/reward of it. nowadays its not netting him 4k or hardly even 2k outside the corner. lts because ragna outranges her with 5b and 5c, has good pressure and can stay on her, while she has 2 situational dp's and has to be point blank to go into a mixup/ better pressure range. ln all honesty ragna can play keepaway against her by simply hovering around his sweet spot (5b range) and mix her up from there. not to say plat cant own him with his low life, so this match is pretty close to even. should be fun.
Urichinan Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 I'd say that her worst matches are probably going to be Ragna, Litchi and Carl. All three have a very good rushdown game, great mix-up, good damage and long pokes. It'll be hard to deal with Carl's lockdown due to the situation DP's that she has or needing 50 Heat for a CA. Litchi can definitely out poke her, rush her down and since Litchi can zone about as good as Platinum I'd say it'd be a 6-4 or maybe even a 6.5-3.5.
soujiro seta Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 No. They can be blocked low. Don't forget you can just check out the frame data for something like this Thanks. Just checked the frame data. Where does it say it can be blocked low? Lol sorry I understand what most of them mean, but not all. Personally, from watching matches I would say ragna vs plat is 6-4 his favor. He can toss out 5b, 5c, jc, and fish for fatals with 2C. He outranges her too easily for free with little to no risk. If you don't have that situational dp, he can keep you blocking for a long time. The good thing now is that ragna doesn't get 4k minimum and 50 heat off everything anymore. His dp also doesn't give him the same reward, damage and heat, as CS1. Since he gains less heat, ragna players can't always dp on wakeup all the time, like CS1, without caring if it was baited cause they always have 50heat to rapid. This mean that they have to respect her pressure, and even if they don't, you'll only eat 1k midscreen or 2.2k corner if he DPs. There's also more risk now. If his dp is baited....well, we all know how much damage he's gonna take if that happens, especially if she has her hammer/fan. He can pressure her for free, but her mixup is stronger than his. Her damage potential is also higher, but his defense is better. In the end, it's the range. That's why I say 6-4 to ragna. 5b, 5c, jc, and 2c are just too free and safe to toss out against her.
soujiro seta Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 (edited) I'd say that her worst matches are probably going to be Ragna, Litchi and Carl. All three have a very good rushdown game, great mix-up, good damage and long pokes. It'll be hard to deal with Carl's lockdown due to the situation DP's that she has or needing 50 Heat for a CA. Litchi can definitely out poke her, rush her down and since Litchi can zone about as good as Platinum I'd say it'd be a 6-4 or maybe even a 6.5-3.5. As a former carl main, I'd actually say that the match up appears to be close to even or 5.5-4.5 in carl's favor. Most likely 5.5-4.5 You have to play against carl in a certain way. Lion/bear, 16t slidehead, missiles are the most important items in this matchup. Throw away all fans/regular hammers until you get close to him. Only keep hammer if you want to upgrade to 16t for slidehead. You want to zone him and keep him in blockstun. Nirvana will deactivate when he's blocking. The only move that comes out, even when he's blocking, is brio. Nirvana got a huge health nerf. He can't use her as a shield like he could anymore. Attack her, but watch out for his 5C. Even if you get hit by 5c, the stun was greatly reduced, so he has to react quickly now. Carl will have a lot of trouble getting in on her if you're constantly equipped with missiles, lion/bear, or 16t hammer to slidehead and get in on him. I don't want to go too indepth now as I'll do that in the matchup thread, but he's not one of her worst matchups. Edited April 19, 2011 by soujiro seta
Sakaku Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 Thanks. Just checked the frame data. Where does it say it can be blocked low? Lol sorry I understand what most of them mean, but not all. Guard section from Magical Bomb says "all", means it can be blocked high, low and in the air (without barrier block).
Hurricane Rev Posted April 19, 2011 Posted April 19, 2011 I would say her bad match ups are the following: Lambda 11 = Lamda can zone out Platinum easily which makes it hard for Platinum to get close to lambda. But I think once you get in, it should be come easier for Platinum. I would say 4.5 - 5.5 in Lambda favour. Ragna = He has more moves that has longer range than Platinum's move. Also, he can do a dragon even though you are presuring him. I would say 4.5 - 5.5 (If not, 4 - 6) in Ragna's favour. Hakumen = Hakumen's moves has got longer range than Platinum moves which makes it hard for Platinum to attack him in the air or ground. 4.5 - 5.5 in Hakumen favour Litchi = What Urichinan said about her Arakune = To be fully honest, I don't think that this is a bad match up. Arakune is mostly in the air and Platinum has got some really good anti air moves. All you have to think about and do in this match up is to look out for arakune's curse. I would say 4.5 - 5.5 in Ara favour
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