[CS2] Hazama Changes: Non-Theory Fighter Edition

[xlolxlolx]

^not sure since i took it from a jap wiki and they changed their J7/8/9D format to 7/8/9J8D but the char specifics listed are still the same as before, so do whatever buppa uses i guess lol

[Tetra - K]

From what I saw on buppa's video it's very different from the list.

Let's see if I can find the video I saw.

I will edit this post with video references.

Ragna -> J7 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJl-dziWSa0#t=12m37

Jin -> J7 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-eTo-YKMgE#t=5m22

Tsubaki -> J7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A9BpgG8ZW0#t=0m43

Makoto -> J7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A9BpgG8ZW0#t=4m08 (not a j.9D but it seems the way of doing it was right)

Hakumen -> J7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf5ZMWQuFi8#t=4m52 (with right spacing, may need a 5B instead of 6C in some situations)

Litchi -> j7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4msFSExinHk#t=10m34 (buppa dropped a combo, the world is gonna collide)

Can't find the buppa vs tager video anymore but I'm pretty sure it was a J8.

If someone find clues post it please ^^

Edited January 20, 2011 by Tetra - K

[xlolxlolx]

yeah like i said do w/e buppa uses lolz

[Sharakonta]

I'm gettin a 404 error on that first link....

[Nini Heart]

Chain level seems to have been increased.. I can't get 6D~A>J9D to connect out of FC in vanilla CS

[Lord Knight]

its not level, its speed

[Tibbz2]

New hazama looks really nice, any idea if Jayoku has more damage and how much?

[Zidane]

Since CS2 isn't officially out for the PS3/360 and since there's always a risk of shit getting changed or the PSP version not being arcade perfect, posting this here, real Hazama CS2 combos:

Ragna, Jin, Rachel, Arakune, Bang, Hakumen, Hazama, Lambda, Litchi, Taokaka, Noel, Mu, Makoto, Valk

1) 214D~C(1 and 2): 6C (66 optional) 5C(2) 2C(delay) 6DA 4DA jump back j7DA 623D jump forward j6DD 66 6C 66 2C jCx5 5C 623D OR jC x5 j214B

2) 214D~A(2, opponent must be crouching): Hotenjin 66 6C 66 5C(2) 2C(delay) 6DA 4DA jump back j7DA 623D jump forward j6DD 66 6C 66 2C jCx5 5C 623D OR jC x5 j214B

3) 6A / 6B into Hotenjin: 66 214D~C(2) 6C 66 5C(2) 2C(delay) 6DA 4DA jump back j7DA 623D jump forward j6DD 66 6C 66 2C jCx5 5C 623D OR jC x5 j214B

4) 2 or less NORMALS into Hotenjin: 66 214D~C(2) 6C 66 5C(2) 2C(delay) 6DA 4DA jump back j7DA 623D jump forward j6DD 66 6C 66 2C jCx5 5C 623D OR jC x5 j214B

5) 3 to 4 NORMALS if 5B/5C/2C starter into Hotenjin: 66 (additional 66 optional) 6C 66 5C(2) 2C(delay) 6DA 4DA jump back j7DA 623D jump forward j6DD 66 6C 66 2C jCx5 5C 623D OR jC x5 j214B

6) 3 or less NORMALS if 5A/2A/2B starter into Hotenjin: 66 (additional 66 optional) 6C 66 5C(2) 2C(delay) 6DA 4DA jump back j7DA 623D jump forward j6DD 66 6C 66 2C jCx5 5C 623D OR jC x5 j214B

EXCEPTIONS

Rachel: 1-6) JUMP BACK j6D

Arakune, Bang: 2, 4) Jump Neutral j7D

Bang: 6) Now works, delay 4DA and JUMP NEUTRAL j7D as much as possible

Hakumen: 4) Very short dash, Jump Neutral j7D 6) Possible but very hard to do, not recommended but still looking for another combo

Litchi: 6) Must walk forward after Hotenjin, dash 6C very close to them, delay 4D

Mu: 2, 6) 2C 5C(1) instead of 5C(2) 2C after 6C; still hard / impractical

Valk: 2, 4) 5C 2C works, need to use jump neutral j7D 5) Walk forward, dash 6C. Very short dash 5C 2C, jump neutral j7D. 6) 2C 5C(1), jump neutral j7D

NOTES:

Platinum has a gay hitbox and relaunchs are really random with her.

Carl can get to the point of j6D relaunch but 6C will never connect so you could do something like 5B jCx5 land 5C and then either 623D or SJ jCx5 j214B.

Tager I could only get relaunch combo on 214DC. All other methods the jump chain does not proc the extra hitstun.

Edited April 12, 2011 by Zidane

[Zidane]

So, new discovery guys. After doing all that I never actually tried to do combos off a raw Hotenjin. So I tried a few minutes ago and I can't get some of the combos I posted above to work. So I now I have to see if I can get anything to work or if I have to settle for bitch combos.

What a ass backwards shit fuck crappy stupid game.

EDIT: You could only do non-bitch combos on a FC Hotenjin.

THAT'S NOT ALL THOUGH

Raw Hotenjin combos do less damage than normal into Hotenjin

This game is Jokes™.

Edited April 7, 2011 by Zidane

[Zeron_X25]

What does a bitch combo mean?

[A.X.I.S.]

Zidane I am sorry to inform you of this:

After a quick search it seams Jayaku has 50p1.

This is why your bitch combo's don't work.

[Zidane]

No, my combos are manly

Bitch combos are non-relaunch combos

[Guymam]

For those of us who don't have the game, what kind of heat/damage we talking for these combos

[Zidane]

4-7K depending on starter and not including ending with 3C 632146C. So... 5 - 8.2K if ending with that super.

Any combo that involves Hotenjin you gain about 45 - 53ish meter back.

If you start a combo with 214DC(1 or 2) you gain 76 meter.

[Eclipse]

Zidane I am sorry to inform you of this:

After a quick search it seams Jayaku has 50p1.

This is why your bitch combo's don't work.

Wait, according to this 5A has better starting proration than Jayoku Houtenjin? Does this mean combos starting from 5A will actually do more damage than a combo starting from Jayoku? Assuming it's 5A > Jayoku?

Is that even possible? *I must be reading this frame data wrong*

[Guymam]

Wait, according to this 5A has better starting proration than Jayoku Houtenjin? Does this mean combos starting from 5A will actually do more damage than a combo starting from Jayoku? Assuming it's 5A > Jayoku?

Is that even possible? *I must be reading this frame data wrong*

See

What a ass backwards shit fuck crappy stupid game.

EDIT: You could only do non-bitch combos on a FC Hotenjin.

THAT'S NOT ALL THOUGH

Raw Hotenjin combos do less damage than normal into Hotenjin

This game is Jokes™.

Specifically what is bolded. Seems we can't rely on Hotenjin raw unless it's a guaranteed FC. What with IB being toned down I believe, that would relegate hotenjin as combo filler instead of reversal. Then again I suck so WHO KNOWS.

Edit: wait. 76 meter on a 214DC combo? What the fuck?

Edited April 12, 2011 by Guymam

[Eclipse]

I checked out the frame data for CS1 as well though, and 5A still had higher than Houtenjin, or something. Regardless, I use Jayoku in combos primarily anyways, since it's safer, and usually more intelligent, unless you're IB'ing. Which isn't as viable in CS2 or online. So whatever.

And you get 76 Meter off of 214D~C because you can relaunch them after 623D.

[Tong]

Hello there, just passing to ask why Hazama needs that chain recovery ~A buff

Cant think of a reason for that fellow Hazama players :<

[Guymam]

Because why not

[Zeron_X25]

It's what makes his new relaunch combos work. Faster canceling is better zoning.

[xlolxlolx]

im starting to think they're making him so fucking dumb on purpose....78 meter and 5.4k off a lvl 2 214DC....

[Tong]

It's what makes his new relaunch combos work. Faster canceling is better zoning.

And a sadder Tager.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-V0plKA8Z8

does he really need a better chain for better zoning? It was already good...

For new combos? I thought CS2 was aiming for less free-damage anywhere combos... Hazama is very threatening with 50 Heat, not to mention he can get all back in the same combo.

Im somewhat okay with that, but, the worse...6C has no same move proration, responsible for the aforementioned stuff.

[Eclipse]

Yeah, he's been buffed in many ways. But because he relies so much on heat and high risk starters, I think he was nerfed more than he was buffed. People can just burst out of any high damage combo he starts. Then he has to go back to using high-risk, high-reward moves. Maybe I'm underestimating his more technical aspects though. At the very least, he's harder to play now.

[Dusty]

IMO I like all the changes that Hazama got (except the 1 chain back on block, but i can't complain about that, i feel that it was needed with the buffs he got). I defiantly believe that he got buffed ALOT more than he got nerf'd. I think he's better in CS2, he has better chain zoning, once he gets 50 meter he's not playing CS2 anymore (His relaunch combo doesn't have to come from unsafe moves if you can hit confirm), he gets to do whatever he wants in a match due to chains and his buffed normals that were already really good (2A +1, 6B +3 jesus was this necessary?). Honestly Ark system works messed up on the balance of this character, 6C pinning to the ground and not having same move poration was a mistake, but hey they can't predict everything and everything can't be discovered in the loketests. Eventually there will be another patch and the tiers will most likely flip flop again. But for now Hazama isn't the best but is pretty broken. All in all I am happy because he's better, a minus is he's a bit more Auto pilot with his new normals, a plus he's a bit harder to play due to hit confirms and chain stock management.

I'm quite happy to main the man with the TOP HAT

[Zeron_X25]

No one in the NA that I've fought uses 6B anyways. lol

It's just a fucked up Jayoku.