[AC] Johnny vs Potemkin

qwerty · July 10, 2008

i was wondering how to make this matchup easier today and i think i may have found a solution. simple combo but it does a hell of a lot. LV3MFP -> j.K -> j.S -> dj.K -> j.S -> j.D -> Ensenga he actually falls pretty fast after LVL3MFP so setting up an enkasu after landing one is incredibly easy. ends up anywhere between 201-206 damage (assuming you land the whole level 3). as for actually landing a level 3, throw -> 214P usually works. he'll usually recover before the move finishes, so you can either dash back/defend, frc it, or just take the hit. eiither way, the mist still lands and now you have an ideal level 3 setup. it may not be the most practical setup ("hey PO player, can you let me throw two coins on you real quick?") but it's the easiest setup for insane damage i've been able to find. besides, anything that might make this matchup a bit easier is worth stating. also came up with another combo, although this is fairly impractical as it only works in the corner. 6P -> LVL1MFP -> j.K -> j.S -> dj.K -> j.S -> j.D -> Ensenga EDIT: forget what i said about the jump. it can be angled, you just need to be really quick on the j.K. it requires very strict timing and like i said, isn't too practical, but it doesn't require any tension or coins and does 116 damage, so it's not completely useless.

Mike Z · July 10, 2008

You can gold burst meaties, you just have the same 1 frame to do it as you have to backdash or VV etc.

4r5 · July 10, 2008

I guess it's back to training mode for me.

Just did it, you right. :thumbu:

i was wondering how to make this matchup easier today and i think i may have found a solution.

I agree, your combo does a good chunk of damage. And you are right, there is the matter of landing the first hit.

Your throw -> mist may work once or twice, if only because it's so unothadox. But if you do it, you better FRC every single time, and even then your still a neutral tech away from getting pot bustered. And by the way, you don't ever want to let Potemkin hit you. Getting hit by Potemkin is half way to losing the round.

On a diffrent note, it's not too hard to land 2 coins if that's what you really want it. Off a 2D, you can otg two coins. And there's many other ways to combo in two coins. Though you probably just want to stick to Lvl2's.

And now I'll quote myself for those who didn't read whatever thread I posted this in. It may enlighten some people.

I think you misunderstand the matchup. You don't want to get in on Potemkin. You, instead, want to keep him out.

You don't need to hurt Potemkin. You just need more health then him.

YanisDLooper · July 10, 2008

LV3MFP -> j.K -> j.S -> dj.K -> j.S -> j.D -> Ensenga

You can actually land a lot of MF off of characters if you 2D them.

Hit them with the first hit of the 2D then do LV3MFP and you should send them up with the combo. I don't remember if 2D prorates or anything though. And also as 4r5 said, you don't want to get to close to Pot incase of that Buster (or other nasties :gonk: ).

To make the distance I suppose you could throw a coin and dash in or even FRC 6K. Maybe even jump in (would not suggest at all :vbang: ).

But Johnny has quite a bit of movement tools at your disposal to use.

qwerty · July 10, 2008

You can actually land a lot of MF off of characters if you 2D them.
Hit them with the first hit of the 2D then do LV3MFP and you should send them up with the combo. I don't remember if 2D prorates or anything though. And also as 4r5 said, you don't want to get to close to Pot incase of that Buster (or other nasties ).

2D actually works perfectly. came out with 202 damage every time i tried it.

Though you probably just want to stick to Lvl2's.

quoting for emphasis. my level 3 setup isn't really practical enough to be a staple of the matchup (well, at least i don't think it is. maybe someone out there could prove me wrong) but if you have less health than PO and you already have a level 2, it may not be a bad idea to do a good ~200 points of damage, given you're able to pull it off.

nothing wrong with setting up a 13 hit enkasu from a level 2 (the more common and smart thing to do), but if you're in a situation where you have plenty of coins and no tension, a level 3 setup is worth giving a shot.

qwerty · July 31, 2008

just found this match of omito laying the smackdown on a good potemkin player. i think this video shows everything that johnny needs to win this matchup.

10stars · August 14, 2008

just found this match of omito laying the smackdown on a good potemkin player. i think this video shows everything that johnny needs to win this matchup.

I wish i was that damn fast... good to see that video though, TK ensengas arent 100% yet, but with how big potempkins hit box is it looks like the ones im doing are safe as long as they dont completely whiff.

Donutholes · September 11, 2008

Is there any way to poke Pot out of his slidehead? I was just going up against the cpu for a moment, and Johnny's 2p won't hit him. I swear, it's like a dp.

Chomite · September 11, 2008

^ it has 1-16, 26-35 above the knees invincibility lol. Just get close, block the low hit and punish Pot. or just IAD at him.

qwerty · September 12, 2008

i typically jump when i see a slidehead coming and then do an ensenga/divine blade on the way down.

render · September 12, 2008

shit that will stuff slidehead: 2S 2HS 2D There's a proper (and different) timing/distance for all of these, but they work. Coin will get you screwed (though if you survive the aftermath, you have a lvl2 MF). 5HS will also whiff unless you time it REALLY well and are the right distance. I, like qwerty, also often simply jump to avoid slidehead. If pot does 2 slideheads in a row, though, the 2nd one might catch you if you do an ensenga or divine blade on the way down. However! If pot times a slidehead to catch you when you're landing, good ways to hang in the air a little to avoid the slidehead are ensenga, divine blade, or air dash. Another excellent (I would venture to say VITAL) way to avoiding a slidehead is a well-timed ground dash. Back dash that shizzle! If you're not ready to unleash on pot with a sick combo (ie. you don't have the tension, mist finer levels, or the BALLS haha), then you'll probably want to backdash. But at the right distance, a well placed forward dash over slidehead can put you in an excellet position to TOTALLY RAEP.

Mike Z · September 12, 2008

render speaks the truth. My other piece of advice would be that slidehead avoids your super, so don't use it even in desperation since you will just get killed. You can IB->fwd dash if he does 6h->slidehead, and you get a free CH combo.

Donutholes · September 16, 2008

I see. It's just that every time I got near that cpu, I would do 2P 2D for a knockdown and it would just slidehead like it was ST Ryu doing a dp. @Chomite: Could you be a little more clear about the frame data? is the 1-16 total invincibility and 26-35 invincible above the knees, or are they both above the knees invincibility only?

4r5 · September 16, 2008

both are just above the knees

Kadius · September 18, 2008

So where is the sweet spot for this match up? The place where you can become a nearly unswattable fly. I'm thinking it's right outside his 5HS, since he cannot touch you with anything other than 6HS, hammerfall and slidehead. From this distance you can: -Slashback/Backdash*(*Not tested, yet) his 6HS, Dash in and 2D>Coin if he chains into slidehead -Dash in and 2D>Coin slidehead, for free, all day, every day. Or dash in, 2K, f.S, mist finer After testing out 2D's properties for another thread, I noticed just how bad an idea it is for Pot to do a uncombo'd slidehead in range of JO's Dash>2D or Dash>2K. It seems to me that it's possible to eat Potemkin alive this way. Am I missing something other than 6HS FRC>Slidehead?

SuperFX · October 10, 2008

the best place to hang out is right at IAD range, so that if he uses slidehead you get IAD jh ensenga for free damage. OR you get lucky CH into mf lvl 2 combo :keke: I really have to believe Pot isn't scary until he knocks you down (obvious I know); then it's a party for him and you are in deep. So if you can get KD in this match you can have your own rushdown party. a few things to remember: -Never be overzelous with MC and dashing in; you will get bustered, it's only a matter of time -air slash is good. Low IADs with js-> ensenga give you some much-needed damage and can really get a Pot player flustered and possibly doing something stupid. Using js as a poke is also great and generally unpunishable -be patient. Half the time I'm fighting Pot I'm on the other side of the screen, waiting for him to come to me. As he advances he will move into the ranges where you can punish his movement options. wait that shit out.

cefrancis88 · October 21, 2008

Is the range for Pot Buster one char space? I ask because sometimes when I'm a little bit inside that one char space range, his Pot Buster whiff. Then on the other hand, he is able to grab me. This confuses me.

4r5 · October 24, 2008

I try to stay 1 Potemkin away from Potemkin. That usually gives you more space then you really need, but better safe then sorry. Also be careful of what limps you stick out. If a PO whiffs PB that you think should of hit, then one of these things was happening when he tried to PB: 1. PO wasn't in range 2. You were dashing 3. You were backdashing 4. You were ODing 5. You were jumping 6. You were bursting 7. You were dead-angle-ing 8. You were in hit-stun 9. You were in block-stun 10. PO didn't wait 6 frames after your hit-stun 11. or PO didn't wait 5 frames after your block-stun

qwerty · October 31, 2008

during a match with a friend earlier he heavenly'd me during an iad. out of frustration, i mashed H. and so, today i learned that you can beat a heavenly pot buster with a properly positioned j.H. :psyduck:

Alternate275 · November 11, 2008

Is the range for Pot Buster one char space? I ask because sometimes when I'm a little bit inside that one char space range, his Pot Buster whiff. Then on the other hand, he is able to grab me. This confuses me.

The range is roughly 178 pixels horizontally. If you're within 178 pixels from Pots primary axis, then yeah, he can Pot Bust you.

If none of the above of what 4r5 was the situation at hand, then it's because you were 179+ pixels away.

just found this match of omito laying the smackdown on a good potemkin player. i think this video shows everything that johnny needs to win this matchup.

It's hard to fight when JO runs out of coins. But there's a lot to learn from Omito in this vid :v: