CrescentSaber Posted June 9, 2011 Posted June 9, 2011 Played a lot of Mu-12 vs Lambda lately and I have say that this matchup seems really tough for Mu. Zoning is pretty much out here. Lambda's swords shut down almost any attempt at placing steins normally. If you manage to score a knockdown then it's a good idea place one or two as close to Lambda as you can but you should only be placing them when it is safe to do so which is not often. 5C and j.C are also somewhat useful here. Since you can't beat Lambda at long range, you have to take the fight to her. Dash in 5C and IAD j.C can get you in if Lambda whiffs a sword and you can abuse 214C to try and break her primers. If you're quick and your timing is really good, you may be able to catch her with 6C depending on her position. Also your DP will beat her act parser if you time it just right. Aside from that, just block swords and keep your eyes open for any chance at all to get within 5C range.
Remius Posted June 11, 2011 Posted June 11, 2011 Arrows of Heaven will eat her swords. You're welcome.
bakahyl Posted June 12, 2011 Posted June 12, 2011 be sure not to get hit by 4d when using arrows to block 5d or 6d
SolarMisae Posted June 12, 2011 Posted June 12, 2011 What can Lam get off 4D without meter? Anyways Habaya killing D Swords = awesome.
C0R Posted June 12, 2011 Posted June 12, 2011 5a is godlike in this matchup, especially if they like to think crescent saber is legitimate mixup. 5c also straight beats all the attack dashes if used correctly. If lambda catches you jumping with a CH 4d I think she can headbutt you for good damage.
bakahyl Posted June 12, 2011 Posted June 12, 2011 5a is godlike in this matchup, especially if they like to think crescent saber is legitimate mixup. what do you by that? the lambda's that i played were using crescent as a wannabe mixup / anti-wake up tool against my mu at mid range. I can't punish that with 5a or were you thinking of a different scenario?
C0R Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 If Lambda does anything > tk crescent (feint), you can just jab her out for free before it comes out, even if they cancel.
CrescentSaber Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 If Lambda does anything > tk crescent (feint), you can just jab her out for free before it comes out, even if they cancel. Wow I didn't know that. I'll have to try that since I often just get stuck in Lambda's mixup and lose all of my primers.
pochp Posted June 21, 2011 Posted June 21, 2011 I often find myself in this situation: Lambda does (stuff) into 236B which I block. Then they jump back and do j.2DD 214D. Is there an efficient counter to this? I usually just block and lose a primer or try something that doesn't work and get hit out of it, so I'm feeling slightly free in the matchup atm. I will facepalm if the answer is 5A or habayaaaa.
C0R Posted June 21, 2011 Posted June 21, 2011 236b is -1, including jump startup the gap between 236 and j.2d is 18 frames. Dash 5c, Dash 2c, Dash 5b... Hell if you IB 236b you can 6c her like a boss.
SolarMisae Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 Lambda is...weird. I fought BeaverDeity's Lambda and got blown up, mostly because I had no clue wtf to do against her. I used to main her so I know she's weak in the up close/melee range so I figured rush her. Although I discovered it's not quite as easy as it sounds. Main question I guess, how do you get close to her with Mu? Whats Mu's best options for trying to approach if she gets pushed back to mid/fullscreen by D swords? Also her wheel oki is kind of annoying.
C0R Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 When I played that matchup I spent a good amount of time figuring out when and where he would throw out a drive, and once I felt comfortable, I fish with 6c. It sounds risky, but we can look at all the options that Lambda has in neutral that it beats. Spike Chaser All Drives Sickle Storm What it will NOT beat, and what eventually knocked me out of NCI vs PAIN, a lambda player, is Legacy Edge. Because the super is guarenteed after superflash, I woud repeatedly fatal counter him, but then be punished with a full corner combo on trade.
Aginor Posted September 12, 2011 Author Posted September 12, 2011 Against lambda's, I generally rushdown and get close. Pretty much play Mu like a rushdown character. hah. I found best way to approach is just run jump barrier. Then just look for the air throw. Any time you're not within range of like 2b or 5c just block. To me, that's time for you to IB anything lambda does and build meter. I should try fishing for 6c to see how well that goes.
SolarMisae Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 Pain's Lam is pretty good. But yeah I got hit by LE a a few times too. So should Mu basically be sorta...well "Hakumen" and just kinda be patient in this matchup, and look for openings between zoning phases? Lambda is such a weeeeird matchup. Or it feels weird, Mu's normal gameplan is flipped about by her lol. @Agi Yeah thats pretty much what I did, although i didn't do well enough. xD I'll probably being playing Beaver regularly from now on so I'll get a handle on it eventually I'm sure.
Aginor Posted September 12, 2011 Author Posted September 12, 2011 Yea...at least if you rush lambda down, you have to be patient. But once you get in, it's hard for lambda to get out. You just have to watch out for like wake up calamity sword. Beaver is very fond of that and doing that in your pressure. Like even zoners have to be patient. If the person rushing at me just blocked everything I threw, I'd get impatient because it's a matter of time before they corner me. And then once you're in the corner, you're kind of forced to do something otherwise you lose. But yea...be patient. As an idea to help you get better, you don't have to play this match up but if you were to play Tager vs any zoner, how would you win as Tager?
SolarMisae Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 The answer is easy, don't play Tager. :D But serious talk, thanks it's all pretty helpful~
Aginor Posted November 6, 2011 Author Posted November 6, 2011 Hmm...I played this match up again and I think it's actually fairly hard. Lambda pretty much covers the whole screen with swords and if you get hit once, you get carried to the corner and you eat a ridiculous mix up for at least 4k damage. :x And with the correct spacing Mu pretty much can't do anything? Don't quiote me on that because at a certain range, dead angle, DP, and 2b will whiff. Also midscreen 6c is good but you really have to call lambda out for like spike chaser or spinny wheel. If they do it within blockstrings...I just feel playing this match up is such a huge gamble with Mu. Maybe C0R can enlighten me on this? lol I lost to PAIN A LOT. I'm thinking I respect too much though because like he would crescent faint air dash j.c. 5a beats this?
SolarMisae Posted November 6, 2011 Posted November 6, 2011 I fight Beaver pretty much every week and I'll agree, I think it's in Lambda's favor. Closing in on her is hard. Best way to do it is jump in + barrier. Mu has to be really cautious. Lambda's 4D is something you really gotta watch out for. Get hit by that in the air and she'll 236C into big damage. Mu's lasers might go full screen, but they don't have a hitbox on activation like Lambda's swords. I'd say this matchup is difficult for the same reason Haz is, in the fact that it's risky to set stuff up. However if you can pin her in the corner you can win, it's just catching her that's hard. You have to be really patient and close in slowly. Only set up one stein at a time between her zoning phases. Use Habaya cause it'll cancel her swords and buy you some time.
Aginor Posted November 7, 2011 Author Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) Setting out steins isn't even worth it if I'm going to get CH'd. I might as well rushdown. The times I did win I RTSD like no tomorrow and just don't even give lambda a chance to do anything. When I did beat PAIN, it was very convincing. But other than that, lol.....need to learn the match up. Edited November 7, 2011 by Aginor
Remius Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 (edited) my main strat for this matchup is to simply try not to let Lambda get her way. If she's summoning crap left and right and getting away with it, then she's getting her way and it's probably only a matter of time before you finally find an opening with one red glowing explosive primer left and then you blow up and die. Arrows of Heaven, like with pretty much every other matchup, should give you time to put out at least ONE stein if she isn't doing the backwards spinny wheel thing. It's hard to rely on the lasers because blocking cancels them from firing. I'd say Lambda is definitely the better zoner here, since mu has to actually set crap up. Dont quote me, but im pretty sure her swords are incapable of hitting you from fullscreen. But getting to her is really the main issue here. 6C fishing pays out very well, but i dont rely on it because her shit is just too damn slow. I just feel this matchup is honestly a case of whoever gets the ball rolling first. Once you eat one of lambda's combos you're fair game for her annoying oki options, and likewise during a combo is the safest time to setup steins for Mu, which gives you time to lock her down with lasers. Either way, I feel like Mu's range is her greatest asset but is rendered utterly useless/risky in this situation. Try to get steins out near her so you can pop them / 236D when you need a breather. Edited November 8, 2011 by Remius
bakahyl Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 I think this matchup is being able to predict your opponent while at the same time not being too predictable yourself. Most of her drives leaves lambda wide open when whiffed and she has some frame disadvantage when her drives are blocked. 4d is easily stopped by rushing down because it tracks your last location, while her 5d leaves her open to jumps, 6d and 2d leaves her open to rushdown with 2b and if she does something in the air, you can cancel your dash with a barrier guard. I am not sure if lambda is punishable after she does drives or crescent saber while in the air, but i was able to get a hit on some lambda's that i played when they were landing. If you have lambda in your grasp, don't make the mistake to get hit by anything (most of lambda's normals are slower than Mu's eventhough they look the same). Which will result being knocked down or away and you have to chase her again.
Remius Posted November 29, 2011 Posted November 29, 2011 A bit more matchup exp... I find this matchup annoying mostly because trading with Lambda almost always ends in her favor. Trade with D, end up staggered. Trade with any of her specials, and you're on the ground or something. Trade with any of her SUPERS, and you're eating a combo + oki. She has alot of holes in all of her strings, but it feels like you have to literally fish and get lucky to make anything of it. ALL of her D's have blantant openings, but the consequences of guessing them wrong lands you in places you never want to be.
FACE CLAIMER Posted November 30, 2011 Posted November 30, 2011 from what i've played with both mu and lambchops, swords CAN hit fullscreen with 4d and 6d (4d has long recovery so you can place a stein if you are quick or you IB). the fight should (in higher levels of play) will be decided on maybe 1 counter hit as both characters have really painful counter hit combos. i know a decent lambda can get 4-5k off a CH 5d or CH 4d (note. 4d will require meter to combo off of). if you're looking to get a hit in first (which is crucial against lambda in this matchup) you need to get payoff on her sword recovery times. if she miss with her swords the recovery time is AWFUL and she will usually have to go defense right away. oh, and don't jump carelessly lol. XD
AchedSphinx Posted December 4, 2011 Posted December 4, 2011 from what i've played with both mu and lambchops, swords CAN hit fullscreen with 4d and 6d (4d has long recovery so you can place a stein if you are quick or you IB). the fight should (in higher levels of play) will be decided on maybe 1 counter hit as both characters have really painful counter hit combos. i know a decent lambda can get 4-5k off a CH 5d or CH 4d (note. 4d will require meter to combo off of). if you're looking to get a hit in first (which is crucial against lambda in this matchup) you need to get payoff on her sword recovery times. if she miss with her swords the recovery time is AWFUL and she will usually have to go defense right away. oh, and don't jump carelessly lol. XD 4D doesn't need meter to combo off it for Lambda. 4DD > 236C > etc, hits from almost full screen, and Mu's are quite susceptible to it because they enjoy being in the air. If a Mu wants to have reasonable success against Lambda they should try to keep the jumping to a limit and if they manage to keep her cornered don't let up. Lambda doesn't have a DP so it's fairly easy to lock her down. If Lambda rushes you down, which she will, be wary of her overhead mixups, which come in the form of 4B (2) (note, 4B second hit comes out almost instantly if done right so keep that in mind) and TK crescent, as well as any normal in the air. Even though Mu has a DP, be wary using it, in most cases it doesn't lead to much damage wise, however if Lambda punishes you for doing it, she can very well win the game. Things to watch out for would be 236C and 236B, especially 236C, so keep your barrier active if you decide to jump. Her CH D drives can lead into a good combo, CH 5D > 236C or CH 5C [1] > 236C, so watch doing slow moves or steins mid-screen. Her 2D can catch you if you decide to high jump, which she can follow up with 236C into a combo, if positioned correctly, so watch for that as well. Essentially, all her drive moves can lead into 236C if hit confirmed or CH, so try to make as little mistakes as possible. Well, that's about it as far as things I can think of at the moment. Mu is one of my better match-ups and I have a lot of experience against them, so this is just my opinion of the ones I've faced.
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