D_money01 Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 i really need help with this seeing as my friend run litchi and so far, this match up seems very discouraging. i try to fight her in the air ( seems like a bad to go about it ) i lose, i try to fight her on the ground it doesn't seem that much easier since her pokes are twice the range of tsubaki's 5b. i just really need an general overview from more experienced tsubaki players.
diospyros Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 One thing that's taught me about this matchup is NEVER EVER go toe to toe with litchi in the air. If she does attack you from the air, use 2c. Actually, be on the ground at all times. I haven't played many good litchis so i'll vent on the average ones. The average ones will try to fling their staff at you or dp you from a staff. It's when they're staffless, that you should probably rush them.
pktazn Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 You should still be careful when she's staffless though. She's better without her staff in CS2.
BatousaiJ Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 Fighting Litchi in the air is inadvisable. Her normals in the air are so superior to our own that often times it's better off going for air grabs instead of trying for a j.C or something when you expect to meet her in the air. The whole point of being aggressive against Litchi when she's staffless is that she has no DP or guard point option making it completely safe for you to be in her face doing whatever mix up you want when she doesn't have the staff. When she does though, be wary of her DP and try to bait it when you think they're going to pull it out and then after blocking go for a counter hit combo of your choice(5B > 6CC being the easiest to land). 2C works wonders against overconfident Litchi players who like to dominate the air game and given they like to set up their offense on approach by dropping their staff and etc, you should get ample opportunity to charge in this match up. Also, watch out for Litchi's overhead options, there are two you should especially be looking for(I don't know the command for them). One is the one where she uses her hand/hand + staff and the other is the one she kicks off of the staff. She has another when she's staffless but that was is particularly slow so it's easy to block. Her guard point when the staff is rotating around her will block mid and head moves but is vulnerable to low moves(2B works well) and throws. Litchi has a new move where she comes straight down and that hits mid for first and low for second hit. She drops down with her staff and the first hit can be guarded high or low but the second must be guarded low so remember that as many Litchi players like to use this as a easy way to cross over when they've got the staff. This match up really isn't nearly as bad as it used to be. Just get used to her blocking her gatlings, bait out that DP when you think it's coming, try to stay on the ground and make her pay for using her guardpoint with lows and throws.
Rhiya Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 Also, watch out for Litchi's overhead options, there are two you should especially be looking for(I don't know the command for them). 6A[m]/6A, 4D
Airk Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 Reinforcing what BattousaiJ said about taking to the air in this match - just don't, unless you're on the offense against a grounded, staffless Litchi (though it might be okay to jump-in barrier against Litchi with the staff, but watch for air throws.). In fact, really, there aren't many characters in the game that IS wise for Tsubaki to chase into the air. As for Litchi's overheads, I believe they are: 6A (Either with staff or without, though the frame data says 6A-staff can be blocked low, I think that's wrong); This is pretty quick, but doesn't have much range without the staff, and can actually miss if you're too CLOSE with the staff. I'm not sure how to read her gatlings table either, so not sure what the followup options are 4D (With staff only); This is the infamous 'pole dance overhead'; It's just as fast as 6A, has lower body invulnerability since she's 'airborne', has pretty good range, and sets the staff for use in followups. This one is dangerous, but seems like it leads into more advanced stuff. 623C (empty handed only); "Chun". A sortof flipping kick thing. This is far and away the slowest of her overheads, and should be comparatively easy to block. It's also fairly negative for her if blocked - at least enough for you to start a jab combo. It has a followup, but if I'm reading this right, she loses her option to do the followup the instant you get out of blockstun, so there shouldn't be room for any mixup to punish your attempted punishes. I expect Litchi players won't do the followup on block, because it just makes them more negative, but you never know.
TeeJay Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 Staffless 6a overhead can be followed by 6b. 6b counter hits a lot of things.
pktazn Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 6A according to the gatling chart can also go into 5C, 5D, and 2D without her staff. I don't know which ones they would use often (probably the one TeeJay said) but if you wanted to know what it goes into, there it is haha.
TeeJay Posted May 30, 2011 Posted May 30, 2011 6A according to the gatling chart can also go into 5C, 5D, and 2D without her staff. I don't know which ones they would use often (probably the one TeeJay said) but if you wanted to know what it goes into, there it is haha. I feel so dumb as a litchi player haha. 5c can counter hit too I guess. She has a lot of options.
iTz.WiiTarD Posted September 6, 2011 Posted September 6, 2011 i have had alot of time with this match up so ill share my thought, first of all her mix up and pressure is good, when she has her stick i suggest gaurding high, as her lows will do very little damage, without stick gaurd low, her lows are fast with good damage to follow, her overhead without is slow and able to block on reaction, i wouldnt iad on litchi for pressure, if she chooses to dp she can combo leading to 4-5k damage, her dp also hits behind her as well as pure straight, she still has options without stick (not sure which one) but one of the 3 dragons has godlike prioty, beats alot of stuff, her air game is crazy good but not unbeatable if she doesnt have stick, watch out for her openings and attack pressure win. rhead without is slow and able to block on reaction, i wouldnt iad on litchi for pressure, if she chooses to dp she can combo leading to 4-5k damage, her dp also hits behind her as well as pure straight, she still has options without stick (not sure which one) but one of the 3 dragons has godlike prioty, beats alot of stuff, her air game is crazy good but not unbeatable if she doesnt have stick, watch out for her openings and attack pressure win.
Kiba Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 first of all her mix up and pressure is good, when she has her stick i suggest gaurding high, as her lows will do very little damage, without stick gaurd low, her lows are fast with good damage to follow, her overhead without is slow and able to block on reaction, :/ You're better off reacting to the mixup rather than blocking on way. If you mainly block high, Litchi can do 3C - DP which will force you to block a whole load of other mixup, and especially if she has you in the corner you'll be forced to block thirteen orphans if she has the meter and if it's meaty. Just watch out for when she places the staff in her strings so you can attempt to get out of the pressure.
Airk Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 Any tips on avoiding the 4D poledance overhead? :P
TheGreatReptar Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 She can't really gatling into 4D from much. Just 2/5A, 5B and 5C. I just always prepare myself for 4D whenever she does those moves, especially 5B/5C.
Errol Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 If I'm not mistaken, aren't ALL of her overheads remarkably fast? 22 frames and BS like that, and no disadvantage
Airk Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 Yeah (Well, except for staffless 6A, which is like -13 if you don't gatling. :P ) but somehow, it seems like 4D is the one that gets me. x.x Probably because it has a lot more range than than staffless 6A, and staff 6A gatlings to nothing.
pktazn Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 I could block it on reaction just fine against a pretty good Litchi when I went to casuals Friday. Just know what it looks like when it's starting up and pay attention to where/when they tend to use it.
Airk Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 ....where/when they tend to use it. See, this is what I was sortof hoping people could provide, in general terms, because I probably have less than 10 matches against Litchi, ever. :P
TheGreatReptar Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 You can either go into 4D off 5B/5C, or off jab pressure. Always be ready for it off a 5C. I would say weaker players will generally do it off of 5B/5C and better players off jabs however, since if you do 4D off a jab, that's also an anti-grab setup, and it's less predictable. Also, watch Litchi's spacing whenever she uses 4D. It's -5, but because it has so many active frames, it can be up to +4.
Airk Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 You can either go into 4D off 5B/5C, or off jab pressure. Always be ready for it off a 5C. I would say weaker players will generally do it off of 5B/5C and better players off jabs however, since if you do 4D off a jab, that's also an anti-grab setup, and it's less predictable. Also, watch Litchi's spacing whenever she uses 4D. It's -5, but because it has so many active frames, it can be up to +4. I knew about the frame madness (though sometimes it's hard to resist pushing a button anyway, since it LOOKS like it should be punishable. x.x). But thank you for the other stuff - that's exactly what I was hoping for. Now to go look up what 5B and 5C LOOK like. x.x (This, my friends, is just how little I know about Litchi.)
pktazn Posted September 13, 2011 Posted September 13, 2011 Sorry I would have been specific but I don't know her strings lol. I just kinda reacted to them since he was really one of the first Litchis I was able to play against extensively. I'm hoping the more I go to casuals I'll be able to learn the moves and give some kind of ghetto write-up. I say ghetto because I'm not very good with technical info haha.
Recommended Posts