[CP] Rachel Alucard Gameplay Discussion

[kirbster]

The only character specific stuff I've seen so far is that we can use j.b as IOH on Hakumen and Tager, which actually makes a difference with the allowed combo time in this game. Also, I believe Hakumen, Litchi and Hazama's air hitboxes are still weird so using j.b > j.c > j.2d > land 6a to pick up a juggle seems very stable (instead of j.[c] > j.c > j.2d > land 6a). At least N-O uses it all the time against Haku.

But overall I'm very happy at how they fixed the stuff that didn't consistently hit everyone. Makes our life much easier!

[Sindelian]

Rachel boards definitely needs a "Tricks and Gimmicks" thread too.

[TD]

It is an excellent idea, but I looked through the rachel mixup/pressure thread, and most of her gimmicks seem to be there (granted, scattered throughout the thread...) perhaps someone can take some time and just update it sometime before cp. I might get on it because there's some really good tech in there.

Speaking of which, something has been coming up recently that you guys probably would do better defensively by practicing when the situation comes up. It could mean life or death vs some characters. Ill put it in the mixup thread.

[kirbster]

Yeah this would definitely be nice, my playstyle is too standard I find, not nearly enough gimmicks. Samthegreat did a few mixups on me a few weeks back that had me with my jaw on the floor lol

[TD]

I dunno, I still feel like she doesn't 'need' them as much because her standard stuff is really good. They're pretty neat though.

One thing I don't see in the thread: resets! I remember a few from previous games that still work, and I'm sure you guys have some new ones. I think I'll update the thread since its interesting.

[Zoular]

Regarding CH6B seeing as it's jump cancelable wouldn't some level lvl2/3 j.2C be more viable? I know IAD j.B works.

http://youtu.be/yUqwLmQzs-A?t=3m

That's just a quick example of a CH 6B on an air opponent

[Sindelian]

Regarding CH6B seeing as it's jump cancelable wouldn't some level lvl2/3 j.2C be more viable? I know IAD j.B works.

http://youtu.be/yUqwLmQzs-A?t=3m

That's just a quick example of a CH 6B on an air opponent

I don't think Lvl3 would work anymore. Can't the opponent tech half way through the bounce?

[TD]

In cp we now get a reliable roll punish combo that is unaided in summons and (almost) uninhibited by pumpkin:

2a 5b jc2d 5b 6a 236a 6a 4b 3c

For midscreen I assume it would be 2a 5b jc2d 5b 6a 236a dash 3c 214c dash (6a 4b dash) 5cc

I don't think the part in parentheses will work from an a starter. Maybe.

[gli]

So... frame data is coming in. I haven't been watching many videos lately but can someone confirm that 4B has Fatal Counter property?

[Zoular]

yes it Fatal Counters

[TD]

The new frame data would be sweet.

[Tari]

CP basic frame data is up on the wiki, now. It's a skeleton page, very under-construction. The current filled tables are down at the bottom of the page until I migrate the info to the new tables.

Only did the normals, will work on specials/DDs later.

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Frame_Data_(Rachel_BBCP)

There's some other information (move starter rating, SMP rating, etc.) that doesn't fit on the old table, as well, so that's not written in yet.

Notable changes (compared to previous frame data on wiki):

• 5A, 5B, 2A, 6B have 100 P1 now (most notable for 5B, as its P2 remains unchanged)
  
  
  
  • 2B damage buff (420 > 480)
    
    
    
    • 6A slower recovery (3 frames), longer untech time (4 frames)
      
      
      
      • 4B fatal counter property, special/overdrive cancellable
        
      • 4B damage nerf (800 > 680), but P1 buff (70 > 85)
        
      • 4B startup is faster (2 frames), active is longer (1 frame), air untech is way longer (19 > 53 frames w/ ground bounce)
        
        
        
        • Last hit of 3C (or 3[C]) is active for longer (2 > 5)
          
        • 3C startup faster (2 frames), air untech is longer (40 > 80), no longer neutral on block (now -1)
          
          
          

          • j.B P1 buff (80 > 90). Only mentioning this because its P2 nerf (86 > 85) is negligible.
            

          [*]j.C damage nerf (650 > 550)

          [*]j.2C P2 nerf, level dependent (lv1 89, lv2 92). Lv3 remains at 94 P2.

          [*]j.2C P1 is 90 at all levels (down from 100 at lv2/lv3).

          [*]j.2C (lvl2) dmg nerf (1200 > 880), longer untech time (2 frames)

          [*]j.2C (lvl3) dmg nerf (2000 > 1380)

          [*]ground throws ranges nerfed (from 100 to 70 units), air throw range unchanged (100 units)

          [*]ground throws P1 buff (90 > 100)

          [*]all throws P2 buff (100, 55 > 100, 60)

          [*]Counter Assault is 1 frame slower

          [*]Counter Assault has better frame advantage/disadvantage (-20 > -17)

          [*]Counter Assault has less air untech time (19 > 14)

          This is probably known already, by the way, but on air hit, Crush Trigger causes ground bounce and isn't emergency techable.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Tari

[TD]

NICE!!!!! Thank you so much.

[samthegreat]

Combo rate nerfed, eat shit arc system works.

Just kidding.

[gli]

Nice. 2B damage buff is sneaky.

[Minutes]

I demand cat chair be turned into a full reversal

[TD]

But then we'd be a p4 character. Boooo

[Herbal Grey]

cat chair is easily the worst reversal in the game. they need to just make it back to 3 frame start up. keep it hella risky. keep it low damage. idc. but at least make it mashable. you can still easily blow mashy rachels up anyway.

[samthegreat]

Yea I keep saying that. Instead of just nerfing the damage in CSEX they had to nerf the whole thing down to shit.

[Mucky]

ground throws ranges nerfed (from 100 to 70 units)

Wow. That's just silly.

[TD]

she is a little girl with normal sized limbs...

lol, l was just thinking about a spaghetti-limbed rachel, that'd be funny with those crazy platform shoes she wears.

[Mucky]

She already had the worst grab range in the game, lol. Just have Nago grab them or something.

[Errol]

I think all chars that can run have 70 range throws. step chars have 90. as a general rule.

[Mucky]

Perhaps my perspective is skewed from Tager's grabs all being enormous.

[samthegreat]

It doesn't seem to affect her much right now, but oh well..

On another note, N-O just got a gold ticket for Arc Revo Cup (it was time)! I'm not sure which region, somewhere in Osaka I think. Runner-up is Nukosu (Rachel), Zero got eliminated first round by N-O lol.