E's Laf

[Fujiwara]

Ta-da! Tae shits.

[Fujiwara]

[OutlawVinegar]

Hello, all (5) of you who play this game. I've been messing with it for a few weeks now after trying it out casually with some friends and finding it very enjoyable, so I decided to attempt to translate the Training Mode menu and options. There are a few specifics I'm still not clear on, mainly the particulars of the 'Damage Display' menu, and most of the 'Omake mode' options, but here's what I've got so far;

Training mode menu

Screen position (on reset): 1. Left corner. 2. Near left corner. 3. 'Match start' (Default)

4. Near right corner 5. Right corner

1P/2P positions: 1. 1P left, 2P right (Default)

2. 2P left, 1P right

Life gauge recovery: 1. No Recovery 2. Slow 3. ??? Gradual? 4. Instant 5. After 2 full seconds

Current life total: 1. MAX

2-5. 80%-20%

Stun gauge: 1. Normal 2. Reset to 0 bars 3. Reset to 1 bar 4. 2 bars

5. 3 bars 6. 3 1/2 bars 7. MAX

Gauge/Super Meter: 1. Normal 2. Reset to 0 bars 3. Reset to 1 bar 4. 2 bars

5. 3 bars 6. 4 bars 7. Permanent 4 bars

Guard gauge: 1. Normal 2. Reset to 0 bars 3. Reset to 1 bar 4. 2 bars

5. 3 bars 6. 4 bars 7. Permanent 4 bars

Pushblock: 1. Never

2. Always

3-22: After blocking 1-20 hits

Pushblock % chance: 1-10. 10-100% chance

Counter Boost: 1. Never

2. Always

3-22. After blocking 1-20 hits

Counter Boost % chance: 1-10. 10-100% chance

Command/Input Display: 1. OFF

2. ON (Last 10 inputs)

3. Last 15 inputs

4. Last 20 inputs

Damage Display ('Data' Display, really): 1. OFF 2. ON

Display Font Size: 1-5. 60-100%

Dummy control: 1. Dummy 2. 2P

Dummy state: 1. Standing 2. Crouching 3. Jumping

Guard: 1. Never

2. Block everything

3. Random

4. Alternating

5. Guard then Jump

6. Guard then Jump (only when grounded)

7. Overheads/Mids only

8. Guard High 100% + Block low 50% of the time

9. Mids/Lows only

10. Lows 100% + High 50%

11. ???

12. Alternate between high + low every hit?

13. ???

14-26. Stop blocking on the 2nd-15th hit

Throw break % chance: 1. Never 2-10. 10-100% chance

Midair tech: 1. Never 2. Forward 3. Neutral 4. Back 5. Random

Ground tech: 1. Never 2. Forward 3. Neutral 4. Back 5. Random

Counter Hit: 1. Not in CH state 2. First hit only 3. All hits CH 4. Random (First hit only)

Game Speed: 1. Normal 2. .5x speed 3. .25x speed 4. .10x speed

Hitbox Display: 1. Don't display 2. Hurtboxes only 3. Hitboxes only 4. Hit + Hurtboxes

Omake mode: 1. Disabled 2. Enabled

Options: Options menu (You can enable English by default here, so no translation from me)

Damage Display Setting (Everything in here is 1. OFF 2. ON):

Damage

Kyosei (forced?) Damage

Shogeki (first attack?) Damage

Combo hosei (compensation. scaling?)

kitei hosei (base compensation. Character combo rate?)

ruikei hosei (total compensation)

Damage efficiency (?)

Move startup frames

Move active frames

Move Recovery frames

Hitstop

Recovery (aka untech time)

Recovery (delay/postponement)

Recovery (special [moves?exceptions?])

Recovery (special power/strength)

Down

Knockback

Blockstun

Block type

Movement amount (Character weight?)

Falling time (???)

Gravity

Meter gain

Opponent meter gain

Distance (? How is this different than knockback? The distance the player travels?)

Attribute

Combo length in seconds

Character-specific Settings: 1. QDora Dragon Install - 1. Normal 2. Permanent

2. Caligula Pants - 1. Normal order 2. Nyoraimu (Hatlike creature) 3. Scythe (low-hitting projectile) 4. Chibi Caligula 5. Panties (Flying projectiles) 6. Fridge 7. Headless mannequin 8. Exploding Tanuki statue

3. Reviel % gauge - 1. Normal 2-5. Reset to 0-300%

4. QDora Lightning gauge - 1. Normal 2-20. Reset to 0-180%

5. Cletia bullets - 1. Normal 2-8. Reset to 0-6 bullets

6. Cletia partner gauge - 1. Normal 2-7. Reset to 0-5

Omake-specific Settings:

1P Character Size (Does not change hit/hurtboxes)

2P Character Size

Open All Cancel routes

Throw?

Down

__

__

__

Gauge __

Nokezori

Hitback?

Jump

Jump

Camera

Camera

__

Bound

Bound

Suberi

__

Mode

Return to Character Select

Command List

Return to Title

If anyone has extra translation info, corrections, or specific testing to include here, let me know and I'll add it. I don't entirely understand the differences between some of the 'Recovery' choices in Damage Display, for example.

I'd like to second the request that bellreisa add a Wiki for this game, as I've been trying to compile information and it would be nice to have a Mizuumi page to work on.

Edited September 29, 2013 by OutlawVinegar
Cleaned up the format, sort've

[Celerity]

bellreisa said we could get a Mizuumi page if we had like 3 people committed to working on it, but I was hesitant since I still have a lot of Chaos Code stuff to add. I should be able to at least complete pages for Serena and Qdora, though.

If you're on IRC, talk to him about it there.

[Falco252]

Well, I'm commited on working on it I think, didn't touch the wikia much lately but I hope this counts as being commited on it :

http://eslaf.wikia.com/wiki/Special:WikiActivity

Also I'm working on making hitbox sprites (tho making one for all active frame of every move will be nope, I'll limit to one per move unless they move a lot) for every char, didn't have much time to do stuff lately tho :/

Also thanks OutlawVinegar, some stuff hadn't been found before, so omake mode is to enable/disable the settings that messes the game?(The description said something like "let me handle the machine of limited training" = wat ?) I remember there is one for air dashes length / jump height too.

[OutlawVinegar]

http://wiki.mizuumi.net/w/E%27s_Laf

Alright, bellreisa's been generous enough to set up an E's Laf page for us, so let's try to get something going here! This is a game with some decent animation, character variety, and familiar mechanics for the airdasher crowd, plus it has netplay! There's no reason for it to remain so obscure.

Falco, if you can get hitbox sprites or decent-quality pictures, that will help us to make this a worthwhile resource.

Something I'd like to see done (but have no experience doing myself) would be having someone help figure out how some of the damage proration and such works, because I honestly don't get it. It kinda seems like hitstun is handled according to the first two hits in a combo?

[Falco252]

Yeah I saw, nice !

I started doing the SiscaA's page, here's what hitboxes and sprite dump looks like (I swear the 5A is accurate, it moves during the 3 frames for some reason)

http://wiki.mizuumi.net/w/E%27s_Laf/Sisca_A-Type

[Celerity]

Yeah I saw, nice !

I started doing the SiscaA's page, here's what hitboxes and sprite dump looks like (I swear the 5A is accurate, it moves during the 3 frames for some reason)

http://wiki.mizuumi.net/w/E%27s_Laf/Sisca_A-Type

You should upload the images to the wiki directly so that they can be embedded, but otherwise, great job!

I'll get to work on making sure my old info for this game is still accurate.

[OutlawVinegar]

I will be adding information to the title page over the course of this week. I'd like to at least be able to match the quality of the front page of the Wonderful World wiki, plus translating information from the official homepage and ideally providing some information on the games that Main, Sisca, Cletia, etc are from.

If anyone with equal or better Japanese knowledge than my own can help me with that, it would be appreciated! I've translated some move names, for instance, but part of me wants to know some background behind the characters before I attempt any localizations.

[Mengjun]

[...]

Something I'd like to see done (but have no experience doing myself) would be having someone help figure out how some of the damage proration and such works, because I honestly don't get it. It kinda seems like hitstun is handled according to the first two hits in a combo?

I've tried too, but only really managed to figure out how the minimum damage works. (I might add more info to that when I have the time.)

One of the things I've noticed about hitstun though, is that certain moves actually add hitstun to following moves. Cecil 5B(?) and 6D spring to mind. Especially for Cecil's 6D, the effect is very noticeable (look closely at the hitstun bar).

[Celerity]

I've tried too, but only really managed to figure out how the minimum damage works. (I might add more info to that when I have the time.)

One of the things I've noticed about hitstun though, is that certain moves actually add hitstun to following moves. Cecil 5B(?) and 6D spring to mind. Especially for Cecil's 6D, the effect is very noticeable (look closely at the hitstun bar).

I think the important thing to know about damage and hitstun scaling in E's Laf is that they don't appear to be dependent on the starter at all. Every attack has a set proration value that will affect subsequent damage in the the combo. Using the same move twice scales it even harder. Some attacks also have a guaranteed amount of unscaled damage that they will deal no matter what, with the remainder being prorated normally. It wouldn't surprise me if a few moves did carry initial proration values, but I haven't noticed.

Hitstun is still kind of a mystery to me, but it seems pretty flexible. I don't think there's any hitstun proration per se, and even stuff like fatals/criticals (Cecil 6D etc.) only affect hitstun for one move. The SMP system appears to lower a move's hitstun if you use it twice, but I don't think it carries over into the next move either.

[Lucalibur]

Heeey, I tried this game out a while ago but stopped for whatever reason. It was a surprisingly fun little thing with a decent cast, but I never quite got how some mechanisms worked. The combo system seems pretty flexible in general, and the game's pace is pretty nice. I 'play' Reviel but I dislike saying I play a character when my skill level at a game is so damn low. Anyone else playing him that could give some tips or whatever? Since his wiki page is not being worked on it yet I'm kind of stuck on the whole 'figuring stuff out' department.

[OutlawVinegar]

I'm messing with everybody for the most part (research purposes), and Reviel seems like a strong character; he's got decent health, a few good mid-range pokes, solid cancel options, and his unique 'spell charge' basically lets him do stance cancels whenever for pressure. His main problem is that he only has 2 lows that I know of (2B and 6C) and I believe his only overhead is 2C.

I'll pull some combo stuff from the JP wiki to add to mizuumi's, and I'll prioritize him after I've filled out some of Main's page. Right now I'm trying to record hitboxes for the unfilled character pages, but it's slow going because I haven't done it before.

[Celerity]

I'm messing with everybody for the most part (research purposes), and Reviel seems like a strong character; he's got decent health, a few good mid-range pokes, solid cancel options, and his unique 'spell charge' basically lets him do stance cancels whenever for pressure. His main problem is that he only has 2 lows that I know of (2B and 6C) and I believe his only overhead is 2C.

I'll pull some combo stuff from the JP wiki to add to mizuumi's, and I'll prioritize him after I've filled out some of Main's page. Right now I'm trying to record hitboxes for the unfilled character pages, but it's slow going because I haven't done it before.

Where is the JP wiki? I can translate some stuff.

[OutlawVinegar]

Where is the JP wiki? I can translate some stuff.

http://www45.atwiki.jp/feil/pages/14.html

There's a combos section as well, though my unfamiliarity/meh execution makes me unable to say if some combos are obsolete already or not. I can say I wasn't able to do Alcott's combos listed there though.

[Lucalibur]

I'm messing with everybody for the most part (research purposes), and Reviel seems like a strong character; he's got decent health, a few good mid-range pokes, solid cancel options, and his unique 'spell charge' basically lets him do stance cancels whenever for pressure. His main problem is that he only has 2 lows that I know of (2B and 6C) and I believe his only overhead is 2C.

I'll pull some combo stuff from the JP wiki to add to mizuumi's, and I'll prioritize him after I've filled out some of Main's page. Right now I'm trying to record hitboxes for the unfilled character pages, but it's slow going because I haven't done it before.

Ah, I see. So he seems to be a fundamental character with potentially good pressure but somewhat weak mixups. I had a hard time understanding each of his normals due to lack of frame data and not being able to understand the Japanese menu in training, so I probably missed out on a lot of stuff. I do remember his 214D(Flash kick thing I think?) prorating like a bitch, though. Any combo with it suddenly started doing minimum damage on everything.

[Celerity]

Ah, I see. So he seems to be a fundamental character with potentially good pressure but somewhat weak mixups. I had a hard time understanding each of his normals due to lack of frame data and not being able to understand the Japanese menu in training, so I probably missed out on a lot of stuff. I do remember his 214D(Flash kick thing I think?) prorating like a bitch, though. Any combo with it suddenly started doing minimum damage on everything.

Reviel was the character I was planning to look at next, since he and Caligula seem to be the least played right now. He always seemed like a weaker version of Main to me, but maybe I can find something. From what I remember, he's really good at inflicting guard break, and he can create frame traps with his stance cancels, so you might want to start there if you're looking for things to abuse.

[Lucalibur]

I actually tried those out earlier today after posting that. You can really extend his pressure and frame trap people with those, it's kind of scary actually. I haven't tested Main out yet but I don't think Reviel is a weaker version of him, only that he has more specialized tools. I think he has a lot of combo potential too, since a lot of his tools have some amazing untechable time going for them. They're not always accessible but it's still something worth noticing.

[Fujiwara]

JP consider him top tier. As in, right on top.

Dropping this here.

I have been lazing out on the Tae wiki. :< I'll get back to it, promise.

[Celerity]

Am I correct that guard direction is purely dependent on the opponent's location and not their attack's hitbox? I'm seeing a lot of things that look like they should cross up but don't.

[OutlawVinegar]

Isn't that how crossups normally work anyway? It's a question of where the collision boxes and their axes are, not where one shitbox meets another. :3

Got to play this game a bit more at casuals just now, and I was able to test a theory or two; this game appears to have AUB protection similar to P4U during blockstrings, and there is a strong deterrent to holding buttons during a blockstring to tech throws/put out an attack on the first frame out of blockstun.

Most grounded normals are Air Unblockable with some exceptions, but it appears that if someone is forced to block while airborne they'll be capable of blocking further attacks until they hit the ground (unless Guard Crushed, of course). In addition, though holding the C button for example allows you to Negative Edge a normal or reversal during the first few frames after leaving blockstun, doing so causes your Guard Bar to fill up at somewhere around double the normal rate. I intend on testing to see if Guard Bar rates are different between characters soon, because I've seen Qdora and Serena get Guard Crushed in less than two blockstrings in some of the videos I've watched.

[Celerity]

Isn't that how crossups normally work anyway? It's a question of where the collision boxes and their axes are, not where one shitbox meets another. :3

No...in most games, if you are in front of an opponent and use an attack that hits behind them, they have to hold forward to block it. From what I've seen, it seems like blocking in E's Laf is completely dependent on the location of the characters, so holding back will block no matter what. There also appears to be a short grace period while crossing over where you can block in either direction.

[toanenadiz]

What fighting games are like that?

[FerrellJ]

No...in most games, if you are in front of an opponent and use an attack that hits behind them, they have to hold forward to block it.

Unless I'm reading it wrong, I think you misunderstand crossups... In every fighting game I know, crossups are simply attacks that have hitbox behind the attacking character's axis, which can hit the opponent while jumping over them (or at least a hitbox that can hit the opponent after crossing axis).

Not sure about the grace period you describe though- that may exist. It's one of those things that, when I'm defending, I wish would exist but it would fundamentally change how both players approach wakeups if it were too long. If it is in E's Laf, it's short enough to not be that noticeable.

[Fujiwara]

Cross-ups are cross-ups in this game.

They depend on the Axis and the hitbox.

someone has to jump behind the axis to generate a cross-up move. In addition, the hitbox also has to be hitting behind that axis.

This considers your character on the other side, and thus you have to block that way. There's no holding any direction to block in this game.

It's all about whether the you/the opponent has moved behind the vertical axis that defines left/right facing and *then* then hitbox touching you on that side.

TL;DR - Character location defines cross-up.

More often than not, you'll be walking toward the opponent when they cross you up because I'm assuming, you're holding back to block an overhead. They cross you, your 4 turns into a 6, which moves you forward and you get hit.