XXXDC Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 4. Heat Knuckle blows the opponent away, no oki. (This is without Extend.) :gonk: Oh god why
Hecatom Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 And then people wonder there is this rumor that Pachi hate grapplers
Destin Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 There are like 4 grapplers in GG. Sol, may, pote, slayer?
HeatEXTEND Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 That flamepillar thing is going to be a DP that you can YRC for PB mixups I JUST KNOW IT
Circuitous Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 If the flame pillar isn't a DP I have no idea what use it'd be.
zdravkelja Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 There are like 4 grapplers in GG. Sol, may, pote, slayer? I wouldn't call them grapplers, they just have a command grab. Pot is the only true grappler in the game.
Hecatom Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 Was Pachi involved with AC/AC+R? No, but he was involved with BB from CT to CSII, notice how Tager improved on CSEX and CP There are like 4 grapplers in GG. Sol, may, pote, slayer? The fuck are you smoking?
HoudiniJr100 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 The fuck are you smoking? he's high on life... joke aside, I see where he comes from, since sol and slayer have a command grab...unsure if May has one, and we all know pot's the grapplertype. :P
Jocelot Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 I'd bet a lot of money Trishula is a DP. I guess there isn't any footage of it actually hitting, though right? Or any notes on it I'm forgetting?
BladeOfJustice7 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 There are like 4 grapplers in GG. Sol, may, pote, slayer? That would imply grapplers also include the likes of: Hazama, Terumi, Chipp, Bang, Kokonoe, Kagura, Eddie/Zato-1, and Valkenhayn among others are grapplers. Just because a character has a command grab, does not necessarily mean they fall into the archtype of a Grappler. None of those characters play into that archtype; slow, massive hitboxes, huge quantities of health, limited ground and air mobility in comparison to the rest of the cast, command grabs which usually have invincibility on startup that deal a lot of damage, among other common traits. So no, only Potemkin falls within the archtype of a grappler in Guilty Gear.
HoudiniJr100 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 That would imply grapplers also include the likes of: Hazama, Terumi, Chipp, Bang, Kokonoe, Kagura, Eddie/Zato-1, and Valkenhayn among others are grapplers. Just because a character has a command grab, does not necessarily mean they fall into the archtype of a Grappler. None of those characters play into that archtype; slow, massive hitboxes, huge quantities of health, limited ground and air mobility in comparison to the rest of the cast, command grabs which usually have invincibility on startup that deal a lot of damage, among other common traits. So no, only Potemkin falls within the archtype of a grappler in Guilty Gear. well said mr. coconut. Heck, don't forget persona, Kanj's the designated grappler, Narukami may have a command grab, he's not a grappler type.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 Yu has a command grab o_O?! I also had kanji in mind when writing that post, since Kanji has a lot of mobility compared to most grapplers in other fighitng games, but the rest of the cast in P4U has more mobility than him at the end of the day.
HoudiniJr100 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 Yu has a command grab o_O?! I also had kanji in mind when writing that post, since Kanji has a lot of mobility compared to most grapplers in other fighitng games, but the rest of the cast in P4U has more mobility than him at the end of the day. he does in ultimax :P but yeah, he's the more mobile of grapplers, but is still slower than the others in the cast
Destin Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 (edited) I was just talking about characters where a huge part of their gameplan was landing the command grab. Grapplers have ranged from say, the very immobile zangief, to considerably more nimble characters like Able, Clark, even Iori (version dependent)! I didn't include eddie or roboky because while their command grabs are good, they could realistically not have it and still be competent characters. Of course, Sol, May, Slayer all vary in how much their gameplan revolves around landing a throw (though you better believe in XX and #R Slayer was wearing people like a sock once he landed a command throw. After that landing a 6k became a much more important part of his gameplan and command throws took a backseat). With sol, a significant part of the gameplan is trying to force a situation where you land a command throw. Sometimes the matches end up very similar to your standard grappler character in many ways. Reload slayer was definitely landing a good deal of his pressure and hits because people were trying to stay out of command grab situations. I know the classic definition for the term, but I think it is somewhat antiquated in most modern fighters and will pull people who like throw characters away from some they might legitimately enjoy. I have shown gief and thawk players the likes of May and had them really enjoy her style of throw game. And her mixup really leans on the damage of her throw. I mean, would you consider Abel from SF4 a grappler, or would you require some alternate sub-genre character like "mobility grappler"? Edited December 13, 2013 by Destin
HoudiniJr100 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 sol's command grab is essentially "prepare your anus for the dustloop"
BladeOfJustice7 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 I was just talking about characters where a huge part of their gameplan was landing the command grab. Grapplers have ranged from say, the very immobile zangief, to considerably more nimble characters like Able, Clark, even Iori (version dependent)! I didn't include eddie or roboky because while their command grabs are good, they could realistically not have it and still be competent characters. Of course, Sol, May, Slayer all vary in how much their gameplan revolves around landing a throw (though you better believe in XX and #R Slayer was wearing people like a sock once he landed a command throw. After that landing a 6k became a much more important part of his gameplan and command throws took a backseat). With sol, a significant part of the gameplan is trying to force a situation where you land a command throw. Sometimes the matches end up very similar to your standard grappler character in many ways. Reload slayer was definitely landing a good deal of his pressure and hits because people were trying to stay out of command grab situations. I know the classic definition for the term, but I think it is somewhat antiquated in most modern fighters and will pull people who like throw characters away from some they might legitimately enjoy. I have shown gief and thawk players the likes of May and had them really enjoy her style of throw game. And her mixup really leans on the damage of her throw. I mean, would you consider Abel from SF4 a grappler, or would you require some alternate sub-genre character like "mobility grappler"? That's the difference, them having command grabs just adds to their pressure/mixup options, they don't necessarily depend on it. Blocking against a grappler has you thinking "oh shit is he going to go for a straight up command grab, or tick command grab?", Sol pressuring you just forces you to worry about him jacking up your guard bar and landing a random hit. He doesn't necessarily depend on it persay, same with all those characters I mentioned above. Robo-Ky isn't built around his command grab either, but having it makes his pressure stronger, it's the same with all non-grapplers.
Destin Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 (edited) That's the difference, them having command grabs just adds to their pressure/mixup options, they don't necessarily depend on it. Blocking against a grappler has you thinking "oh shit is he going to go for a straight up command grab, or tick command grab?", Sol pressuring you just forces you to worry about him jacking up your guard bar and landing a random hit. He doesn't necessarily depend on it persay, same with all those characters I mentioned above. Robo-Ky isn't built around his command grab either, but having it makes his pressure stronger, it's the same with all non-grapplers. When a Sol is rushing me down, pretty much all I am thinking about is how to avoid the command grab. Even if we were to take Slayer and May off the list, I would be hard pressed to see sol not falling in with at least the likes of Abel in SF4. His grab is VERY important to him. Hell, pote actually has better mixups than sol on a standing char. 6K is a serviceable overhead. Sol only gets anything decent on knockdown. I think if Sol didn't have his command grab, he wouldn't be a feasible character in this game. Edited December 13, 2013 by Destin
HoudiniJr100 Posted December 13, 2013 Posted December 13, 2013 well anyways, lets get back on topic...any new slayer notes?
king of heart Posted December 14, 2013 Posted December 14, 2013 (edited) The fuck are you smoking? I kept laughing for two hours because i am imagining Chipp saying that! When a Sol is rushing me down, pretty much all I am thinking about is how to avoid the command grab. Even if we were to take Slayer and May off the list, I would be hard pressed to see sol not falling in with at least the likes of Abel in SF4. His grab is VERY important to him. Hell, pote actually has better mixups than sol on a standing char. 6K is a serviceable overhead. Sol only gets anything decent on knockdown. I think if Sol didn't have his command grab, he wouldn't be a feasible character in this game. I knew that was SF4 player's mentality, Edited December 14, 2013 by king of heart
Notwhoyouthink Posted December 14, 2013 Posted December 14, 2013 Just because im taking the above comment of a SF4s mentality in a negative way. Id just like to say I do not consider Destin a SF4 player lol.
AKA Posted December 14, 2013 Posted December 14, 2013 Destin's super old school, but won't just come out and say it. His Dizzy in #R was sick. In any case, I agree with some of his character classifications (I've mentioned this to others myself in fact). Sol has a grappler style offense, but without the crazy grappler properties (his grab isn't invincible, etc), and May is the lovechild of Blanka and Zangief. Unconventional? Sure, it's GG. Potemkin is the obvious "grappler" character, but let's not pretend other characters don't rely on traditional grappler-inspired tactics to get their damage. Should probably stick to Xrd talk instead of discussion of nomenclature, imo.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted December 14, 2013 Posted December 14, 2013 Can Ky still perform the FRC CSE glitch with the new RC system in place? I completely forgot about this, since we lost FB CSE, so the only anti jump too we have in Xrd would be the CSE FRC glitch. I'm also curious which, if there are any, matchups that'll need to be played differently in Xrd, everyone seems to have received great tools to supplement their playstyles, but no one looks like they'll be played completely differently in this version of the game so far. I also watched Ogawa in #R because of how people were talking about Eddie in #R, holy shit that character was cheap...
Koozebanian Fazoob Posted December 14, 2013 Posted December 14, 2013 If the flame pillar isn't a DP I have no idea what use it'd be. Could also be ... - Anti-Air - Frame Advantage on Block - Big Chip Damage or Guard Meter builder - Just have a really fucking good hitbox and some combination of the above that lets you use it as oki - Combo Utility (launches, etc), maybe like 5K 2H Flame Pillar -> 5H Heat or something. No idea honestly. I've only seen it used like, twice in any videos so I can't even get a basic idea on its properties.
king of heart Posted December 14, 2013 Posted December 14, 2013 Just because im taking the above comment of a SF4s mentality in a negative way. Id just like to say I do not consider Destin a SF4 player lol. I just said that because it reminded me of one of my friends who got into fighting world with SF4 and he kept insisting that Bang is a grappler lol.
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