[CP] Kokonoe - Gameplay Discussion (Discuss Videos/Combos/Questions/etc.)

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

Might be a noobish question but What's the timming after 22b > 2c/5b in a combo??? Do i have to wait a little but or put in the input right away???

Something i'm trying to do it 3c ODC 6a 6c 8d activate (OD ends) 22b 2c > stuff but i she either stands there while i input 2c or she does it too late.

[tetora_desu]

Just delay the 2c till they fall close to the ground.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

alrighty, just in case, is there any other move i could use just in case im not confident enough to try it in a real match??? like 5b or 6a???

[Iron Savior]

and no fucks were given that day..

 

Something i got to work against an Azrael who ran away from me after 3c>22b was placing a 6d on him, you can do a variety of stuff from that, a quick test with Ragna reveals his Dp can get punished with activate if he backrolls, dps and you set a 6d, when the patch hits, you should be able to launch a fireball and get a free blockstring as far as im aware, its also a good way to bait Growler

 

What's giving you trouble vs Tager?, is it just Koko or do you have problems with him in general?, you might need to be more specific, but here are some things ive learned vs Tager

Most Tagers try to sledge trough fireballs, but sledge loses to 3c, most Tagers ive met also 360'd me after i used j.a low to the ground, a way i found to avoid this was backdashing afterwards, but i forgot to ever do it again after it worked the first time

Also, try not to use 2c in blockstrings, as it usually has gaps and Tager can 360 you out of it

[9:02 PM]

Does anyone know why sometimes when you activate j. 236 D after 6. D or 9. D in an air combo they will tech out immediately as opposed to getting put in that spinning air state and taking the full hit stun time?

[darklightjg1]

Same move prorate (if you used it earlier in a combo) is the only reason I can think of.

 

Quick question: does anyone know what the minimum damage is for version  1.1 236C into her new Greed Climb super?

[BananaKun]

Same move prorate (if you used it earlier in a combo) is the only reason I can think of.

 

Quick question: does anyone know what the minimum damage is for version  1.1 236C into her new Greed Climb super?

 

No clue about 236C itself, but the super adds 1000 minimum damage, 1375 if overdrive.

[Iron Savior]

I saw Tetsuwo doing this (corner)combo in a 1.1 video the other day
5c>3c>236a>rc>6c>j.C>j.d>j.236d l>[6a]>22b>5b>5c(22b hits)>[6a]>5c>236b>5c>22b
does 4686

I sadly forgot what video i took it from

 

Here are some Tetsuwo CH combos that came from the first minute of this vid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GceBbNdhPjQ

 

CH5b>2c>6c>j.C>j.D>j.C>j.236D>[6a]>22b>5b>5c(22b hits)>[6a]>5c>236b>5c>22b
Does 4566, gives 33 heat

CH 5c>2c>6c>j.C>j.D>j.C>j.236D>[6a]>22b>5b>5c(22b hits)>[6a]>5c>236b>5c>236c
does 6154, gives 37 heat, so it needs 13 heat to go in to super

[Kurushii]

I saw Tetsuwo doing this (corner)combo in a 1.1 video the other day

5c>3c>236a>rc>6c>j.C>j.d>j.236d l>[6a]>22b>5b>5c(22b hits)>[6a]>5c>236b>5c>22b

does 4686

I sadly forgot what video i took it from

 

Here are some Tetsuwo CH combos that came from the first minute of this vid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GceBbNdhPjQ

 

CH5b>2c>6c>j.C>j.D>j.C>j.236D>[6a]>22b>5b>5c(22b hits)>[6a]>5c>236b>5c>22b

Does 4566, gives 33 heat

CH 5c>2c>6c>j.C>j.D>j.C>j.236D>[6a]>22b>5b>5c(22b hits)>[6a]>5c>236b>5c>236c

does 6154, gives 37 heat, so it needs 13 heat to go in to super

Those are combos have been around since v1.0. Also the last one requires 14 heat start, not 13.

In other news I added a changelog thread, and updated the v1.1 combo thread.

[Poultrygeist]

Quick question.

 

I've been playing with this black hole set up (as seen in BK's vid): 6B 236B 5B 6A jumpback 5B(1) 5C 9D 236D 5C 22A 5C 214A blackhole

 

I have to sleep and I don't have time to check, but if you start with a throw instead of 6B does it drop?  I've been told it does but I haven't tried to test.

[Diveman]

I'm checking the 1.1 combo section and there's way too many, do I need to learn them all or are some of them variations?

[Iron Savior]

I'm checking the 1.1 combo section and there's way too many, do I need to learn them all or are some of them variations?

 

 

Combos not done on crouchers or with good starters are really simple, just do 5b>5c>3c>236a and you get 2k

 

For everything else, you have 2c, so i suggest learning a 2c combo, seeing where you can use it, and learning another combo if there is a situation you can't do it in

 

I'd say you need a far 2c combo(these usually go into 5d), a close 2c combo(these usually go into 6c), a corner variation of both of those, and air/anti air combo(and those are really simple and also work as enders), and throw combos

 

For example, if someone falls into your 22b trap, you can use 2c>6c if they are on the ground, and j.B if they are on the air

 

I am currently learning the new combos myself, if you like i can tell you which ones i found useful

 

I have a question of my own, what's the best thing you can do off 22b?, my 1.0 combo doesn't work anymore, i'm using 22b(gorund hit)>2c>6c>j.b>j.c>j.6d>j.236d l>run up 6b

The combo works fine until that point, but i can't do 6b>22a>6b, do you have to do an ender after the first 6b?

[djesiret]

Armament No.8

 - ?

 - This

http://tinyurl.com/mju2ky4

 

Some players are so tiger, they won't care about the heat tax.  I kinda see the balance here, but I still wish they would have at least requested a 63214c followup for execution.  I don't mind Kok doing the 1671 and giving the player the option to burn or save.  Just seems a bit much from a mere 236c.  I thought I was in stylish and went back to character select to make sure after testing.

[Kurushii]

I have a question of my own, what's the best thing you can do off 22b?, my 1.0 combo doesn't work anymore, i'm using 22b(gorund hit)>2c>6c>j.b>j.c>j.6d>j.236d l>run up 6b

The combo works fine until that point, but i can't do 6b>22a>6b, do you have to do an ender after the first 6b?

Midscreen:

22B , 2C > 6C > jc > j.B(2) > j.C > j.6/9D > j.236D |> 66 > 6B(2) > 236B , 5C > 236C [3980/28%]

Corner:

22B , 6(2) > 5C > 2C > 6C > jc > j.C > j.D > j.236D |> 6B(2) > 236B , 5C > 236C [4118/29%]

Edit: Made a video for a different route http://youtu.be/m8UkQaB74Uc

[Pyro_The_Kidd]

so i'm trying to learn kokonoe what are some of the basic strategies/combos/reversals i should know?

[Iron Savior]

 

so i'm trying to learn kokonoe what are some of the basic strategies/combos/reversals i should know?

 

 

The most basic combo off them all is 5b>5c>3c>236a, it does about 2k, it works off everything in the ground, you can add 6a>5b after the first 5b if your opponent is standing

Like i said above, learn a 2c combo, an air combo, and throw combos and you should be ok

 

Strategy is where you can get creative, first of all, learn what your normals do

6a is an amazing anti-air, you can charge it, and you can confirms it into an air combo, 3c is a godly poke/footsie tool, just be careful since it can be easily avoided by jumping, 5c has very good range, and on CH it staggers, giving you plenty of time to follow up into a combo, 2c is + on block, fatal counters, and is very good as a frame trap, just be careful using it against people with good reversals, j.b and j.a are both good air normals, i don't know if j.b remains a good air poke with the nerfs to it, but it was in 1.0, and j.a is very fast, the first few hits are overheads, it has a lot of active frames(that you can extend by holding down the button), and can cancel from and into j.b, if you do  j.b>j.a close to the ground you can mess with your opponent since j.a is an overhead

 

That is what came to my mind at first, but just read her dustloop wiki page, and you should get an idea

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Kokonoe_(BBCP)

 

Your drive is also very useful, it attracts stuff in the stage to its location, and you can do many antics with it, you can place it anywhere on the screen with a direction+d, http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/images/3/3e/BBCP_Kokonoe_5D.png

 

By doing 236d with one out, it will drastically change the gravity to the opposite of what it was, in other words it sends stuff flying, depending on your spacing after activating one, many things can happen, for example, if your opponent was between you and the gravitron, they will end up in your face,with a one way ticket to an all you can eat mixup buffet, for some strange reason, most people don't block here, but some have hit me out of it by poking after the activation, so be careful

 

Your drive also attracts your 214a/b/c fireballs, something fun you can do is baiting your opponent with fireballs, i like launching one, them placing a 5d(gravitron next to you), you'd be surprised by the amount of people that hang themselves in this scenario by running into your fireball, if they don't run at you, you can send it forwards with 6d(forward graviton), and get a free blockstring or combo if it hits

 

You can also activate the gravitron to send the fireball flying, if you are lucky, it will hit your opponent, and its really satisfying whenever it happens

The fireball game is particularly interesting with Azrael, you can launch a fireball into a trajectory where it won't hit him to bait Growiler and make the Azrael feel really stupid

 

You also have an invulnerable teleport you activate with 22, due to the command, it is immune to cross ups, you can use it to go trough very obvious distortion drives, like when an Azrael tries to use Black Hawk Stinger with both weak points, and Koko has some really strong counter combos, so you are getting some juicy damage off that

If you have a gravitron placed, your teleport will move you to its location

You can use this to escape from the corner if your opponent is far away, place a 6d(forward gravitron), and react depending on what your opponent does, most try to chase you, and you can teleport to the gravitron, or do some fireball antics

 

You can also set traps on the field with 22b, they detonate whenever someone gets close, do some decent damage, and you can combo afterwards for about 3k-4k

These have many uses, you can use them after a knockdown midscreen with 3c, and be amazed at how many people hang themselves in this scenario too, you can jump and barrier to bait dps since it detonates whenever they get up, place a 6d(forward gravitron) if you think they will backroll and do some fireball antics, again you can get creative

Something to note is that if you hit someone with 2c while a trap is set, the following combo will do massive damge

You can also activate a gravitron to launch your opponent towards your trap like Tetsuwo does in this video

http://youtu.be/aJ4uie_-3To?t=25m50s

 

I don't really know what else to say, so here, have some combos

Remember, you can go into 2c if your opponent is crouching, and on CH on most b and c normals, 3c>22a>2c works on 3c CH, 2c can also combo after 22b, Kurushii posted some combos for that above

 

Midscreen

2C > 6C > jc > j.B(2) > j.C > j.6/9D > j.236D |> 66 > 6B(2) > 22A , 6B(2) > 236B

This one works off 22b, and close 2c hits 

 

2C > 5D > 5B > 5C > 236D , 6[A] > 22B , 5A > 5B > 6C > jc > j.B(2) > j.C > j.6/9D > j.236D |> 236B

Even tho the guide says close 2c, this one worked with far 2c in 1.0, if you can't time the 236b at the end, place a gravitron in a direction of your choice and launch a fireball, and i haven't tested if this one works off 22b, but if a 22b hits you should be able to run up and do the close one 

 

6B(2) > 5C > 2C > 5D > 5B > 5C > 236D , 6[A] > 22B , 5A > 5B , 6C > jc > j.C > j.9D > j.236D |> 236B

Same thing as the combo above, if you can't time the 236b at the end, you can.....

 

[AA] 6A > jc > j.B(2) > jc > j.B(2) > j.C > j.6/9D > j.236D |> 66 > 6B(2) > 22A , 6B(2) > 236B

This one also works from j.B

 

forward throw>8d, 2C>6C>jc>j.C>j.236D l>6B(2)>236B

This one does less damage than the ones on the combo page, but i find it easier to do

 

Backwards throw>7d>6c>j.8d>j.236d>l 6b(2)> 22a> 6b(2)> 236b

Same thing for this one, i just couldn't do the ones on the combo page, and the 7d is supposed to go away from your opponent

 

Noth that you can replace 6b>236b for 6b>236c if you want more damage on some combos

 

Corner

 

c.2C > 6C > jc > j.C > j.D> j.C > j.236D |> [6A]>22b,  5B > 5C , 6[A] , 5C > 236B , 5C > 236C

 

2C > 5D > 5B > 236D , 6C > jc > j.C > j.D > j.236D |> 6B(2) > 236B , 5C > 236C

If you can't time the 236c at the end , like me, it will hit anyone who techs without a barrier, you can also use 22b for oki

 

Corner forward throw>9d, 5c > 2c> 6c> jc>j.C>j.236d l>6b>236b>5c>236c

 

Corner backwards throw>9d >sjc > j.B(2) >jc >j.b(2)>j.C>j.236d l> 6b(2)> 236b> 5c> 236c

Input the 9d towards the corner

 

For corner combos, you can replace any 5c> 236c enders(which are focused on damage), with 5c>22b enders, which are better for oki

 

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

I found something interesting (might be impractical to use or just for style in CMV)

If you have the gravity probe our and do 236c with 50 meter, after the missile hits the gravity pulls them to it (like always) and you can do activate > stuff.

 

i.e 5b 5c 3c a super ball 5d 236c missile hits > activate 6b b bunker

that's just an example and 100 meter can be used for a more damaging combo but i thought it was interesting and could be useful, if not, oh wells.

[Pen_Ninja]

I found something interesting (might be impractical to use or just for style in CMV)

If you have the gravity probe our and do 236c with 50 meter, after the missile hits the gravity pulls them to it (like always) and you can do activate > stuff.

 

i.e 5b 5c 3c a super ball 5d 236c missile hits > activate 6b b bunker

that's just an example and 100 meter can be used for a more damaging combo but i thought it was interesting and could be useful, if not, oh wells.

 

Using graviton to pull them down after/during greed climb is actually part of one of the challenge mode combos.

5D > 236C > 5C is in there somewhere.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

really o.o Didn't check out challenge mode yet >~< didn't know that. Alrighty, thanks for the heads up.

[Speakeasy]

Is it just me, or does Kokonoe seem easier to use now? I can't take her mind but I'm having an easier time of learning her in 1.1.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[darklightjg1]

 If you're just talking about picking her up, I don't think she was that hard to learn in the first place. If you mean starting with her in CP and then playing her post-patch, it depends on what you were comfortable with doing imo. It's a mixed bag for me:

 

-Getting used to doing j.2C less will take a minute for me.

-6B > New Stuff isn't that hard to get used to/learn as they're generally just the old crouch-only combos.

-Less advantage on 236A means I need to change my post knockdown habits, or even do a different knockdown all together.

-Corner combos are more or less the same.

-Auto-Super is 1000 unscaled damage, so it's easy to decide when you want to use it as an ender or not.

-Fishing for counter hit combos are still easy too.

-214A/B/C is a little harder to use.

 

Things that didn't affect me as much (because I intentionally avoided doing it in version 1.0):

 

-I never learned the common inescapable black hole setup(s) (the one(s) that wouldn't work post-patch), because I didn't want to develop it as a habit in order to make the transition easier after the patch. Not sure what the damage cap is now after black hole, they seem to tech out of the combo I used to do (unoptimized... it was just easy).

Is it still a lot of damage? How much less damage is it? What about heat gain? I'll probably learn the new setup, I just don't remember where I saw it.

-I also barely went for instant j.5C because I knew that was getting taken out as well.

-Lastly, I barely used Activate to poke in neutral because of the patch notes, so that change doesn't affect me as much either. 'Working on using it to push people where I want them more now (like into traps).

[Mirasantika]

Anyone know the optimal combo from black hole when the opponnent hit by fire ball before getting hit by the blackhole?

I mean after the set up that involve ~xxxx jc j9d j236d land 22b 5c 214a 5c blackhole, if the opponent choose to late tech and roll forward they will get hit by fire ball before got hit by the blackhole

 

What I got so far is a very short combo dealing less than 2k lol, need to find a better combo

[Dangaboy]

Anyone know the optimal combo from black hole when the opponnent hit by fire ball before getting hit by the blackhole?

I mean after the set up that involve ~xxxx jc j9d j236d land 22b 5c 214a 5c blackhole, if the opponent choose to late tech and roll forward they will get hit by fire ball before got hit by the blackhole

 

What I got so far is a very short combo dealing less than 2k lol, need to find a better combo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0xqsSKcA_Y&index=49&list=PLJLXQZJXTQDysAd8ADGf5266YSjzPSaTS

[Poultrygeist]

 If you're just talking about picking her up, I don't think she was that hard to learn in the first place. If you mean starting with her in CP and then playing her post-patch, it depends on what you were comfortable with doing imo. It's a mixed bag for me:

 

-Getting used to doing j.2C less will take a minute for me.

-6B > New Stuff isn't that hard to get used to/learn as they're generally just the old crouch-only combos.

-Less advantage on 236A means I need to change my post knockdown habits, or even do a different knockdown all together.

-Corner combos are more or less the same.

-Auto-Super is 1000 unscaled damage, so it's easy to decide when you want to use it as an ender or not.

-Fishing for counter hit combos are still easy too.

-214A/B/C is a little harder to use.

 

Things that didn't affect me as much (because I intentionally avoided doing it in version 1.0):

 

-I never learned the common inescapable black hole setup(s) (the one(s) that wouldn't work post-patch), because I didn't want to develop it as a habit in order to make the transition easier after the patch. Not sure what the damage cap is now after black hole, they seem to tech out of the combo I used to do (unoptimized... it was just easy).

Is it still a lot of damage? How much less damage is it? What about heat gain? I'll probably learn the new setup, I just don't remember where I saw it.

-I also barely went for instant j.5C because I knew that was getting taken out as well.

-Lastly, I barely used Activate to poke in neutral because of the patch notes, so that change doesn't affect me as much either. 'Working on using it to push people where I want them more now (like into traps).

You can actually still use the old black hole setups if you don't mind parting with burst for the OD version.  You can even do it at full life.

 

What gets me the most is the removed gatlings, ESPECIALLY the ones into 6B.  Now I have to actually commit to blockstrings and respect my opponent's defense.  Thanks Obama.

[Mirasantika]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0xqsSKcA_Y&index=49&list=PLJLXQZJXTQDysAd8ADGf5266YSjzPSaTS

 

Oh wow fully charged 6b after a dash will net bounce damage? Gonna try this out, thanks!