[CP] Azrael - Gameplay Discussion v.2 (Discuss Videos/Combos/Questions/etc.)

[Yuhoke]

-Growler has much shorter recovery. Not punishable at all on hit. Can still be charged.

Adding to this, you get a Phalanx every time you perform a Growler, even if it whiffs.

[Lucalibur]

Oh, that is cool. I didn't notice that because I always have my Phalanx stocks maxed out on training, haha.

[Verimeloni]

Finally beat all challenges for Azrael, 28 was the hardest in my opinion. I guess it's just me that j.C > 214D connects once in 100 tries.

I'd better not even try U. Az out even if I ever unlock him, it would just mess up my training with links xd

-6C is weird now. Has 2 hits. First one floats, second one downs(slowly). I'm having a hard time following it up at all. Groundbounces on FC and can follow up with no problems there.

I'm guessing it's like Sol's Bandit Revolver with the two hits and FC is Bandit Stinger. Hornet Chaser is practically same as Dust so, yeah. Edited November 26, 2013 by Verimeloni

[Lucalibur]

Yeah, it definitely feels like Sol's Bandit Revolver. Since we're on about it, you can go into 6C from practically all normals since the startup is MUCH faster now(due to the new first hit). Same for 3C which has no more delay required...He can go into gigantic combos off of anything now thanks to all of that. Kind of hard to properly get oki because his Ds are all into constant weakpoint state now, though. It seems 2D is the go to oki tool in U form because of the hard knockdown, since everything else will just bounce the enemy and they may air tech or something.

[Ice Cube]

Azrael's oki after midscreen ground TCL:

* Dash > 2A/2C

Blue beat setup to train opponent to not delay their tech, so all the delicious oki setups can be used.

* Dash > jump cancel > j.B

This is a safe jump setup, will work even against Kagura's 8-frame DP. The jump cancel must comes out before Azrael disappear from the screen (the teleport effect), else it will not work.

It's possible to change the j.B to any other aerial normal (except j.2C). j.2D has a wicked long startup, which makes a good DP bait.

After blocking the DP, punish with 5D or 5C, depending on weakpoint applied.

Loses to Yukikaze, 720, and some other stuff that I can't think of.

* Dash > jump cancel > early j.C (whiff) > land 2A (low) > 2B

Once they start respecting your safe jump. The jump cancel timing remains the same.

* Dash > jump cancel > land 2A (low) > 2B

Similar to the above setup.

* Dash > jump cancel > IAD j.A j.B (overhead)

After landing a low, do this to piss people off royally.

* Dash > stand and wait/walk forward > 5B/2A/5A.

Standard meaty oki. Has some advantage over safe jump, as your opponent can roll backward freely out of safe jump, where as they will be more scared of blue beat combo this way.

Do your 5B early, gives more than +3 easily. Safe and good against characters without reversal.

Your meaty 5A has a one-frame execution window to be safe against Kagura's 8-frame DP, 2-frame window against Ragna's, etc. Of course you can sacrifice the meaty and throw it out early to bait DP. Against DPs with more than 10 frames of startup, this is actually pretty reliable (Bullet's, Azrael's, Jin with <25 heat, etc.)

Whiff 5A > 5B catches Kokonoe teleporting.

Whiff 5A > Gustaf will punish Azrael's backdash.

2A is good against Noel and Carl with <50 heat, whose meterless reversal is beaten by low attacks.

* Dash > stand and wait > dash TCL/5A

Standard cross-up stuff. You can time your dash correctly and to dash through 2A mashing for confirmed hit.

* Dash > 2A > dash TCL/5A

The auto-pilot option to mix-up after tech punish. May or may not get beaten by mashing, it's pretty random depending on timing.

* Dash > dash > jump cancel back j.B/j.2D

Cross-up to fake cross-up setup. Somewhat safe against DPs without auto-correct. Tager's 2C beats this. Some 5A with good hitbox can beat this as well (e.g. Hazama's)

[Kinkuli]

You can also do something like

TCL - super jump forward j2D. This one should safe jump and also tag rolls. When your opponent starts to respect this you can start doing IAD jA jB for high and empty jump 2A for low. This is easier to see however than the ones ice Cube posted i think. But it's something to keep in mind.

Ps. Nice finds, gonna steal those right away!

[Verimeloni]

It's a shame most of Azrael's cross-up -okis can be mashed out of.

If you're fighting against a DP-happy opponent and you land ground TCL, I found these to be quite useful:

* Dash real close, as soon as they get up (tech effect ends, if they roll just walk closer) > dash cross-up, their DP whiffs, free CH combo (3D +++).

or to really tip them off:

* (TCL) > Gustaf (whiffs), they get up > dash cross-up, CH 3D

I tested this with Ragna's 623D/C, Jin's 623C and Tsubaki's 623C, no complaints except that Jin's DP has a rather wide hit box so your cross-up timing has to be just right plus you have to right next to them, with that it's safer to do 2C from max distance.

[Natsu]

Well, I've decided I should learn some easy Valiant Charger combos, not too complicated.

I've decided to go with 5C>236A>RC>236D>... the rest doesn't matter, but from some reason I can't connect 236A>RC>236D correctly, I'm doing it the fastest I can.

I've tried on Ranga [as in the video]

[LegendaryRath]

Well, I've decided I should learn some easy Valiant Charger combos, not too complicated.

I've decided to go with 5C>236A>RC>236D>... the rest doesn't matter, but from some reason I can't connect 236A>RC>236D correctly, I'm doing it the fastest I can.

I've tried on Ranga [as in the video]

If you are using 5C as a punish, you don't need to do 236A. Just do 5C > 236D and save the meter.

[zeth07]

Well, I've decided I should learn some easy Valiant Charger combos, not too complicated.

I've decided to go with 5C>236A>RC>236D>... the rest doesn't matter, but from some reason I can't connect 236A>RC>236D correctly, I'm doing it the fastest I can.

I've tried on Ranga [as in the video]

Not really sure what to tell you, there's a ton of hitstun to do the move since you RC it and there's no trick or anything. It's literally exactly as it looks. Not even sure what could give you trouble......

[Lucalibur]

Shameless propaganda aside, I am going back to U Azrael for a second to say I found out(as shown in the video) that Scud has positive proration as well. Not bonus proration, actual higher than 100 P2. Double scud combos are absolutely disgusting so long it was not off from a 5A\2A starter.

[Verimeloni]

Shameless propaganda aside, I am going back to U Azrael for a second to say I found out(as shown in the video) that Scud has positive proration as well. Not bonus proration, actual higher than 100 P2. Double scud combos are absolutely disgusting so long it was not off from a 5A\2A starter.

Totally loving this sh*t xD I got to try U. Az out when I was playing Abyss level 10, it's a shame Turn Unlimited -boost can't be bought from the store and you lose it when you lose/finish the level you're playing. It was nice to go totally haywire and do 22.9k combos with the Abyss stat boosts, still can't beat U. Tager in Unlimited Mars though xP

[Lucalibur]

Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous lol. I kind of wish normal Azrael OD Scud had similar properties to make it slightly more useful(Imagine the combo potential from a simple 5B>OD>5B>Scud>Stuff combo if Scud had more stagger and better P2?), but alas. I'm also a total bastard and tried coming up with normal Scud off FC combos. Follow ups doing 50 damage or less? No problem, do full combo anyway. Not practical at all though, unlike OD Scud combos which work off a somewhat decent P2(But still could be better like I mentioned), but burning a Burst and 50% meter for those doesn't sound that great.

[zeth07]

For future use I just made the Critique Thread for people asking for help getting better.

http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?18615-CP-Azrael-Critique-Thread

The only reason I did not make it sooner was because I wanted players to actually have more time with the game before they try to give other people advice, but I guess we're getting to that point now that it's been a while.

Not sure if I can properly move the posts since it goes by the time posted, if I can't I'll just repost/edit the posts and go from there.

So if you're reading this about looking for advice, please check the new critique thread.

EDIT: Alright the posts were moved around and edited as needed. Again please check HERE for the Critique Thread and personal help going forward ---> http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?18615-CP-Azrael-Critique-Thread

Thanks.

Edited December 1, 2013 by zeth07

[LordSpectreX]

Can't really find out, so sorry if this info is accessible somewhere, but what does;

1-10GP(A) for Sentinel Crush mean? Cause it doesnt seem to have GP on the first frame, but if A means Active, but I've had it block during the startup before.

And how do you read 10(Active-7)GP Does it mean 17 frames of GP + how much you hold it for? I'm confused. Thanks.

[Natsu]

Any BnB combo that start with 236A? I see Dogura uses 236A a lot as hit confirm, but most of the time I can't really connect it to a combo

[natearistata]

Maybe able to confirm on crouching, not 100% sure it's not possible, but afaik it's counter-hit only without rapid cancel.

[Kriegdrache]

Any BnB combo that start with 236A? I see Dogura uses 236A a lot as hit confirm, but most of the time I can't really connect it to a combo

Like nate said, I think you can only combo off it for free on CH, but I usually just go into 5B > TCL or 5B > 2C > drive, depending on wut the situation is like.

[Kinkuli]

So i'm not sure if this is already been discussed earlier but here i go anyways.

I've noticed while lurking in dogura's stream that he's been doing corner stuff like something > 236D > 6 5C > 6 6C > 6 jC > 5B > delay 6A > IAD jD -> 2D whiff 5A. I briefly tried it out in the training mode and it seems that by doing this you can tag opponents who don't wanna wakeup and get free LW and if they wakeup you still meaty them with 5A.

But im getting somewhat mixed results while testing this. Sometimes 5A trades with mash, sometimes not. I think it has to do with the height where you land the jD so you can do the followup. Also timing seems to be somewhat hard.

Can anyone else help me test this if this is not tested already? So far i have been able to beat out 6f and 7F jabs but 5F ones seems to beat the setup. Loses to fast reversals like ID.

[LegendaryRath]

So i'm not sure if this is already been discussed earlier but here i go anyways.

I've noticed while lurking in dogura's stream that he's been doing corner stuff like something > 236D > 6 5C > 6 6C > 6 jC > 5B > delay 6A > IAD jD -> 2D whiff 5A. I briefly tried it out in the training mode and it seems that by doing this you can tag opponents who don't wanna wakeup and get free LW and if they wakeup you still meaty them with 5A.

But im getting somewhat mixed results while testing this. Sometimes 5A trades with mash, sometimes not. I think it has to do with the height where you land the jD so you can do the followup. Also timing seems to be somewhat hard.

Can anyone else help me test this if this is not tested already? So far i have been able to beat out 6f and 7F jabs but 5F ones seems to beat the setup. Loses to fast reversals like ID.

I'll work on it sometime tonight.

Could you link me to Dogura's stream so I can keep an eye on it? I had no idea he did that.

[zeth07]

I'll work on it sometime tonight.

Could you link me to Dogura's stream so I can keep an eye on it? I had no idea he did that.

Coincidentally he's streaming right now, lol:

http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv161332795?ref=community

[AMB Bakery]

He's been doing IAD j.D > 2D at the end of valiant combos since after arc revo iirc. I'm not sure how useful it will be depending on who you play, though. My opponents have emergency tech'd after valiant combos 100% of the time, but it's nice if that supposedly sets up meaty. I found you can get j.D > 2D to work on both forward and neutral jump.

[Kinkuli]

Coincidentally he's streaming right now, lol:

http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv161332795?ref=community

He also updates the info on twitter, so you can follow @maneater_dgr for stream links.

@AMB Bakery: Yeah the usefulness probably varies depending on the opponents. I've had a lot of opponents who techs instantly and a lot who likes to stay down. The setup itself feels a bit wonky at the moment for me, need to do it perfectly or else you eat 2A/5A mash =/. I'm 100% sure you can atleast beat 7F jabs but i'm still not 100% sure about 6F and 5F ones. It also feels character specific so there's that also (I'm personally a huge fan of universal stuff!).

[Natsu]

Is it possible to do Aeriel with j2D? like jB jC j2D

[Verimeloni]

Is it possible to do Aeriel with j2D? like jB jC j2D

Of course you can, though you have to ensure you're as high in the air as your opponent since j.2D hits lower than j.5D. You have to realize that for basic damaging combos you want your opponent to have [uW] on them, as [LW] is more of a mixup-tool when it's not used like [uW], for ex 2C > 3D > rekkas or ending aerial with j.2D to continue with rekkas or another aerial.