[LM] Konoha

[Tigre]

 

Introduction

Welcome to the Konoha thread! Please discuss character strategy, combos, Arcana synergy, match-ups, and other relevant topics here. Please also feel free to post up any questions you may have about the character as well.

 

Konoha Wiki Page

 

Notable Players

Tokibito

Rottytops

Motte

[Ghost Cobra]

Trying to play her online, getting bopped.

[Frostbolt]

Its a sad life

[destruction_adv]

I want to play this character, but I need to import the game first.

[Numakie]

Been using Time Konoha since AH3. Being that Time 6H & Extend works differently then most Arcana, I took the extra effort to learn her no meter combos which involves learning her 6C~Kara~214A/B/C. I feel it has benefited greatly, since I can just use my meter for defensive maneuvers or movement and not care much. 

 

I like her even more now with the system changes. A nice change that i am trying incorporate more is using her 623-C~A to launch opponents since there is more leeway it seems.  Something i'm trying to get used to is her 28C~2A~A (DP Cancel to her going into the ground, then shooting the blow dart). Her critical heart is not stupid anymore (too bad).  214A/B/C follow ups 5B and 2B work differently. Her 6C follow up doesn't connect anymore, Overall though, still hella fun to play. 

 

I can probably answer a few questions here and there about Konoha. She does take some work due to her stubby limbs, but she has a great deal of tools to play with, even without using arcana. Just hang in there. 

[Chris Chaos]

I've decided to play the character because she's fun but I have little to no idea where to start. What are a few good BnB's for Konoha that I should know for Konoha?

[Frostbolt]

ok, this is MY OPINION as always since everything I say seems to be very...disagreeable?

2a2b5c 623b 236AB <--- This is the best thing to start with

Air comboes, do jB jBE. jB is jump cancellable so jAB jB is fine

Thats all for basics tbh, take those comboes and play the game abit, once you are used to the game, then come back.

[.ShotS]

ok, this is MY OPINION as always since everything I say seems to be very...disagreeable?

2a2b5c 623b 236AB <--- This is the best thing to start with

Air comboes, do jB jBE. jB is jump cancellable so jAB jB is fine

Thats all for basics tbh, take those comboes and play the game abit, once you are used to the game, then come back.

2A 2B 5C 623C~A 5A 5B 6B air ender. Gotta do the C~A pretty fast so the 623C whiffs and the A followup comes out.

 

This route is pretty good now imo and a good meterless option.

[destruction_adv]

So I'm importing this game and was wondering some of the better choices for Konoha arcana.

 

EDIT: Konoha best waifu, thank you good night.

[Numakie]

Here is a few more BNBs to start.

 

Uses 1 meter (2 if you use 236AB). Works with all arcana except Time and Earth.

2A 2B 2C 6D* 5B 6B j.B dj.BE (360A) - j.E ender will land the opponent right next to you when you land. (360 ender optional if you want a bit more damage)

2A 2B 2C 6D* 5B 6B j.B dj.BC 360A/B/C (or 236AB*) - Same combo with an alternate ender. (Replace 360 with 236AB for a bit more damage at the cost of 1 additional meter)

2A 2B 2C 6D* 5B 6B j.ABC 214A/B/C B dj.BE (360A) - optimal air combo string. Uses j.214 to extend the combo. (360 ender optional)

2A 2B 2C 6D* 5B 6B j.ABC 214A/B/C B dj.BC 360A/B/C (or 236AB*) - Same optimal combo with an alt. ender. (Replace 360 with 236AB for a bit more damage at the cost of 1 additional meter)

*Uses 1 meter bar.

 

Extend Force Cancel (EFC) Combos. Works with all arcana except Time and Earth. (Activate EFC with A+B+C)

2A 2B 2C EFC 5B 6B j.B dj.BEC 5B 6B j.B "dj.BC 360A/B/C" or "dj.BE" - This is the combo i started with.

 

No Meter/EFC starters.

2A 2B 5C 623C~A 5A 5B 6B ~ Air Combo ~ (Thanks Dots) - Learn it. Use that meter for better things.

2A 2B 2C "6C~Kara~214A/B/C" BC "Land" ~ Air Combo ~ - Intermediate combo starter. Requires learning her 6C Kara to 214

 

And just cuz

TIme only EFC Combos

2A 2B 5C 623A/B EFC (623A)x6 236AB - Fun and simple.

2A 2B 5C 623A/B EFC (66 5B 6C 623A)x3 236AB - Requires dashing in & linking after 623A.

2a 2b 5c 623A/b EFC 66 5BC 8~9E Land 66 5B2C 214E - Uses Konoha's "Small Hop". Ends with knockdown to time ball oki.

 

Guess that's plenty for now.

[.ShotS]

Here is a few more BNBs to start.

 

*combos*

 

Guess that's plenty for now.

For all the 2C 6HC stuff, you should be able to put in 623B~A 6HC for extra damage(ha. konoha and damage). The meterless combo I put up is also kinda weird in/near the corner due to how corner pushback works in AH3.

[Frostbolt]

ABC Super for life

So I'm importing this game and was wondering some of the better choices for Konoha arcana.

 

EDIT: Konoha best waifu, thank you good night.

Wind is the main arcana used with her, you can use alot of arcanas with her though

[Numakie]

Some Arcana choices and the reasons that i am aware of. 

 

Flower: You can't get counterhit.. Also 236236E is a decent follow up after j360A. Also, you can plant flowers that can potentially buff your stats. 

Wind. Triple Jump. Fast Fall. 6HC = Push blocking instead of Clash Barrier. Annoying projectiles. Damage output is lower. Health is also lower.

Time: Time specific combos are fun. Backdash a legit reversal. "Small jump" pressure stronger in Extend mode.  Can't 6HC normally in combos. 

[Ghost Cobra]

really feeling wind atm

Like mentioned doing her meterless combos really helps wind with pushblock and fast fall when you need it. I'm at about 70% rate on 6C~Kara~214A/B/C so should have this down by next week.

 

I'm interested in things like is it worth to jump cancel her 5B now into 214x E or whatever for pressure on block fishing for crouches cause doing short jump with wind is a little harder cause gotta up 3 times.

Also what is better for air neutral approach regular D or slower controlled 4D or 6D J.A B or C. I know characters anti-air DP and options play a part but i'm starting like 4D,j.B in air and D, j.B only during a oki or when I jump over opponent and backdash into it.

i dunno

[Numakie]

... is it worth to jump cancel her 5B now into 214x E or whatever for pressure on block fishing for crouches cause doing short jump with wind is a little harder cause gotta up 3 times.

 

Jump canceling out of 5B,2B,etc. is good regardless. Players with meter may/will 4/6D in at the earliest opportunity if your ground blockstring is too long or predictable, or if there is a glaring opening. I personally like using 8>9>E in my blockstrings alot, mainly cuz the j'E hitbox is really beefy.

 

Also what is better for air neutral approach regular D or slower controlled 4D or 6D J.A B or C.

Here is a quick visual guide on the various types of homing i created real quick. http://youtu.be/1btOomodEgY

 

IMO. You will mostly want to use j.5D homing to dash straight in. Otherwise, use regular jumps and kunai to properly space & use homing as a 3rd jump option. 4D can mostly be used to avoid unblockables or guard breaks, or to give you some space to throw a kunai. 6D would only be used when no more air movement options are left, or for Clash Shield, or, in your case, push block.

[Pen_Ninja]

I recommend that anyone running Time Konoha really grind out the 2C > 6C~j.214X kara-cancel. The lack of forward homing dash options really hurt your combos off jump-ins since you don't have the 623C~A > 6D option you would otherwise.

 

I find time Konoha to be a great idea in LM since they removed the 623B~6C knockdown that ended pretty much every combo. These days I'll do 623A > 236236E to freeze them, then 2C to knockdown and put down a 2[E] or 5[E] to force stand. From there, back dash and delayed 5D gives you a nice high/low 50/50 with more options on block and hit.

 

5D > land > 2B > 2C > 6C~j.214X > etc
5D > 8j.B > j.E > etc

8j.B in this situation is an IOH that hits every character (to my knowledge) even when crouching (like an IOH tends to do...)

 

from here you still have options...

 

2B:

- 2B > 9j > 9dj.E: short-hop into cross-up overhead j.E

- 2B > (5C) > j.5H > j.B: pressure reset, more on this later

- 2B > (66)throw: 2B is -2 on block but you have cancel options after it so it makes a decent throw mixup if you don't use it often

 

The issue with these is is that other than the middle one, you can't really confirm if 2B hit or got blocked. That's the risk you take I guess.

 

j.B:

- j.B > j.E > 2B > etc: combos and stuff... 

- j.B > delayed j.E(whiff) > 2B: fake double overhead into low

- j.B > delayed j.E(whiff) > throw: this one's dirty :P

- j.B > j.E > j.214X > j.C > 2B > etc: a 3rd overhead that comes out fairly quick. This rarely gets blocked in my experience

- j.B > j.E > j.214X > j.E > 2B: like the one above but more hitstun and compliments the one below

- j.B > small delay j.E > j.214X > j.E(whiff) > 2B: like the 2nd one, fake overhead into low. Same moves as the one above but j.214X is done lower. Can throw instead of 2B

- j.B > 9dj.E: the j.E here crosses up, even in the corner

- j.B > 8dj.E: as above but no crossup. You can do j.214X stuff after this

- j.B > wait > 5B > 5C: best in the corner but works mid-screen in some cases. this crosses over opponents so 5B hits on the other side

 

j.B gives you so many options :O

 

5C > j.5H > j.B:

As above, good to reset pressure, you can go ahead and not j.B and go straight into 2B instead for a low, otherwise, you can do pretty much all of the j.214X related things above. No double jumping this j.B though because it hits too low.

 

Mixups are fun

[Numakie]

I recommend that anyone running Time Konoha really grind out the 2C > 6C~j.214X kara-cancel. The lack of forward homing dash options really hurt your combos off jump-ins since you don't have the 623C~A > 6D option you would otherwise.

Agreed.

 

 ...Konoha ... LM ...removed... 623B~6C knockdown... (as a time combo ender.) . ...I'll do 623A > 236236E to freeze them, then 2C to knockdown and put down a 2[E] or 5[E] to force stand.

 

From there, back dash and delayed 5D gives you a nice high/low 50/50 with more options on block and hit.

(Options after delayed 5D)

... > land > 2B > 2C > 6C~j.214X > etc

... > 8j.B* > j.E > etc

*8j.B in this situation is an IOH (instant overhead) that hits every character (to my knowledge), even when crouching. (like an IOH tends to do...)

 

From here you still have options... can follow up with the following...

 

2B:

- 2B > 9j 8j > 9dj.E: Short-hop into cross-up overhead j.E

- 2B > (5C) > j.5H > j.B: Pressure reset, more on this later

- 2B > (66)throw: 2B is -2 on block but you have cancel options after it so it makes a decent throw mixup if you don't use it often

 

(The issue with these is is that other than the middle one, you can't really confirm if 2B hit or got blocked. That's the risk you take I guess.

 

j.B:

- j.B > j.E > 2B > etc: Combos and stuff... 

- j.B > delayed j.E(whiff) > 2B:  Fake double overhead into low

- j.B > delayed j.E(whiff) > throw:  This one's dirty :P

- j.B > j.E > j.214X > j.C > 2B > etc:  A 3rd overhead that comes out fairly quick. This rarely gets blocked in my experience

- j.B > j.E > j.214X > j.E > 2B:  Like the one above but more hitstun and compliments the one below

- j.B > small delay j.E > j.214X > j.E(whiff) > 2B:  Like the 2nd one, fake overhead into low. Same moves as the one above but j.214X is done lower. Can throw instead of 2B

- j.B > 9dj.E:  The j.E here crosses up, even in the corner

- j.B > 8dj.E: As above but no crossup. You can do j.214X stuff after this

- j.B > wait > 5B > 5C: Best in the corner but works mid-screen in some cases. this crosses over opponents so 5B hits on the other side

- 5C > j.5H > j.B: As above, good to reset pressure, you can go ahead and not j.B and go straight into 2B instead for a low, otherwise, you can do pretty much all of the j.214X related things above. No double jumping this j.B though because it hits too low.

 

Mixups are fun

 

This post is a mixup... @.@ (tried to edit for clarity)

 

Nevertheless,  the mixups post "after time freeze stuff" could be used with other Arcana as well.

 

As for Time, you could also 236E (Time Ball) after 3C for some post no meter oki.

 

Another thing to consider is if the opponent is blocking as Time Arcana, there is the option to EFC and short hop High/Low pressure, since Konoha falls freakin fast.

Ex1: ...>EFC>66>5BC>8~9E>... : Overhead option.

Ex2: ...>EFC>66>5BC>8~9>Land 2B>... : Low option

 

There is lots of room to be creative.

[Frostbolt]

I have been playing Konoha for 2 years and I still do not know what the fuck I am reading

[Numakie]

Mix-up stuff is hard to explain without a video to show it. Took me a freakin hour to decipher that wall of text, but there is some good stuff in there. 

 

I'll probably make some short vids that show these mixup options, similar to how i did the Homing vid... Other things i might consider doing is... How to short hop...or  j214 tricks...

 

In the meantime... here is Konoha stuff from Vanilla AH3. http://youtu.be/pjxvF03DJZw

[Frostbolt]

Thing is she can do generally most of the stuff off anything. If you were to put down every little thing she COULD do, we would be here for ages

I got loads of tech as well but sharing is just...long, must have like 20 options off every button

[destruction_adv]

Thing is she can do generally most of the stuff off anything. If you were to put down every little thing she COULD do, we would be here for ages

I got loads of tech as well but sharing is just...long, must have like 20 options off every button

And thats why i ove this character

[Pen_Ninja]

Did you really re-do my post to capitalise the start of my sentences? :P

I was kind of just rambling on about stuff on my lunch break at work.

That change from 9j.E to 8j.E is correct though. Silly me.

 

I'll probably make some sort of video for all of these. I feel like they're fairly practical, just hard to explain.

 

I'm fairly new to the game though so there's much to learn.

 

On that note, people talk about 3C... it appears on the mizuumi wiki under frame data but not the move list and it just looks like 2C to me... Are there any differences between 2C and 3C?

[Tigre]

Do not go off the Mizuumi frame data. That frame data is for vanilla, we have no mook for AH3LM yet (I will edit the wiki to state that the information is dated for the frame data)

[Pen_Ninja]

I've been kind of using it but accounting for the fact that it's for vanilla. I assume some of it has changed but a lot of it I'm assuming is still the same. More than anything, it's the only place I can find 3C...

[Pen_Ninja]

I threw a video together with the information in my post above. It's really just a visual demonstration of the mixups mentioned.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWega85fqdw&feature=youtu.be