Jissai Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 Thanks dude. I think I've been playing a bit better now. I'm guessing my style was way too aggressive, so I needed to tone it down and let the opponent make mistakes instead.
MasterGamer Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 i don't know what to say other than you're doing it wrong. when in blockstun, press 6AB and jin will do a 5C that knocks the opponent away (if it hits), and consumes 50% heat. are you waiting too long to press 6AB? as for your other question... i'm having problems understanding your question... they do a move with lots of recovery and you're asking what you can punish with? try a faster move i guess? out of all of jin's moves why do you think Jin's 6C would be the "only" thing you can retaliate with? bb (and gg) does reward good offense over good defense, so that's sonething you will have to get used to. learn to push your opponent out using Barrier Guard, and then get an advantageous position, or learn to stop him before he gets close to you. your problem is terribly vague, so i can't comment. Well first of all, you originally said to do 6AB while blocking, but now you say do it while in a blockstun. Are they the same thing or are they different? And is there a video online that I can reference so I can better understand? Also, I made a mistake and said I use 6C as a punisher when I really meant 5C, however, I did explain my reasons as to why I thought that was the only move to punish with in the sentence afterward. I've been using blizzard, gale, and double ice strike (I think that's the name for the last one - the first swing of the sword freezes and the second swing is delayable) a lot more and they seem to help a lot. I've just got to get timing down after the instant block.
purify Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Blocking = blockstun...basically. If you've played one of the Street Fighter Alpha games, KOF, CvS2, or Guilty Gear, it's the same concept. Almost always 6 + two buttons. You'll probably hear a lot of people actually call the move an Alpha Counter or Dead Angle, which are what it was called in previous games. If you're blocking something that's too far away for you to 5C it, you likely can't punish whatever it is outside of maybe the wave super. If they're closer to you and 5C is too slow, either keep blocking, FD or use one of the dps.
MasterGamer Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 Thanks. I have done it a couple times now, but it seems to only work after the instant block (that's what the people on the strategy DVD call it - when you flash white while blocking). I have to get used to seeing it and reacting fast enough.
ryokoalways Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 You are not trying to react to it, you are suppose to guess the opponent's move, IB it ,and then stick out your counter because you are confident you guessed it right. Nobody is going to spend time confirming that stuff.
Blade Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 Can someone explain to me what the situations when Freezing actually "works" in a combo instead of resulting in Black Heat combo? Counterhit is one, but what about the rest?
Darkhonor90 Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 Can someone explain to me what the situations when Freezing actually "works" in a combo instead of resulting in Black Heat combo? Counterhit is one, but what about the rest? I don't get what you mean like.....Using his drive mid combo? Ughhh any air combo into J.D? If you are getting black heat combos then that means you tried to freeze again after you alreayd froze once. You can not freeze more then once in a combo.
Blade Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 So I'm guessing stuff like C Delay Hishouken into any of his D Freezes. As for the '1 Freeze per combo' rule...aren't Throws and 623D exceptions to that?
Darkhonor90 Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 So I'm guessing stuff like C Delay Hishouken into any of his D Freezes. As for the '1 Freeze per combo' rule...aren't Throws and 623D exceptions to that? Yes thats correct. Any of his moves that cost meter i.e-623D,236D,Ariel 623D,214D can be used to refreeze the opponenet even if they were once frozen before. Can you type the input in? I don't know what Hishouken is =/
render Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 Hishouken is Ice Blade, Jin's projectile. That's probably not gonna connect, but I don't have a way to test it out at the moment. I know that with the right timing you can do 6C > dash cancel > 5C > 5D to freeze them mid-combo, but it's not all that useful IMO.
Mr. Dogma Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 I don't get what you mean like.....Using his drive mid combo? Ughhh any air combo into J.D? If you are getting black heat combos then that means you tried to freeze again after you alreayd froze once. You can not freeze more then once in a combo. Wait I'm confused. I know you can't freeze more than once in a combo, excluding certain moves, but I thought you could still hit with a freeze move as just damage. Like end an air string with it and you would still get a legit combo, just that it wouldn't freeze.
grimlock Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 One legit ground combo ( Jin being on the ground ) is 6C, 2D. You can build from that pretty well into a ~3k dmg combo easily. When the opponent is next to a wall, 6C will also link into any D except 2D. The most useful IMO is 6D. And i forgot this one. If you can pull off a 236C from a decent distance and hit, move to the appropriate distance and 2D or 5D can combo. 2D is the easiest and (safest / dangerous) because it can be done from further away and also leaves you with a +4 frame advantage if its blocked, but if whiffed. . . .you'll have some problems.
Shiri Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 Are we supposed to use "pressure strings" like combos that you do on block (if so what are they?) or just stick out things like 2A and 6A/B until they get hit by something and hitconfirm combo?
Wind Owl Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 From what I can tell, Jin pressure seems to be a lot of frametraps rather than actual mixup. So, you try to make them think they can escape and catch them with something, meaning your pressure shouldn't be airtight... If that's what you mean.
Shiri Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 Well, that is helpful, but I don't even know what kind of pressure I should be doing that COULD be airtight, so it's a bit more of a fundamental problem than that.
Mr. Dogma Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 Pressure strings are basically a short sequence of moves you do when you know your opponent if blocking. As the name suggests, it's meant to put pressure on the opponent to block. If I pressure I usually just stick to 2A(xN), 5B, 5C, 2C, A ice car. Ideally though you're gonna want to mix in some high-low to keep your opponent guessing which way to block then hitconfirm into a combo if you land a hit somewhere.
Shiri Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 Yeah, I guess I made myself sound even more ignorant than I actually am there - I know what a pressure string is, I just don't know any examples of good Jin pressure strings. That one helps! Also helps to know A ice car is safe, hm.
Mr. Dogma Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 I was just wanted to be sure since saying "should we use them like combos on block" made me think you were a little unsure of yourself. And yeah I use A ice car since it's safe. Alternatively you can stop at the 5C and jump cancel instead. So instead of 2C (which frankly is kinda optional anyway depending on your spacing) it would be this: 2A(xN), 5B, 5C, jc, j.b. You can cancel the j.b into a B/D ice blade, but I'm not sure how safe that is. You can also throw in a 2C after the 5C since you can jump cancel that as well, but I tend to leave it out.
Shiri Posted July 28, 2009 Posted July 28, 2009 Ok, so I have the fundamentals of blockstrings and some combos - although I have this thing where I can only get close enough to do C moves without their mashing all over me, and I can't combo much off those, but I'll figure that out. What is good Jin oki? For toward, away and up-techs. The computer acts like a retard and gets hit by like 2C214B all day whenever it techs but I suspect that will not be the case with good players somehow.
ryokoalways Posted July 28, 2009 Posted July 28, 2009 5B. quick tech you will whiff but you can stick a second one out for good wake-up pressure. Forward roll will get hit. If you think they are going to backward roll, ice wave.
Shiri Posted July 28, 2009 Posted July 28, 2009 Thanks. How likely is that to work if they're cornered and trying to roll through me?
Killey Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 5B. quick tech you will whiff but you can stick a second one out for good wake-up pressure. Too dangerous against people with reliable wake up counters. Litchi's Tsubame, Jin's 623C, Ragna's ID, Tager's 360 are a few examples of stuff that will beat out a 2nd 5B thrown for oki. Unless I'm timing this incorrectly but I'll play around with it in training mode.
ehwhoknows Posted August 7, 2009 Posted August 7, 2009 What are some good follow ups to Ice Car D into corner? I've tried 6C into standard air combos but it looks like you can tech out of it. There's probably some short follow ups that lead to a sweep but I was hoping for something with more damage potential.
ryokoalways Posted August 7, 2009 Posted August 7, 2009 I didn't say it's a 100% safe oki, but for pressure purposes it works well. You are correct dps (or anything with invincibility) will beat it, but that's what they are designed to do, beat oki.
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