Xrd Faust General Gameplay Thread

[spec]

That change makes it so that you can basically do the drill cancel with old XX series timing. Right now you have to delay it slightly or you just get a drill.

Here are some additional unlisted changes from Zinac's Twitter that I've paraphrased:

- Faust's Love/Bomb Bag (j.236P) recovery increased from 39 to 44 frames.

- Mettakiri/Hack 'N Slash (214H) recovery changed from 34 to 40 frames.

- j.2k and 6HS initial proration changed to 90%

- 236S, H (Going my way) damage reduced from 16 to 12.

- Back Door and Front Door (214K/P respectively) cause tumble on counter hit.

- Proxy guard time on bomb and poison was seems to be reduced.

- Charged S flower from pogo untech time increased.

- Doctor-copter (8 from pogo) damage increased from 13 to 20. Vulnerable box added to bottom side of the attack.

- Invulnerability frames added to K flower.

- From Above Door Teleport (214S) is now auto jump installed i.e. you can air dash or double jump after an RC, like in AC and +R.

Thats good news about the drill then, makes it much easier so that you don't mess up and get low drill instead of FDC. 6H prorate is pretty rough however.The auto jump install is cool, Spring > 214S might have some interesting combos now. 

 

And I'm pretty sure the increased recovery on Metakiri will no longer allow Metakiri > 5K in the corner since that timing is already pretty tight. 

[spec]

Thats good news about the drill then, makes it much easier so that you don't mess up and get low drill instead of FDC. 6H prorate is pretty rough however.The auto jump install is cool, Spring > 214S might have some interesting combos now. 

 

And I'm pretty sure the increased recovery on Metakiri will no longer allow Metakiri > 5K in the corner since that timing is already pretty tight. 

Actually 90% proration on 6H is not bad at all, I messed up thinking that meant the equivalent of what would be 10% proration, which would be awful :P

[SoWL]

Man, that's a whole lot of damage nerfs. But hey, I'm not playing Faust for extreme damage, so that's fine. Sad to see the Mettakiri combos go, but I could never use them outside of training mode. Bomb bag recovery doesn't seem to matter much because of the move's nature (they can punish you with an air-to-air, in which case you shouldn't have thrown the bag anyways), but I guess you sometimes won't be able to block it in time? The pogo shenanigans might be good: I can totally get behind the K flower invuls and S flower combos (I loved doing those in AC). The door buffs won't do much, since all of them can be easily dodged, though it might be fun comboing off platform into 214S > RC > 66 > stuff.

So far, so good, I suppose.

[Suiname]

I don't think f.S is punishable on block, but I'll ask Zinac when I see him, though he might not know either.  Generally I find myself trying to only use f.S in the range where I'm hitting with the tip anyways, otherwise I prefer 2H since it's low and tends to get counterhits.  Counterhit 2H -> scalpel does a lot of damage and is super easy (though very burstable of course).  

[Krakhan]

Does that effect wall combos??

 

Yes, now if you want to do any follow ups anywhere with it, you'll have to RC it. I don't think there would be enough time to even link 5P in the corner anymore.

The other nerf to 214H with only the first hit of it being unblockable might also affect the unblockable he's had with it since XX (for oki, throw bomb bag behind opponent, land, 214H as opponents gets up and blocks explosion). I'm not really sure though, this is something that would have to be tested. Not really something you would use a lot at all in most matches (maybe vs Baiken before?), but another option that may not work anymore.

[Wirya]

Yeah, more recovery on bomb bag isn't that much of a problem, since you can just YRC it.

[SoWL]

Yeah, more recovery on bomb bag isn't that much of a problem, since you can just YRC it.

Well, if we're talking about compensating for nerfs with meter, we might as well say that Mettakiri can still lead to combos with RC.

[BRD21]

I hear the term Option select all time put i don't really know what it is or how to use it?  

[Wirya]

Well, if we're talking about compensating for nerfs with meter, we might as well say that Mettakiri can still lead to combos with RC.

YRC-ing a projectile is perfectly acceptable in this game. RC-ing a command grab just to follow it up with a barely decent combo is an entirely different story.

[Coffeeling]

I hear the term Option select all time put i don't really know what it is or how to use it?  

It's a concept where a single series of inputs can have multiple different outcomes depending on what the opponent does. Typically they're inputs that are planned to cover two different courses of action the opponent can take.

One-button throws are a classic option select: If you're close enough, you get a throw, if you're too far, you get a normal move.

 

 

A SF4 classic is jumping in on an opponent that's rising from a knockdown. Say, with heavy kick. But you press the heavy kick twice with proper timing, so what happens:

 

1. Opponent rises up and gets hit or blocks: Jumping heavy kick connects, the game pauses action for hitstop => You press the second heavy kick while airborne. Pressing heavy kick while doing a jumping heavy kick does nothing.

2. Opponent rises and immediately backdashes. Backdashes have some invincibility (ie. your opponent's hurtbox just doesn't exist for a while) => The jumping kick doesn't connect. You land sooner => You're actually grounded and able to act when you press the heavy kick a second time => You sweep the opponent out of the ending of his backdash.

 

OSes are typically planned for specific situations, and a single situation can have different OSes to catch the opponent doing different things. The point is to be able to make a single decision beforehand instead of reacting to the situation (which can be too fast for a human to react to)

[www.keeponrock.in]

Is there any Faust skype chat?

[spec]

Is there any Faust skype chat?

I don't know of one but I'd be down to make one, I mostly hang around in the main GG skype chat as well.

[MD_Spriggs]

So after reading the new patch notes for Faust with more damage nerfs, recovery nerfs, and no reverted changes whatsoever, anybody thinking of playing a secondary yet?

[Natsu]

Any ideas how to deal with Gunflame in the corner? It's a very solid move

[MD_Spriggs]

Well obviously block it then see what the sol player likes to do afterwards. Crouch block is the default go to. Also Instant Blocking the gunflame is a better option but takes practice but rewards you by allowing you to escape/counterhit vs his frametrap tools.

[SoWL]

Do we actually have the translations already, or should I get to it?

 

So after reading the new patch notes for Faust with more damage nerfs, recovery nerfs, and no reverted changes whatsoever, anybody thinking of playing a secondary yet?

It's too late for me to jump ship, character loyalty is too strong.

EDIT: Ah, whatever, here you go.

f.S - the hurtbox on start-up and recovery is expanded forward; added starter proration of 90; start-up increased from 10 to 11 frames.

j.K - added starter proration of 90.

6HS - added starter proration of 90; damage reduced from 80 to 70.

j.2K - can now be performed at lower altitude; added starter proration of 90.

Hack n' Slash (214HS) - can be blocked with ground guard and midair FD after the second hit; recovery increased from 34 to 40 frames; Roman Cancel is now purple when performed after the start-up frames.

What Could This Be? (236P) - opponent no longer enters the blocking animation during the move's animation.

All items - if an attacking item is on the screen, players no longer enter the blocking animation before its hitbox activates; using Blitz Shield against your own items does not stagger the opponent.

From the Front (214P) - now causes rolling knockdown on counter-hit.

From Behind (214K) - now causes rolling knockdown on counter-hit.

From Above (214S) - can now air-dash after Roman Cancel.

Growing Flower (Charged) (236S > [K]) - now has invincibility on start-up.

See? I'm a Flower! (Charged) (236S > ) - untech time increased.

Going My Way (follow-up) (236S > HS) - damage reduced from 16 to 12.

Doctor-Copter (236S > 8) - damage increased from 13 to 20; the hurtbox is increased downwards.

Love (j.236P) - overall duration increased from 39 to 44 frames.

Backward Movement (236S > 44) - the untech time is increased; the float on hit is changed; the damage is decreased from 40 to 24.

W-W-What Could This Be? (236236P) - opponent no longer enters the blocking animation during the move's animation.

Ground hitstun - increased the hurtbox on some hitstun animations.

Edited February 13, 2015 by SoWL

[spec]

Do we actually have the translations already, or should I get to it?

 

It's too late for me to jump ship, character loyalty is too strong.

EDIT: Ah, whatever, here you go.

f.S - the hurtbox on start-up and recovery is expanded forward; added starter proration of 90; start-up increased from 10 to 11 frames.

j.K - added starter proration of 90.

6HS - added starter proration of 90; damage reduced from 80 to 70.

j.2K - can now be performed at lower altitude; added starter proration of 90.

Hack n' Slash (214HS) - can be blocked with ground guard and midair FD after the second hit; recovery increased from 34 to 40 frames; Roman Cancel is now purple when performed after the start-up frames.

What Could This Be? (236P) - opponent no longer enters the blocking animation during the move's animation.

All items - if an attacking item is on the screen, players no longer enter the blocking animation before its hitbox activates; using Blitz Shield against your own items does not stagger the opponent.

From the Front (214P) - now causes rolling knockdown on counter-hit.

From Behind (214K) - now causes rolling knockdown on counter-hit.

From Above (214S) - can now air-dash after Roman Cancel.

Growing Flower (Charged) (236S > [K]) - now has invincibility on start-up.

See? I'm a Flower! (Charged) (236S > ) - untech time increased.

Going My Way (follow-up) (236S > HS) - damage reduced from 16 to 12.

Doctor-Copter (236S > 8) - damage increased from 13 to 20; the hurtbox is increased downwards.

Love (j.236P) - overall duration increased from 39 to 44 frames.

Backward Movement (236S > 44) - the untech time is increased; the float on hit is changed; the damage is decreased from 40 to 24.

W-W-What Could This Be? (236236P) - opponent no longer enters the blocking animation during the move's animation.

Ground hitstun - increased the hurtbox on some hitstun animations.

 

thanks for the translation, what do these mean? opponent doesn't currently enter blocking animation during item toss, I'm confused. Honestly most of the changes don't seem bad at all. Faust does less damage now. I'd call that fair.

[SoWL]

Look at it this way: usually, holding down 4 makes you walk backwards, but if there is an enemy hitbox on the screen (be it a physical attack or a projectile), you enter the blocking animation instead, even if that hitbox doesn't reach you. This change makes it so you don't enter the blocking animation when there's nothing that can hit you.

[spec]

Look at it this way: usually, holding down 4 makes you walk backwards, but if there is an enemy hitbox on the screen (be it a physical attack or a projectile), you enter the blocking animation instead, even if that hitbox doesn't reach you. This change makes it so you don't enter the blocking animation when there's nothing that can hit you.

ah ok, thanks

[MD_Spriggs]

We'll see I stick it out for now. I just thought it was unfair that he got mostly nerfs overall and no new options to compensate for his bad matchups that are current(chipp and millia) and the bad matchups that will come post patch (may, I-no).

[spec]

We'll see I stick it out for now. I just thought it was unfair that he got mostly nerfs overall and no new options to compensate for his bad matchups that are current(chipp and millia) and the bad matchups that will come post patch (may, I-no).

 

He got mostly nerfs... so did everyone else in S tier. Chipp isn't a bad matchup, neither is I-No. 2-3 knockdowns and they are dead, while 2K beats most of their shenanigans (especially Chipp). 6P destroys May. Milia is tougher.

 

Picking up secondaries to compensate for bad matchups is almost always less rewarding than learning the matchup for a single character you stick with, except at the highest level of play.

[MD_Spriggs]

That is the key phrase "at the highest level" which comes into conjunction with playing people who are clearly at the higher level than you playing a character that doesn't let your greatest strengths shine and displays your weaknesses fully exposed. At that point character loyalty will only get you so far unless your are playing a top tier or a character on the cusp of it.That's where diversity in characters come in. In matchup heavy games like this is turning out to be (unlike previous GGs) THAT will be the endgame.

[SoWL]

Why exactly do you think that 1.10 will be more matchup-heavy?

Again, most of these nerfs only concern the raw damage, our neutral game seems relatively unaffected, and that is Faust's strongest point. Did we get any impressions on f.S's new hurtbox? Is it actually something to worry about?

[Natsu]

Guys, when my friend applies pressure on me while in the corner, sometime I manage to slip in a fS+Item,
What should I do next? It's hard to keep momentum

[Coffeeling]

Why f.S xx item when you could do 5P 2D item to get breathing room, or 5P/2P 2H Rerere to drive him away? 5P 2H Rerere has only 3f gaps between the attacks and pushes them back a ton.