[Xrd] Leo Whitefang General Discussion

[DocCeaser]

6H YRC throw or stuff seemed to sometimes work. Maybe.

Going for Rekka instead at least prevents you from being thrown, but you lose your pressure. [4]6S depends on how far you are from your opponent after 5H, since it's up to -8 if it hits point blank.

Going for 5H hold into stance and stuff is a different route, but this really relies on enemy respect for 5H.

I'll have to try 6H YRC. I do the rekka a lot to avoid getting thrown but like you said I lose my pressure. The stance transition is weird. When I was doing it in training mode I'm wasn't in range for a throw but in matches I usually am in range. I need to test that out more.

[Kikuichimonji]

I'm new to Leo and GG in general but I was wondering if there are any good options after 5H to beat a throw? I get thrown out of everything except a delayed sweep. It's really hard for me to enforce pressure when 6H seems to be throw bait and 6K whiffs alot.

One solution is to use 6K instead of 5HS at the range where they can throw 5HS on block.

Edit: Another option is to cancel 5HS into 1st rekka. It's -1 on block and outside throw range on normal block for every character besides Potemkin. That's safer than 5HS raw, and you can frame trap them with the second rekka RRC. They can throw you out of that, but it beats all normals and leads to a crossup confirmed into a combo on hit or a mixup on block. Unfortunately, CH second rekka doesn't lead to a combo without RRC, so you have to use meter to make this work.

[ThatHiroGuy]

Who's the highest rated Leo player right now? As in, who does the best in Tournaments? Or have there even been any significant ones lately?

[UYG_Ookami]

In what circumstances would it be in Leo's best interest to reject a strike using the blitz shield? Not to be confused with his dust parry

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[SoundReason]

I don't know if this was mentioned in the thread yet, but I've noticed that certain strings that combo naturally whiff on certain characters.

 

Specifically, Brynhildr K, S, H is a natural combo against most characters. Test it against Sol, and you'll get 3 hits, and can link the final Brynhildr H into another Bryhildr S (range depending) and go into Rekkas. This is my key combo for pressure out of Bryhildr stance... and it doesn't work on Faust.

Test standing B.KSH against Faust, and he recovers from the S in time to block the H. This is gross for a few reasons. Not only does it lower our overall damage potential against him, but it also gives us much less time to hit confirm and decide on a course of action. You can't autopilot the whole KSH string against him, and have to do B.KH and then make a quick determination on hit and cancel into Rekka off of the B.S is you know you connected. Depending on your range, I guess you can do B.KPKS xx whatever.

 

Nonetheless, just wanted to make it known that B. KSH does not chain against all characters normally. I haven't done extensive testing yet, but this definitely drops on Faust. His hitbox also makes the timing for connecting combos that involve launching an opponent into 6H, dash, 5K c.S jc etc. much harder, because the c.S seems to whiff a LOT unless you have the timing very precise. Much less lenient than when testing against, say, Sol or Ky.

 

Anybody else notice stuff like this while playing?

 

Edit:

 

Just testing a little to see what I can get off of this. B.KPKS xx [2]8H pushes them too far away for [2]8H to connect, sadly. However, B.KS xx [2]8H RC -> whatever works fine, so if you're already charging [2] during your stance transition then you're good.

[MasterXDrake]

What's rekka?

[Dandy Chippu]

Its leo`s 236s,236h,214s

[SoundReason]

What's rekka?

Rekkas refers to the 236S series of moves.

More generally, 'Rekkas' in 2D games refers to a series of moves (almost always 3) done by performing 3 quarter circle inputs, where each move in the string can sometimes be delayed, and you can stop at any hits.

Characters like Fei-Long and Rolento in USF4, Iori in KOF XIII, or our own Leo are considered to have these Rekka strings. Hope that's helpful.

[UYG_Ookami]

Chipp also has a rekka string that's actually pretty useful as well

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[felirx]

BT.KSH is not all that great unless the low hit. There are no options to low after blocked S, making it really easy to block.

 

BT.KP hitconfirm to BT S rekkas. If blocked, try BT.KS for double low, BT.H for overhead, BT.214H for unblockable .

BT.KH hitconfirm to BT S rekkas.

[MasterXDrake]

Thanks guys. 

[nstalkie]

Who's the highest rated Leo player right now? As in, who does the best in Tournaments? Or have there even been any significant ones lately?

 

Zidane

[bigli]

So I haven't seen this mentioned yet, and if it has, my apologies, but has anyone been using any burst-safe combos?

 

I find I'm usually being burst out of rekkas, so I went into training mode to practice pressing YRC between button inputs and found that Leos combos seem not to require them so much.

 

Generic example

 

5K > c.S > HS > 236S > 236HS > 214S, although basic and low damaging, is a frequent combo that I am being burst out of fairly early into the game.

 

If you input the combo as

 

5K > c.KSHS > PKHS > 236KSHS > 236KSHS > 214KSHS > KSHS

 

the combo will come out the same, however, if the opponent should attempt to burst on any hit, assuming you have between 25% and 49% meter, you will YRC after any move.

 

Any other simple/braindead examples I'm missing out?

[MasterXDrake]

How do you guys deal with zoners?

[greatfernman]

So I haven't seen this mentioned yet, and if it has, my apologies, but has anyone been using any burst-safe combos?

 

I find I'm usually being burst out of rekkas, so I went into training mode to practice pressing YRC between button inputs and found that Leos combos seem not to require them so much.

 

Generic example

 

5K > c.S > HS > 236S > 236HS > 214S, although basic and low damaging, is a frequent combo that I am being burst out of fairly early into the game.

 

If you input the combo as

 

5K > c.KSHS > PKHS > 236KSHS > 236KSHS > 214KSHS > KSHS

 

the combo will come out the same, however, if the opponent should attempt to burst on any hit, assuming you have between 25% and 49% meter, you will YRC after any move.

 

Any other simple/braindead examples I'm missing out?

i tweeted about this kinda recently but it's more just funny than anything. if you set a macro to PKSH (let's call it M)

then 5K>5M>5M>2M>5M>236M>236M>214M is a burst yrc os crouching confirm combo.

 

antiair: 5K/6P>5KSH>jc j.KSH>j.KSH>jc j.KSH>j.PKH>j.236PKH works too btw

 

the opponent can just delay burst to beat these if you input them this way so i just mash YRC between inputs as well

[Mal]

Thanks, greatfernman, that was something I wasn't doing at all... it's really easy with the macro :p
 

How do you guys deal with zoners?

Reflect their stuff :D Also BT [4] 5D 6+S/HS for a fireball+fireball :P YRC your HS fireball to go in
Maybe also 236HS (YRC) depending on their fireball angle

It's funny how some people are saying Leo is god tier, when this isn't the case at all... they just don't know the matchup and think he is OP because they can't block the BT oki and can't deal with BT D

[DarkZero197]

What are his 5HS, and 6HS into BT stance on block? I seem to always get counterhit when trying to cancel so I assume it's negative or my timing is bad

[greatfernman]

What are his 5HS, and 6HS into BT stance on block?

-3

[Mal]

From the Ky Matchup discussion -
A reminder that you can do multiple BT D's on stuff like Ky's Enhanced CSE. I think you have a window of 2-3 frames to press D again. It's very fun to do BT D, BT D, then they run to throw you but since they probably can't do it just in time, 6HS or other move comes out and you BT D yet again. If they are very close, BT D counter will trigger. (thanks greatfernman)

You can also BT D once and [2]8+HS or Overdrive (a bit hard to do).

 

You can apply this technique against Venom's 2363214+S Overdrive, SIn's 236236+P, Ramlethals 632146HS (both versions), etc.

[zankoku]

iirc if you successfully bt.D something and they're in close enough proximity, the counter triggers on them.

[Mal]

iirc if you successfully bt.D something and they're in close enough proximity, the counter triggers on them.

Yep, it always happens when they are close enough :o

[LockedAndClush]

I think it depeds on whether the move can be reflected or not. You won't counter Ky's CSE or Sacred Edge (and durandal versions retain this property) but Sol's Gunflame or May's super whale get countered when close enough.

[greatfernman]

nah you can't reflect ramlethal's swords but if you counter them and she's close enough she gets hit by the counter. i haven't tested it but looks like the counter trigger is unblockable too.
i wasn't actually aware that if they were close when you counter something they could possible not be caught. i can see the counter triggering then the opponent getting into range while leo is still invul happening, but if theyre already standing in range doesn't it always trigger.

[Mal]

deleted

[greatfernman]

I just tested it and you're wrong. They do get caught.

I thought so, it didn't make any sense for them not to be caught