lilseph

lol Nu vs Hakumen.

Not in CSEX which is why they nerfed it.

That was some fancy shit right there. I jelly.

I'm not sure what your trying to tell me here. I clearly said in my last post that if Lambda has the life lead, 99% of the time you should not be approaching Hakumen. Saying that Lambda doesn't have very good options, or risky options to be more exact I think is not true. Lambda can approach just fine, but again why should I approach Hakumen, I'll leave it to Hakumen to earn a life lead and I wont be impatient. Making an orb is relatively tough to accomplish due to the weird angles Lambda throws he swords. Hakumen has to predict which sword will be coming his way and react accordingly to make an orb, he cannot just see a sword and say " Oh cool time to slice throw that projectile", that just wont happen. Also making an orb is NOT free approach on Lambda. Yes it does make it easier on him to get in an eliminates 1 or 2 threats Lambda could potentially throw his way, but t the end of the day I, as a Lambda player, can say without a doubt that I don't fear that orb as much as you give it credit. Before I start ranking on Tager, I just want to clarify that I'm not making a case for Tager saying that its extremely hard for Lambda to zone him, its not. With that being said, Tager has some options that can really catch Lambda off guard if she is not playing super careful. Sledge B + sledge follow up brings Tager the full screen and sledge follow up has a ridiculous amount of active frames, not to mention both of those attacks are projectile invulnerable. 5DDing a Tager as even mid screen can get you easily punished, throwing out almost any projectile mid screen can result in an easy approach for Tager. He still has Magna Tech Wheel, 720, 360A, sledge A, SPARK BOLT, etc. I won't go over all of his options that Tager has because it would take way to long so I won't bother. Its actually amazing how much he has to approach Lambda but his major problem is his universal problem with every MU, and that is is poor mobility. I have never seen a Hakumen try and approach me with J.2A before so I cannot make a case for that. It does sound interesting, Id love to see mac chaos's opinion on that matter. BTW saying that your forced to AA or backdash isn't necessarily a bad thing, sometimes its free damage if they do something stupid and you get a free punish because your "forced" to AA. Also we said earlier in the thread that Hakumens block string/pressure isn't that bad without magetama and are actually quite linear, where as Tager in your face can be hard because you have to guess on a lot of his options and if you guess wrong your in for a world of hurt. I won't go in to any more detail because we did already go over this.

Its not that hard to zone Hakumen. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying its impossible for him to get in, I'm just saying he is the easiest character to zone (yes easier then tager IMO). Just cycle through his options and react accordingly.

Yeah this is where things get tricky. Honestly I leave it up to the Hakumen to screw up for the full 99 seconds. Why should I have to approach if I have the life lead. Hakumen is one character you REALLY don't want to give a life lead to IMO.

Yes it was. I never really did it because of what you said there but i didn't know that the timings were so strict and almost inhumanly possible. Just I'll start doing it more often :P

I'm maining Relius.

Good man. Someone had to do this :P

You should add your youtube page in the opening. Some people might want to check it out.

This MU seems pretty even IMO. He has all the tools to get in and some of them are not half bad. But at the same time it doesn't look like it'll be brain dead easy for him to approach us. *cough* Taokaka, Hazama *cough* /Mad

What does the character combo rate 85% mean?

Nu vs Tager... But seriously, Lambda vs Ragna.

So much 236C

Ummmm, Taokaka? Looking at the changes I can't see Taokaka being an even or positive MU for us. Not to sure about Hazama but the future looks bright for us against him for once.

just tested it and yeah 2C>236C does work. Doesn't seem very good to me or practical, there are better things you can do.

2C(CH) > 236C works?

...Well we are talking bout zoning here, so if you are mid screen i find that his D nails are most effective for him. At mid screen I'm fairly sure you can crouch under the top two nails and only be in block stun for the nail lowest to the ground, from there you can bash dash it. Full screen is easy, just find a gap in the nails and proceed from there, the nails will fly further apart from each other so the gap will widen. D nails are one of his best options to get in so there really is no clear cut way to get around them, just find a gap or just try and block only one of them. As a quick side note, most Bang players will run in a straight line towards you because its the fastest option towards Lambda, maybe you can use that bit of knowledge to your advantage such as... when you find a gap j.2D. I'm assuming you mean double air dash, and if that's the case then again there are no real clear cut indicators to use 6D or to use 2D. You can spot little things such as if he super jumps in the air, maybe you want to 2D instead of 6D (and if he regular jumps 6D instead of 2D in most situations). This is a guessing game for him just as much as it is for you, make him feel insecure about what hes doing. What i like to do is back dash , which will bait out either another forward air dash to gain even more ground on you, then act accordingly, OR if you back dash he will dash backwards in the air because he wont feel safe to further approach you. Another thing i really like to do is just simply dash underneath him, most Bang players will chase after you with their second air dash so just be ready to 2D or 6A or some sort of AA. All in all I find it to risky to just throw out a 6D or a 2D, I'll go for the safer option of just dashing or back dashing. After your basic B&B aerial combo, you should knock him away to the other side of the screen with J.214D. Sometimes Bang will quick get up and 2D or 6D(?) and teleport towards you. IIRC correctly it beats every D attack you can throw out which is why it can be a pain in the ass. But at the same time its extremly easy to bait and punish for a huge damaging combo. Which is why i said sometimes Bang players will use it because its a whole, high risk high reward situation. Don't quote me on this but i think if you 214D or 236D on his wake up and he guard points it you can probably jump and punish it, as long as you jump his 2D and 6D wont hit you(?). I stay away from using gravity seed for zoning, just a personal preference TBH. I can't really see it being all that useful to zone him but at the same time I've never really experimented with it before so by all means go for it. Against command throw, again I've never tried using gravity seed to stuff it because I almost always use 5A or 2A to stop that damn command throw. I'm sure there something in the frame data that says yes you can use it against Bang's command throw, or no you cannot, but I'm way to lazy to actually look at those numbers;) Bangs 5D hits mid and covers mid and high but does not cover low so you can just 2B or 3C him when he 5D's. His 2D hits mid(?) and covers mid and low but does not cover high so you can hit him with a high attack (lol 632146D). I won't even go into his other D attacks because quite frankly i don't know much about the others so i don't want to give you false information. General rule of thumb against Bangs D attacks are just to bait them out and punish, as I said before its a high risk high reward situation for him so he won't throw them out every single time just because it will get predictable. 2D? I very rarely spike chaser against Bang because of his D attacks and his D nails clash with it, i just find that your time spent using spike chaser can be better used positioning yourself to react to whatever he is doing. That's purely my opinion keep in mind so if you want to use spike chaser by all means go for it, its an amazing zoning tool and should be used accordingly, but at the same time it could potentially put you in a bad spot so i really like to play it safe, its just the way i play lambda. I hope this helped in anyway, please feel free to ask any question about what i said. Also take this with grain of salt, I'm not the greatest player around but i know my fair share about the MU so I'm just throwing this out there.

Yeah this is what I was trying to say, couldn't quite word it properly.

You SHOULD be able to just dash out of Bang's j4B. I've never had a problem with it so i can't really give an specifics because when i see it coming my fingers kind of just move accordingly. Its really tough to zone him due to the fact that he has two air dashes, he can teleport to you with his D attacks, and his nails are a pain. I agree with pretty much everything Toan has said so far. Can anyone throw out a situation their having trouble with? That would help a lot because Lambda for the most part in on the back foot. OH and one last thing, you can throw out a 5D and catch bang before he techs on the ground (assuming he doesn't automatically tech) and you can start up an air combo (maybe 5D > 236C?) its surprising how many people don't know about this.

Sooooo... What does everyone think about his astral?

This is basically what we have all been saying, just condensed. Glad we got this all figured out.

I can't say I'm the greatest player around, but just from my experience alone I can say 100% that Hakumen is the easiest MU. It is hard for me to make an argument because quite frankly I Don't play Arakune or Mu and i don't really know what all their attacks, combos etc. are but I at least know what they look like and what to watch out for. Arakune yes does have a hard time getting in, and to be honest i think he has a harder time than Hakumen does. BUT at the same time Arakune has FG meaning that the lambda can not herp derp and throw around D's all over the screen. He can also find gaps in Lambda's D's and quickly drive bomb to the ground (Don't think that is an attack, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mosWeqFBd1w @ 0:49). Yes Lambda does shut down his curse set ups etc. Arakune players have to take this MU in a different approach and not just throw around a curse cloud and teleport around the place, that will not work against Lambda. A good Mu player (at least from what I've seen) doesn't need to set up her steins and then go in for the hurt. From what i have seen she can do that mid block string and during combos. Also even if she does do it full screen, what are is Lambda going to do? punish her? Those steins come out extremely quickly and unless shes spamming out 4 at a time, your not going to catch her with an aerial combo. Also Her steins clash with our D's if I recall correctly, meaning she can throw out 1 or 2 here and there and slow push towards us. I look at this MU like I'm fighting Ragna, she really has no safe or solid option to get in on us, but when she does it hurts and she has quite a few traps that will catch people off guard unless they know this MU. I'm not trying to make a case for these characters saying that they are bad MU's for Lambda, I'm just saying that Hakumen has it rough as he really has no way of getting in because he is so linear, its easy to cross of options that he has and throw out the appropriate attack. I know numbers don't mean anything but I think Aarakune 6/4, Mu 5.5/4.5, Hakumen 6/4 (maybe 6.5/3.5).

IMO hakumen is Lambdas easiest MU, but at the same time its not free. People don't give Hakumen enough credit. He has that godlike airdash BTW and he doesn't NEED to approach from the air.

This Mu is def 5.5/4.5. Things to look out for... THOSE DAMN MISSILES! Missiles are reallllly annoying but to fair that is really all she has to get in. One other thing would be heart car, if you happen to get hit by it your eating 5k+. BUT if you block it, you can try going for a CH 5C to cavalier combo (not sure if this works), but if that doesn't work just 5C mash and get some huge damage off.