Elochai

I still think it's too early to make a call on her damage output. Not everything is really fleshed out yet. Even with the loss of damage, I think that having better tools more than makes up for it (even if they're only accessible once awakened). I somewhat agree on the bit about Liz buffs, but only because she gets the majority of them in awakening. I'm still waiting for someone to use Randomizer in some way. This isn't so bad. It's not like there're Elizabeth players who just throw out Garudynes whenever.

I think S.Narukami players are more inclined to use Issen since they can Shadow Rampage > Issen > combo. 75 meter for a fullscreen punish seems okay I guess? At least he got out of the mix-up situation.

See: bolded.

Shadow Labrys (with Asterius) is her own, separate character, just like in the original P4U. Therefore, she doesn't get the meter carry over or shadow rampage. However, there is also a Shadow Labrys (with Ariadanae) that does have the meter carry over/shadow rampage.

1/11/14 Urban Square 3on3: Sho vs. Elizabeth Mitsuru vs. Elizabeth

Steal a page out of the Damosu playbook: use 236236A as soon as you get 50 meter. Problem solved!

I've seen Narukami get like 6k off of CH DP . With how Damosu plays Elizabeth, I'm very convinced that Elizabeth works best in awakening. This seems seriously silly to me. You have 2-3 chances against most characters, but if your play isn't on point, you can effectively go from 2 chances to 1 by forcing awakening. Elizabeth in awakening looks really cool though. She can cover a lot of the screen with projectiles, and force the opponent to block. 236A even seemed to wallbounce(?). I think one of the combos Damosu did only used 25 meter for 236CD (in awakening) and he pulled like 3.8k from it + oki. For this one specific combo, the damage differential didn't seem too bad. At that, I don't think the combo theory is quite worked out for Elizabeth yet. I'm glad we get j.B > falling j.A > j.C off of various things now. j.B CH untech time also seems glorious. Damosu had enough to land from his jump's apex, and 5A to continue his combo.

GGs to my room.

It sounds kind of silly I suppose, but you should work on how you start rounds. You're usually doing something risky/unsafe (AoA/BD) which better players will punish you for. Backdash/backwards IAD (occasionally with j.B) are some ways that I like to start the round since they give me some breathing room. On a similar note, you need to work on your neutral. Neutral game is seriously difficult though, but it doesn't seem like you use a lot of Elizabeth's tools. Agi and Zio are very good zoning tools that you sort of neglected. j.B is a very good spacing normal as well. Generally, you don't just want to run up to your enemies and 5D them. As you said, it's a way to lose persona cards. It can be worse though. Run up AoA/BD isn't a good thing to do either. Better players will kill you for this, too. If you're adamant about running up and pressing buttons, I'd at most suggest you use 5A and go into "stagger" pressure (ie 5A > 66 5A > 66 5A > 5AA etc). Run up IAD back j.B is okayish, too. You should also learn how to use 5C/2C/j.C/5D. I notice that you just go for 5C > 5D a lot. It worked on this guy, but repeated 5D use only hurts you in the long run. Eventually, people will start to jump away. This is where 2C comes in, as it catches jumps/mashing. 214X works in a similar way, but it's way riskier. There're more "advanced" strategies using Thanatos such as fishing for hits in the corner (do something like 5C > 2D, and then punish your opponent for taking your persona card), or OMC > run up grab. Grab is 5f (which is really fast), but don't get into the habit of grabbing a lot. You can combo off of grab midscreen if it's counterhit. In the corner, you can combo off of grab either way (though non CH requires 50 meter for OMC). Speaking of combos, you should grind them out in training mode. You got a bunch of hits, but never really did anything with them. In this version, Elizabeth has big girl damage. You may as well inflict it! If you want a visual demonstration of some basic combos (this video was made in September 2012, so it's kinda outdated, but it's good for what it is), check this video out. If there's anything else you need help with, feel free to ask.

If you're East Coast, I will play with you!

Grab is 5F startup, and Wail is 12f + 4f after superflash if I recall correctly.

Yeah, the buff lasts until your next physical attack. I wouldn't advise you using 214214D in place of a regular grab. It requires that you be in awakening, as well as you having 50 meter. Additionally, it's way slower than a regular grab, and your opponent can react during superflash. 236236C/D are very situational. Outside of specific combos, for example, there's really no reason to use them. Some guaranteed situations in which you can use 236236C include during the superflash of Akihiko's Maziodyne (you can then 5B CH him into death), or after 214CD midscreen. The latter requires you to still get the opponent into a mix-up/combo.

You most likely hit your opponent with 2C beforehand. 2C modifies the damage of Thanatos' next physical attack. In this case, 214214D goes from 2.5k to 4k~.

This is why I like the P4U lobby system. I usually set the max game limit to 3 or 5 games, so everyone gets a turn to play against each other.

AquaPazza, which is also a crossover FG, only had 10 characters in version 1. I'm confident that a small cast of characters will not be a bad omen.

Isn't it in the options menu?

The performance of the Manaka players (two of them iirc) is to be expected. Surprisingly though, there was a pretty good Oboro who was getting wins. I'm pleased with what I watched though. Only disappointed because there were no Riannon players. Tamaki/Ulthury is pretty hilarious; the one guy who was running it in the video showed me how silly it is.

You guys think Mitsuru v Mitsuru is silly? Try playing Liz mirrors .

Doesn't Teddie give Elizabeth problems in the first game? While it's just my opinion, I always thought that TD v EL was in Teddie's favor. I assume it would be the same in this version as well. That's neither here nor there though, I guess. 5C DC happens during 5C (1), similar to 2ABC I suppose. I'm assuming 5C DC > xx works because it might catch up-back? I would think button mash would beat 5C DC > stuff though, as Arm sorta suggested. By the time 5B comes out, you're probably liable to getting hit in the face (that move has bad startup after all). Yeah, I'm not too surprised people want to awaken as fast as possible (though Ta did it stupidly/without thinking). Now it's like Liz is one & a half characters (in the sense that her moves are different in awakening). 2[C] still looks pretty nice. Btw, Garu > 2A > 2B > j.B > j.A > j.C is the future.

Or just learn Kokonoe so you play a 5-5 instead of a 7-3.

Thanks! Looking forward to some high level play. edit: lol wow, video removed for length? I've seen a 7 hour video before; how can this be?

I actually wanted to talk about this. Ta is actually decent (surprisingly!). I'm very pleased with 5A > 5AA > 5B > 5BB. It's amazing. I'm glad to see that hop cancels seem good too, however I'm somewhat disappointed that it seems like you can't use them for mixups; the hop looks really slow. I agree on 5C dash cancel. One thing I noticed about Ta was that he/she was really eager to get into awakening. So eager that Ta gave up 60% or so life for it. I guess Liz might be better in awakening after all lol.

I sincerely believe that run up DP is a legitimate tactic. It's a hilarious mindgame. I DP people on their wake-up, and I even DP during my own pressure (for this, I'd keep 50 meter though). I usually wouldn't DP during my wake-up though. Seriously, Ragna 623C is way too good to not use it a lot, and in a variety of ways.

Pick Ragna, and run up DP.

1/9 Shinjuku Sportsland 3on3 Hina (TD) vs. Ta (EL)