AeternumSomnium

See, counter assaults do usually work great. Unfortunately, I tend to forget about them or remember them at the worst possible time. It's actually funny, I recall someone saying a long while back that one of Liz's key requirements is being able to read your opponent (although that could be argued for anyone I'm sure) I suppose if you need to be sharp on that for anyone else to get out of the corner, you need that skill double time to get out with Liz. I figured from the avatar and sig heh. Anyway, yeah I try to use the 2b as much as I can with aerials but--my timing just is unfortunate (bad) Personally, one of the only successful methods I've done is to feign a jump-out; I simply jump in place and when they hop back and jump up to stop me head on I punish them with her awesome j5c. Of course the flaw being sometimes they just jump straight up and deck me. Poor Liz. . .

So, I've always wondered what people's techniques for escaping the corner were--without a burst of course. Certain characters have relatively strong defenses or techniques that allow them to escape the deadly maw of the corner, versus others who just don't. As an Elizabeth player, I could complain for ages about how difficult it is to escape a kanji or Akihiko looming over me. It's a bloody living hell. Some people (magically I swear) dash out while others hold a strong defense and wait for a hole to appear. It seems like the majority do the latter, but that doesn't always work/isn't always as easy for some characters. To cut to the chase, what is your most successful/favorite method for escaping the terror that is, "The Corner?"

I take back what I said earlier about Kanji's, I've been running into an awful lot all of a sudden and boy with Liz. . .it's just a rape-fest. Now Aigis, pretty much what ^ said, orgia mode essentially makes all her basic stuff better, combine that with pretty solid mixups and well hot damn, you got one lethal robot to fight. I've been fortunate enough to only come across bad ones so far, but just observing her in orgia mode there's a dreadful feeling of "Wow this could be really bad in the wrong hands. . ."

As long as shes used correctly she can be an incredibly nasty opponent. I wouldn't worry too much.

*Being a subpar---par Elizabeth* *Score Attack* Yeah nah man, nah. "Hey you're doing pretty good guy, oh wait I'm close to you now and a bloody good AI, have fun dying." Feels real bad, although sometimes I do get lucky; even if I have fortune on my side, in a 'fair battle', the AI rapes me.

I've yet to come across any Teddies that are worth noting--so far they've all been autocombo city and easy as all holy hell If he's considered high tier, i'm frightened when I'll come across a legitimate Teddy Now Chies, yeah she is pretty damn scary no matter what

Also, I've yet to see any Kanji's online unfortunately--I know it won't be pleasant when I do but, it's just odd that none have popped up yet I hear people discussing his godliness all the time

If only one could petition for upcoming DLC choices--I get the feeling even if tons of people BEGGED them to put in Persona and Persona 2 peeps in the DLC lineup, they wouldn't It would just be too good

You can, and I thank the based Gods for that. Accidental autocombo doesn't feel to good.

I sense great sarcasm in this one If you're referring to his 25th challenge, I mean I've landed the two assaults on the AI once, at least it isn't impossible to do in battle

But that is pretty lame though, I mean come on heh, would YOU want to be beaten by a Tager who simply threw you twice to win? I certainly wouldn't, I wouldn't say that's the same as getting combo barraged for a minute straight. Again, I haven't complained about them, so why would I believe they're flawed too? You kinda just keep on making ungrounded tangents lol. But I can concede here, I mean hell I don't know anywhere near as much of the technical stuff as half of the people here, you seem to have me topped. It just seemed that Noels (Solid ones), Ragnas, Jins, and Bangs even break my guards all day erryday. I've already admitted that's lack of skill mainly though, I mean hell my PSR only ever made it to almost 356, (Although Persona did stop that train. . .) I don't know, maybe the usual match-ups are just Gods and I'm unfortunate. Salty? Yeah probs. You seem mostly right I suppose. I was wrong you were right etc. etc.

I won't argue that, Valk's 6C is ridiculously powerful. I didn't say it wasn't interesting, I said it was flawed. Not that I expected it to be perfect, after all I've yet to see any system that is perfect at all. Let's not forget though, if you're fighting someone who has truly mastered their attack-barrage technique, there is no "Well I'll just use this or this to save myself," I've seen battles online where poor bastards just get attacked and attacked and attacked until either their guard breaks or they try to escape and get SEVERELY punished. Those are the situations where the guard primer--and guard breaking system are flawed in my opinion, if you can't find an opening than you're screwed. THAT's my reasoning. Look, I won't try to pretend I'm some high level player. I'm nothin special, but it sucks that for the higher percentage of players, they just bite it when they can't get out of an attack chain.

Keeping the fanboisim to a low is something I'll have to work on Also--I love your avatar circuitous, although I don't share your hate of Chie

Okay, I admit there is some fanboi-ism in there and for that I apologize. For the record, Hazama was the first character I learned. His 9th challenge took me about 4 and a half hours to do--I will be the first to admit that he was bloody well hard to learn. I've never played Makoto and I HATE noel so I can't speak for them. The point I was trying to make was for me personally, I'm having a hard time getting the timing down. I've read more than once of people complaining about the timing and executions feeling strange and off (see my thread) so that's where that came from. Before you continue your assault, please be aware, I do know the how difficult BB is lol.

OOooooo sassy When I play a fighting game, and I have to be on the defensive with someone, it damn well pisses me off when I'm fighting and their just like, "Hey lol, I'm going to break down your defense like it's nothing - oh btw you have less guard primers than others - or - "Oh don't forget, I have more primers than you and your attacks just don't cut it like mine do! Have fun breaking down my defense, oh wait--I'll be breaking yours!!!" So they can exploit it, alright. Still a pile of shit that some can more than others, it's one thing to have a powerful offense, but defense is pretty damn well important wouldn't you agree? People usually counter this with, "Well, get better." To get better you need to practice and fight right? So what fun is it when an opponent breaks your defense like it's nothing? Or on that note, when you're trying to 'get better' and your opponent clearly has more experience than you and you NEED to be much more defensive? You just took all those hits and primer deteriorations like it was nothing huh? You just lol'd and said, "Well, this is fair. . ." Yeah nah I doubt that. Don't you stand there and try to make it sound like everyone was equal and the inequalities were justified with, "It gives it depth!" No, it's a flawed system imo--and not just a little bit. It could be made better, (more duration on your primers and their stability, more equal "Exploiting" for characters instead of a select few) Seeings as I'm not the only one spouting this nonsense, I feel that there is at least some grounds to what I am saying. I've already addressed throws lol. And as for that last part, didn't bitch about it, so no.

My personal qualm with the throw reject system in BB was that even when I predicted when I was going to be grabbed--it didn't always work! Heh, "I see what you're doin"--or--"You're getting awfully close to me there buddy. . ." *Proceeds to grab* I see what he's doing and try to break out. Nope. That's what irritated me. I understand that this is mainly an online internet connection problem, it isn't the system's fault so much. But when I've fought people on Persona and been grabbed, almost EVERY time I can break out of it. Hell, if persona starts that up more online than you'll hear me bitching about it too, but as of right now, I seem to be doing better with grabs. Smart Play? Ehhhh......I wouldn't go that far. Sure you can throw in a....throw...to give some good mix-ups if you're wailing on someone or they're getting uncomfortably close to you. But I mean, let's not forget that some of the time, people throw out of reflex - not so much out of strategy. It can be smart play, but I wouldn't say it's always smart play. And how do you mean bitching about the long tech window? I have multiple ideas right now and not quite sure what you're getting at. Depth? Hmm, we're approaching opinionated waters now. I would generally agree that the primer system did have some intricacy to it that when ideally approached, was pretty solid. But practically, no. Especially with how some characters attack loops and miscellaneous stuff knocked down primers like dominoes. Persona's is certainly less intricate I guess, but I would place more money in the "Synthesized and better" field personally.

I think you're right to assume it has popularity because of it's title. In fact I'm certain that it owes a large chunk of its immediate fame to the Persona title. HOWEVER, the game itself offers more than just a nostalgia trip. While I'll admit that I don't much care for Labrys or the story, (Especially when they cliffhang-ered it like fucking BB) the gameplay is pretty fun. Being a Blazblue player for so long now, going to this game was a very strange and different experience. I like Blazblue, hell, I like the stupidly convoluted story and all the generic and bizarre characters. But going from BB to this game was, a bit of an eye-opener. I realized that I had been really getting my hand held for combos and attack executions--while also getting raped with stupid systems like the dreaded throw-reject system and the stupid primer nonsense. I still love BB, and plan on Getting Chronophantasm when it comes out, but alas, I will have a new perspective on it. Hell with Persona I feel like I'm getting challenged a whole lot more--and not just by online players and tier systems either (Which is what BB became for me); the game itself offers me a refreshing and new experience. Obviously there's a lot of opinion in there, but lets' be honest, the general consensus is the fighting in Persona is much more intense in terms of executions and timing--and because of that, I feel that it has a bit of a superiority to BB. To each their own though.

Really the only complaint I have about challenge mode in BB and this is the impracticality of some of them--especially the later ones, but overall I also agree that if you're new to a game, the challenge modes really are a great way to get a feel for the timing it takes to successfully execute large scale combos and the like Don't get me wrong, I hardly ever execute an EXACT challenge mode combo--no most of the time they're variants. Still, it helps.

Ah That was just supposed to be a joke--perhaps that didn't roll over as well as it did in my head

Implying challenge mode combos can't be used or modified to be used in battle LOL Maybe the 25-30th are a bit extreme, but I think you're on your own if you think challenge mode doesn't offer "real" combo potential--ESPECIALLY for a new game to get the ropes on And to actually assume that putting time into something, especially hours into challenges, and claiming it is meaningless, almost pretty much debunks why people get "into" something in the first place--or perhaps I'm not following

This That was Blazblue too--I'd get into a room, see shit connection to everyone, get paired up and fight em', and of course get destroyed with lag that reached the heavens Sometimes the best option is simply to bail and avoid that stuff, it's painful being helpless to internet connection douchebaggery

It's a pride thing, just getting the God damn challenge done is going to be an Out of Body experience

Interesting, this is not exactly how I expected the general opinion to be. I'm glad there is more love than hate and more compromise than resistance. And that's somewhat what I've come to a conclusion with as well--if they aren't total tools and are legitimately trying to get good, they won't be the auto-combo guy. I'm beginning to enjoy the game more and more, my roomies are even getting into it. Ones getting into Shadow Labrys. . .which I have mixed feelings about and the other into Tistsuru. Rather interesting turnout. One thing I find rather funny is the conditioning I've gotten from Blazblue; If I can't finish all of the character's challenges, I feel like an inferior tool. I feel so inferior in fact I wasn't really up to playing either of my roomies today when challenged. I guess all of those hours on BB have enforced a --GET THOSE CHALLENGES DONE BEFORE YOU CAN USE THEM-- policy in me. Without their completion, it just feels wrong. Unfortunately for me, the 30th challenges for my interests: Akihiko, Yukiko, and Elizabeth, all look just awful. . .at least at my current level of solidity with the game. The 29ths will have to do for now I guess. I may have beaten the roomie's asses, but I know the moment I step online I'm gonna get my face pounded in. Not looking forward to that. I MUST GET THOSE CHALLENGES DONE. For Akihiko's glorious cape!

In terms of speed, I feel like I've been having my hand held by BB all this time when I play Persona. Although, admittedly it is kind of my fault going from two rather sluggish characters (Valkenhayn and Relius) to a speed demon like Akihiko; the adaption to this new fluid movement will take some time getting used to. In fact I've noticed I feel more at home with Yukiko, she has the delays, quarter circles, and releases that remind me an awful lot of my time in BB. Akihiko's playstyle seems almost alien with just high speed directional inputs and button cascades heh. I would agree that the energy is much more vibrant than BB. I suppose what it really comes down for us immigrants is: you can't have your cake and eat it too. Practice practice practice. . .

So, it's fairly obvious a rather large amount of BB players have attempted to make a bit of a migration (OR maybe an Exodus. . .) to Persona Arena, in an attempt to try out something new and potentially refreshing. Me being one of them. My roommate is a BB guy and he isn't really into Persona at all, he says: "The combos seem much less intricate and personalized, the fights are much more turtle-v-turtle, and spamming is pathetically easy." Ya know, I can agree in one sense, I'm sure all of you have noticed the LOVELY auto-combo feature that makes me grit my teeth after hours and hours in BB's challenge mode learning a solid combo. In fact I find that in general, basic combos aren't too difficult to pull at off--at least that was my assumption when I bought it... Of course, we all know that this simply wasn't the case. I've seen discussion here and there regarding the bizarrely difficult time people (Ex BB players especially) are having with getting notable combos down at all in challenge mode. I planned on maining Akihiko the moment I heard he was to be in the game, imagine my sorry face when I realized getting him down was not going to be a simple walk through the park. It appears I've underestimated the game, I foresaw a BB clone and while there is many similarities, but overall in feeling--it is not the same, AT ALL. Everything seems faster, everything seems more focused. Looking back, in Blazblue I felt like I had a million years to do stuff and input for combos, versus now where my fingers are constantly dancing across the pad to be the combo guy for Persona. It took me almost 20 hours to get down the 29 challenges for Akihiko, Yukiko, and Elizabeth. It was some of the most frustrating nonsense ever. Don't even get me going on their 30th challenges. (I also rather enjoyed the--"Here's the buttons.....oh BTW you need to do this little dash cancel or you need to move somewhere else on the screen to execute this...but we won't tell you till you scope out the Demonstration 50 times) Sorry to ramble, anyway the point I'm getting at is, if you're an ex BB player or really anyone for that matter, how does this game feel to you? On that note do you think the combo potential is higher or lower? And also, how does it stack up in terms of depth to your expectations? I was surprised, my roomies were to. Thoughts?