chzchan

Neat. I think these are only a handful of the ones that I can come up with off the top of my head. Someone with a good/long/fast poke blocks your 421A/j.236A in neutral and you decide not to use the time to charge and to instead take the offensive. What do you do? Is it even a good idea to try and not use the time to charge? What are the best buttons to mash when you opponent is doing multiple jumping pressure in the corner if 2C is not fast/reliable enough to hit your opponent? Is it better to just DP? You are in the air, falling, and facing the opposite direction of your opponent who is on the ground, what button do you push? You successfully rapid out of the catch of one of Hakumen's D counters, what do you use to punish? Your opponent techs a grab, what is the best course of action? Your opponent is completely immune to conditioning and really really likes to super jump, what is the most effective way of dealing with them when pressuring? You whiff a 6C after 623C > j.236D > j.214D, what in the hell do you do? Also which characters does this happen the most often on for you? You land a 5A confirm with your back to the corner and no charge, what is the best way to end the combo? Is there a way to side switch out of a 5A confirm if you have heat? You land a raw forward grab with your back touching the corner, what do you do? Your opponent tries to punish a forward roll when you are in the corner and they guess wrong, what do you do? What are your favorite moves to use in and out of Rapid pressure? You successfully land a Counter Assault against an aggressor type character, is it safe to charge? What is the best course of action? Actually, hell, what do you do in the case of a disruptor? What do you personally do against people who roll backwards all the goddamn time? Your opponent continues to super jump relentlessly and has some pretty great air hitboxes. Do you dare try and 2C them, or do you yolo 623C? You know your opponent will Counter Assualt when you run up to them after using Blade Super following a successful knockdown into neutral tech near the corner. What is the right course of action in baiting this properly? Your opponent actually doesn't block a mixup correctly when under Blade Super blockstun, what is the best way to confirm this? I always drop it out of 2B regardless of what I end up doing for some reason, but this rarely ever happens. Is Air Grab > OD ever a good idea? Your opponent with a DP barriers the first few hits of your blockstring regardless of what it is and knows that you will go for either a 6C or a charge cancel after 5B or 5C in order to continue or try to reset pressure, what do you do? In this case, as a followup question, how many charge cancels do you usually do before you try and bait a reversal? You active Hakumen's 236236D super counter with a projectile and successfully super jump over the unblockable attack. You were able to position yourself within grab range of the Hakumen. What do you do in this case? If you were not allowed to use 6C in pressure against Tager, how would you approach the matchup? As Tsubaki, what is the best option if you tech during an opponents combo timer ending forced tech reset on the ground? ...in the air? Is it better to press buttons, jump away, attempt a DP when you are on the ground, try to guess the mixup? If press buttons is the answer, which buttons should be pressed? Is it better to just not tech if you see it coming? What is the best way to bait anti airs as Tsubaki? Should this even need to be done? What do you feel the frame advantage table looks like after Tsubaki dashes forward following a charge cancel, 5/2A, or 2B? How much more negative is she at her shortest possible dash > 5/2A? If you know there are holes in your opponent's pressure but 5A won't reach, is mashing 2A and attempting to get a trade a good idea if you know that the frame data will result in a trade for the opponent's specific move? Same question for 5C in the case where 2A would whiff due to the structure of the opponent's hitbox or some type of invuln on a specific part of the hitbox. If you do trade a 5A, 2A, or 5C, what is the best course of action if you know your opponent's move does not have enough CH hitstun to continue a combo? If your opponent is out of 5C range in pressure, is DPing usually a good idea? If your opponent is able to pressure you while being conscious of your DP and being at a range where it will whiff, what should you do? Your opponent is conditioned to know that you usually attempt to reset pressure after a 6B by dashing forward for either a 5A or a grab and barrier blocks accordingly so that you take a longer time to get in range. They also know to look out for the visual and auditory cues of your 22B's startup which they know is 22B instead of the charge cancel animation because they know you can't charge cancel out of 6B so they don't get caught by that when trying to smack you if you do run up. What do you do in this situation after a subsequent 6B? Your opponent comes into the match already knowing that they can DP in between 5CC and whatever the hell else you may do afterward (6B, charge cancel and dash, 236X, 214B, 22B delay) and you want to maintain pressure. You are also aware of the chance that a DP may happen. If your opponent relies on your knowledge of them having the option to DP and uses the chance to jump away after your 5CC what can you do to punish them? I always see higher level Tsubakis charge for extended amounts of time after a knockdown in the corner and most of their opponents do not try to mash/DP while she is doing so while being so close to them. Why is this? I have tried to do it and I just get smacked. Are you supposed to try and psychologically deter them by doing a DP out of a long charge after knockdown or something once in a while? Where is the respect here derived from? Ragna RCs after a blocked ID and does j.C, what do you do to punish this? What is the best air normal to use out of RCing a blocked DP without having the resources to do j.214D followup? In the Bang matchup, what do you do about them using their projectiles in the air reactively when you attempt to go for an air grab? What do you do if you fake going for an air grab and block the nails? Do you even have any safe options in this case? Is it ever a good idea to try and air grab Bang?

I do 6B > 421A instead for reasons I have explained before, but yeah you're right about not wasting 2 charges.

I actually forgot to think about IB. With all the hits that 421D > 236D deals, you are essentially feeding your opponent heat if you do that in pressure.

Staggered 2A catches jumpers, right? Also, is it worth it to use 421D >236D as a pressure/oki tool ever?

Well, I guess that is true, but I doubt her general game will change that much in 2.0 unless Arc really decides to. I mean, I guess there maybe might be j.214D overhead and 421D might have some neat neutral utility maybe but probably not, and 236C will probably cause cross-through, but that is about it unless they drastically change a bunch of other stuff about about her not already changed in the location test. Another side gimmick sorta thing just because that I'm going to add onto this. I really haven't gotten creative with it yet, but if you do Grab > 214B(delay) > 22[D] > 6CC > 214B (SMP) if your opponent techs immediately they end up facing the opposite direction. I am not sure what the cause of this is and I have not figured out how to take advantage of it so far, but it has potential to be a fun gimmick if you have both the Grab and 1 charge. It looks really funny if they forward tech because they fly in the opposite direction. Oh shit actually screw the SMP route for now. If you do Grab > 214B(delay) > 22[D] > 6CC > 22B you get my gimmick setup again. Damn that's funny. Very dependent on height, though. Grab > 214B(delay) > RC > 214B(SMP) gets the setup as well.

Oh yeah I wasn't trying to segue into that. I actually wanted to try and maybe instigate a communal listing of of things we can do to make ourselves scary in a fight regardless of how effective they are instead of making suggestions for changes that will never happen. Of course the listing would be based on the matchup because that is currently being discussed.

That's what you would think, but it doesn't really work like that psychologically. She isn't scary unless your opponent thinks she is which is pretty difficult if they know how she works. I have said this before because I have asked people at locals, but people really don't watch Tsubaki's resources or care that I am getting charges. I guess I can use that to my advantage, but the benefits of respect heavily heavily outweigh the benefits of of disrespect, especially because Tsubaki's neutral and oki game are garbage. Like Azrael's drive resources have this sort of psychological effect when you are under his pressure because they make you second guess your second guesses when he is pressuring you and then he gets huge damage off of them when he gets in a hit. You are going to be afraid of getting hit by him and especially afraid when you have a mark on. I want people to be afraid of Tsubaki when she has part of her bar filled, maybe not in the same way as Azrael, but I just want the fear to exist.

What should I be generally trying to mix in during neutral? I feel like I should be playing re-actively so that I catch them when they make a wrong move, but that hasn't been working too well just because of how sluggish everything feels and how afraid I am to whiff anything. I feel like I can be a lot more creative, but I don't have a baseline neutral to work with or at least that's how it feels even after watching videos.

What was that 5B whiff after the 3CC > RC into 5A in that fight with the Mu-12? Was that some kind of burst baiting tactic?

I'm not really sure what Kagura would be defined as. He is different. Like it feels like I have the ability to lame him out due to the nature of his moves, but it doesn't always work for some reason. He does feel pretty even, but I would say that he is at an advantage because once he gets one combo in that ends in corner oki you're done. That is not the same for Tsubaki because her combos do not take out half of your health and her pressure is stubby and easy to hop out of so she can't hold onto people as easily. There's a lot of creative shit you can do with him as well. I would say Tsubaki has a much easier time closing distance and running away, though. Also it is easy to DP out of Kagura's pressure if you see them commiting to stances if you count them correctly. Just with how matches usually end up going, I would say that I fight him like I fight Tager, except I am able to use corner oki on him. He can't realy do much about me flying around or charging unless I am stupid and hold into D for too long and get Wyvern CH to the face.

Yeah I should have listed Tao, Bang, and Hazama as characters that can just hop around the screen. There's also Terumi's j.D as well, though that goes in it's own special category because it eats projectiles.

I guess that works on Makoto unless they bait it, but against Jin, Ragna, anyone with a great hitbox, 2C doesn't do anything to deny them jumping in.

Yeah I like this a lot as well, but get your rest. I'm still writing a reply to your reply to my stuff about Azrael earlier.

I would like to second that. I really really want to know what sort of positive thinking I can do in a Mu-12 match. Well yeah, what I have to resort to doing is yolo air enders. I have seen promise in using air enders when you are as close to the corner as possible so that you land right under your opponent. If they tech forward, you get to grab them from behind. What are the particular things that I should be using charge for in the Azrael matchup aside from damage and covering my DP when I get cornered? It is super scary when it almost seems like they forget that they have a projectile and don't just whop it out within the next 10 seconds to try and tag you charging like most Azraels do. If they save it I even sometimes forget that they have it and that spells doom for me.

Oh I have no problem with punishing his drive because you just need to slightly delay your gatlings. I just get too frustrated before he runs out of nails. I have never beaten a Bang that has more than 0 nails. This is really just me, though. I was also just joking, haha. It feels like 100/-90 at the beginning of any round against Bang.

Pretty good, but I showed places where it needs cleaning up. They were all just small word placement errors and formatting errors except for the part where you wrote about Bang only being 6-4 unless that was supposed to be a joke. If that was the case then it was pretty funny. Actually there is one thing that I would like to contest and it has to do with Azrael. I'm pretty sure I brought this up before in the Azrael matchup subforums, but letting him get even one stock of Phalanx significantly changes the fight for you. Also loss of the ability to do j.236A and 421A oki in the corner is a big hit and makes you super reliant on resets and other gimmicks, or at least that's how it feels for me. I hate knocking down Azrael because you have to hard call out his options or else he gets out pretty easily. You know, wakeup backdash beats meaty, wakeup sentinel/jump beats grab/command grab, mashing 5A punishes us trying to call his backdash, 2C punishes us trying to call out fuzzy jump really hard. You also have to bait growler on top of all that. It is not fun to fight him. I never feel like I have the upper hand even if I have momentum. Our DP is pretty great at getting out of his blockstrings because they are not airtight. It is just really scary having to watch out for his 5D.

I've been running into a few Makotos lately and I just have lost more often by using my projectile than not. I think I am just not using them correctly or not judging distance correctly or something. Makoto is tied for fastest run speed with Bang so it always seems like she can just navigate around things pretty easily. I also have trouble dealing with people who jump over 421A projectile if they are too far away. If I go for air grab I get smacked every single time and I don't know which buttons to use on people who are already in the air. It always seems like they are just a bit too far away if I try to go after them after letting out a projectile and if they advance towards me I just end up blocking. I guess this isn't limited to Makoto. That's just me, though. I feel like I need to figure out how to generally use the projectile against certain characters. Like where/when I should be using it against each character because I just throw it out to attempt to cover me and if my opponent airdashes into it or just hangs back and defends because they don't feel like going in, I feel like it is effective. If someone doesn't let the projectile stop them in their tracks and finds ways around them I am super screwed because they really are not that great at covering Tsubaki and both can be punished super easy.

Yeah, her OD is really powerful. I actually think the power difference between normal and OD has one of the bigger gaps comparatively for Makoto. This is mostly because she doesn't do that much damage regularly, though. What made her so good before the she has still not gotten back besides damage?

Is it a good idea to use projectiles in this matchup?

I wrote some observations about Celica (and Lambda) based on the TGS demonstration videos here in the old contaminated thread if you didn't already see them.

From what Mori said in an interview, he has no plans so far for console release. Even he doesn't know what he wants to do. I'm hoping that it is just an update. I really thought we would be through with Extend-type releases now that BB is Playstation only. It doesn't matter how much content is being included in 2.0. I'm just thinking business-wise here because they will not only sell barely any copies of 2.0, they will also kill the game's community and following for at least until the next iteration comes out which means less potential profits. But I guess that is a little bit untrue because the arcades still exist. They would just murder any potential profits made from the people who already own CP for consoles. It just does not make any sense to release an entirely new game because there will be lasting negative effects and Arc should know that.

Actually, I think that would be a pretty okay thing to do. This will prevent ODRGETB from killing you if you have slightly less than half health and you made a wrong turn. I'm actually more for the "cannot kill" attribute than special proration with the OD counted as a starter with its own P1 or something like that. ODR should not allow you to take rounds, or at least that's how I feel about it. I mean, OD time is already shortened so the unburstable combo will already not be as long as could be for some characters depending on their health, but I'd be fine with both cannot kill and special proration if that could be a thing. This is because some characters like the earlier example of Tager will get optimal damage out of what can be done out of ODR regardless of how long OD lasts and that damage is amplified if he has 50 heat.

I'll take a closer look at the videos and do some frame by frame stuff. May not help, but I want to know. What I am guessing, assuming you can CH out of ODR, is that in the videos the frame data of the moves used did not allow for enough time to actually achieve a CH. This is what I was talking about earlier. It really really depends on the moves that the opponent is using. This is, again, assuming that you can get a CH.

Just makes it seem like it is another deterrent that needs to be baited by using certain types of pressure, especially with characters like Tager and Bullet. See, Bullet already needs to be treated like Tager when she has 50 heat and 2 heat up levels, but now if she has 1 heat level, OD, and 50 heat she gets Tager treatment as well.

Actually you could probably maybe punish staggered jab pressure with Kagura's DD so long as you start charging backward since it starts up so fast. It's OD version even does a bit of extra damage. I wonder if you'd be able to charge during the activation of ODR. Not sure if it is enough time or how the system works with that. Wait is it getting 1.0 invuln or longer? 1.1 is 7 frames. 1.0 was 9 frames I think.