Justice7541

With less than 30% health: Zanrouga RC OD dash 5C j.2D 2C 5C 3C 5D 6D 5C 3C 5D 236D Fuuenjin = 7.5k, unburstable Balanced game.

I think the frame buffer is only 3f now. And that only applies to doing links on the first frame after recovery, it's not going to help with the black hole > 3c pickup where it's possible to do it too early. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Extend Ragna with Hazama normals doesn't sound that bad at all actually. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Hmm, I feel like his range game isn't that bad. He's got 5d to beat out long pokes/short zoning and Messenga punishes fullscreen stuff hard. Not to mention just running really fast is also a huge plus against zoners. As for mobility characters I dunno, I don't see why he'd have problems keeping up considering he is basically one himself. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

5c is Bang's only real safe pressure reset and he has to jump cancel into Swallow Bang for that. If he stays on the ground you can just block till be runs out of strings to do. 6b can be beat clean on IB with 2a and he has to dash back in to continue pressure after a barriered 6a so you can usually 2a mash that out too. Keep in mind that he can't really late gat or jump cancel any of normals so his blockstrings tend to follow predetermined routes. If he tries to stagger pressure off anything other than 6a you can usually mash out clean. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Anyway, now that Terumi's been out for a while, how are we evaluating him overall? Personally I think he's really strong, maybe even OP, but I play Izayoi and Kagura otherwise so everyone seems OP by comparison. Still though: - Outrageously high damage output off standard pokes like 5b and 2b. Non-CH 5b can net you as much as 5k+ midscreen. - Really good pressure. 2a and 5b being plus on block coupled with his super fast run speed and ability to start decent combos off random long range pokes like 5d, 2c etc. gives him very good risk/reward in his offensive game. - Strong mixup. Nothing Izayoi-tier but j.2d, j.b, 3c, 2b, etc. all make for nasty high/low/frametrap options. - Strong defensive game. Requires meter to reversal but so does most of the cast and it's not like Terumi doesn't always have meter. 6a is a very strong AA and becomes 5a on crossup which is also a good AA. Has huge damage potential off his pressure escapes which skews the risk/reward substantially in his favor. - Strong neutral overall. Covers all distances with good pokes for everything. I was going to list his weaknesses but I'm not even sure he has any.

I made a long post then the forum ate it. This is definitely not our worst matchup though. Bang's mixup is annoying but not endless so lack of reversal and good pokes doesn't hurt as much versus him as it does against, say, Jin. 2a and GA j.C stuff a bunch of his defensive options and 5a is a decent AA against him due to his jump-ins also extending his hurtbox. Also easy punishes on his common "safe" moves like fire punch and ashura. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Having a counter that stuffs safejumps is always a good option regardless. Especially when said counter goes into big damage in the most common pressure situation. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Terumi can counter j.C mixup if you are too predictable about it and take that into 7k. Don't let him get his counter ever. Use lows liberally and if you are going to try to max range him, space it well because his 5d is only 3f slower, safer, and he can take it into huge damage like with everything else. Also don't try to teleport randomly, if he is on the ball he can OD on reaction to the teleport and punish from pretty much anywhere if he is on the ground. That applies to backwards teleport too if you are in range of Messenga, which also leads into 6k because of course it does. :Terumi: Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Why not just play Terumi like everyone else? Get on the bandwagon dude, it exists for a reason. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

It does. I have it. Only downside is HK store is a few hours behind JP store so if you are super impatient for new DLC whenever there's a release it'll be a bit annoying. Otherwise everything is identical, including who you can netplay with. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

Can't you just autopilot DP Lander once you see the 214a~c hit? Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

5dA: Mid/high super armor. Punishes mashing, mixup with 2dA. 2dA: Overhead that goes over lows, punishes mashing. Mixup with 5dA. 5dB: Command throw, very gimmicky mixup. 6dA: Dash and attack from front. Mixup with 6dB. 6dB: Dash and crossup. Mixup with 6dA. 6dC: Projectile super armor, used for approach. Rest: Mostly combo filler Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

You can tech chase with 2A too. You won't get as much out of it (2A 5B 6A j.C j.C j.2D is pretty much the extent of it) but it's still better than nothing. Plus you get oki again if you do that.

I just realized how hilariously short Terumi's throw range is. It is literally like one pixel long. You can be overlapping with the opponent and still whiff the throw. He may have the shortest throw range in the game. Maybe 6C kara will work.

If Terumi has 100 meter, screw the Astral, you're pretty much dead if he hits you anyway. Terumi is pretty much my textbook definition of "ridiculous practical damage output". It's not even an issue of something like "oh man Hakumen can 100% you if he hits you in corner with TK Tsubaki while in Mugen", Terumi can hit you for 4-5k midscreen with a single super (which is like half a combo's worth of meter gain for him) and as much as 6k in corner, off extremely easy and practical starters like non-CH 5B. In general Terumi isn't someone you want to get hit by, period. Even without meter he still hits pretty decent damage, he gets like 2k midscreen and 4k corner which is pretty par for the course. He also resets you really easily if you don't know his combo patterns. I think Terumi gets sold short a lot in general, you'd be surprised at how not-creative you can get away with being when you have a positive on block 19f overhead (TK j.2D) that goes over lows and can mixed up with an airtight low (3C) that leads into huge damage. Also don't forget stuff like j.B hitting overhead twice (which makes just doing j.B 2B a high/low mixup) and j.2D being cancelable off jump-ins for stuff like j.B j.2D/2B high/lows. 5B is also +2 on block and 5D is a 13f poke with huge range that can be confirmed extremely easily into a full combo. What I meant in my earlier post is that I don't think Terumi screws Bang in any special way, but he still screws him pretty hard in all the standard ways he screws everyone else. If he really has a major weakness it's that he can't reversal without meter, but that's true for a lot of the cast.

If Bang tries to do his new 4-seal superthrow on you, mash OD > Soutenjin and follow up with 5B 5C 3C 6D 236D Fuuenjin/Orochi and lol heartily. It works even in the air and leads to minimum 4.5k and potentially as much as 6k depending on how much meter and health you have. Also j.B will hit him out of the same super if you're in the middle of it and he tries to hit you, because of the crossup hitbox. Also very lol.

Okay so I'm starting to think it's always better to end combos with Orochi instead of Fuuenjin in most cases, just because the oki you get from it is way better. Off any Orochi in the corner: - 2C (opponent airtechs) forward jump to: -> Against neutral airtech: j.B(1) 2B (high -> low), j.B(2) 2B (high -> high -> low), OR j.B(2) j.2D (triple overhead). Loses to reversals but can safejump some of the slower ones, like Azrael's Scud Punishment. -> Against forward airtech: j.B (hits) dj.C j.2D. Straight-up punishes it. -> Against back airtech: j.B (gets blocked in air) > j.C (falling) > 5A mash > 6A OR 214D (AUB or throw mixup) - 5A (whiff) 8j.B 2B: Safejumps neutral tech, meaties forward and back roll In general, lets you autopilot to cover a bunch of bases.

I don't think this is a particularly extraordinary matchup since I don't think either of them have anything that shuts down the other hard in any special way. Just one thing to note: If you get 4 seals, DO NOT TRY TO USE THE SUPER THROW ON TERUMI IN THE AIR. If he has meter, he can do Soutenjin (double flash kicks) for an easy escape. If he has burst AND meter, he can OD Soutenjin or Messenga and punish you for as much as 6k depending on how much meter he has. Even in the best case you will still take about 4.5k. Not worth just to see a cool-looking airgrab super.

Dunno if you guys are aware of this but Terumi can combo into his CT off 22C in corner. It gives a pretty sizeable chunk of extra damage (about 700) but puts you in heat cooldown so it doesn't always necessarily do more than not doing a CT. Here's some stuff I tested. Corner: 5B 3C 22C (lv2) 2C 5C 3C 6D 5D 236D Fuuenjin (lv3) = 5.3k, builds 65% meter so needs to start with 35% meter 5B 3C 22C (lv2) CT 5C 3C 6D 5D 236D Fueenjin (lv3) = 5.9k, builds 47% - 25% meter so needs to start with 78% meter So I did a bit of testing and here's basically what I found: 1) CT + Lv1 Fuuenjin > Lv2 Fuuenjin only 2) Lv3 Fueenjin only > CT + Lv2 Fueenjin 3) Lv1 Fuuejin only > CT only So basically: - Starting between 0-38 heat, omit CT and end with Fuuenjin - Starting between 28-35 heat, use CT and end with Fuuenjin. - Starting between 35-78 heat, omit CT and end with Fuuenjin. - Starting between 78-heat, use CT and end with Fuuenjin. This character seriously does way too much damage. 6k in corner off 5B for the equivalent of what is basically 30-40% meter on a character with normal heat gain rates is pretty broken. Even Kagura doesn't hit nearly that much and Kagura is a big slow slug.

So I just found out that Jin's 6B isn't actual foot attrib invul anymore. It will still go over lows due to the fact that he jumps (because they just straight-up miss) but he won't invul through moves that actually intersect with his hitbox anymore. Before he could 6B through any 2A poke that hit mid except Ragna's, since those are all foot attrib attacks, again except Ragna's which has body attrib too because lol Ragna. Either way what that means in practice is that mashing 2A to beat 5B 6B pressure string works now. That actually makes a pretty big difference since it makes it a lot easier to react to 6B without having to risk standing up to 5A and eating a 2B or 3C in the process.

I meant that if you see her teleport in the air, it's a D teleport meaning she always ends up behind you. Knowing that she will always be in 5b range after the teleport makes it a lot easier to punish her for big damage. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

I play as both but I've never played against either. Go figure. There's a few things I've just tested in training mode though. 1) Terumi's 5C is airtight between the two hits (it'd be lol if it wasn't) and first hit leads to overhead. That means if Kagura wants to try to DP out of 5C(1) > overhead he will lose his charge if you do 5C(2) instead. If he's trying to hold his charge to get ready to DP you after 5C(2) he probably won't stand-block 5C like the rest of the cast would, which means 5C(!) > j.2D will likely connect way more than it should. 2) 5D > any of Kagura's long-range pokes. Just don't get hit by 5dA or 6dC. In fact you can pretty much spam the shit out of 5D, Kagura has nothing capable of punishing it except his charge super. Speaking of which: 3) His charge super hits in 2 (!) frames which makes it the fastest attack in the game, capable of punishing most moves that are otherwise unsafe. Fortunately it's a projectile so if you're still in the cancel window of a move when he does it you can just Messenga through it.

Smacking the doll is funny but Carl can punish it pretty easily. He moves a lot faster than it looks like he does. A lot of the time hitting the doll with 5D just gives Carl a free approach since he's probably doing something with the doll to cover his approach rather than just activating it randomly.

There's no special trick for dealing with Izayoi rushdown other than to mash reversal if you don't feel like trying to block fast overheads. Terumi has a few free things he can do though: 1) Izayoi can't safejump on him cause of counter. No one can but Izayoi gets lots of safejumps and losing that option hurts. Obviously don't counter too much cause she can bait it easily with an empty jump. In general though counter works pretty well since her low pokes tend to be either fairly short (2A) or slow (2B) so Izayois usually won't start pressure with a low once they are in GA. 2) Don't let her run blockstrings on you. If you play patiently Izayoi can't really get stocks easily and will be forced to build them up with blocked pokes. It's pretty common for her to end blockstrings with 236A (Sonic Saber) which is + on block at most ranges and gets her one stock. She can reset into a max-range 5B and go for another 236A for more stocks, or try to read jump-outs (which is what most people will do when getting 236A staggered) with a 623B, which you do NOT want to get hit by since it'll get her 4-6 stocks depending on where you are relative to the corner. If she is getting greedy you can call out her max-range 5B with a counter (risky) or barrier her out and 5D. 3) Izayoi looks like she has a lot of range but it's really not that good. She is scary in GA but just keep in mind that even if she gets stocks and begins GA rushdown, she's still going to have a hard time getting in on Terumi since his 6A will blow up any attempts to just dash in. That leaves her with trying to space a 5B poke (you should be able to easily outpoke her with 5D since she can't microdash in GA for accurate positioning) or teleporting. Keep in mind that B teleport doesn't go that far forward and she can only D teleport in the air, so if you see her teleport either at fullscreen or in the air, she will ALWAYS end up behind you. Teleport is much slower than it looks so you can easily call it out on reaction and just 5B it. 4) If she has you in block and has lots of GA stocks, mash Soutenjin/Counter/CA and pray because you're dead either way if you don't. If you have her in block and she has no meter, just run whatever YOLO mixup you want since her defensive options suck, she's dead either way unless she gets lucky with a random mash. In other words, hit her a lot and don't get hit.