Kaizen

Oh my god, the animation on Pot's RCs is gold. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ki2iHqGgRSg#t=7m56s

Another vid from wx3873 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ki2iHqGgRSg Chipp vs Millia & Venom (CPUs) Chipp vs Ky, Ky vs Pot

So how come we don't have the wakeup times for Robo Ky, ABA, Order Sol, Kliff, or Justice? The last two make sense, but I'd think that since Slash, somebody would have found those out. I'm most curious about ABA, because as much as I like having all that extra time to setup an IK, I detest having the retime all of my oki game. I'd also like to find out exactly how much time everybody has to go for the kill, because Chipp and Dizzy's take forever to start.

+R? Definitely showing up. Would have brought Bobman (for all 3 1 of you who know him), but he's working. Hopefully I don't get screwed out of transportation.

This never happened. I will always scream SPECIAL ATTACK GURRRRRAAAAAAAAANND VAAAAIIIPAAAAAAAAA

So according to the wiki (which is probably based off of the +R patch translating moves, finally), Grand Viper is actually called Ground Viper. There is no God.

The AC version or the Slash version? The one time I picked the Slash version on Vita against the CPU, the game hit a brick wall.

The manual is 6 pages, the first 4 are just the system pages, but the fifth page has Profile Portraits (which look pretty sick, honestly. Pot's face is terrifying, Chipp looks like a Naruto character, May is doing her stupid salute as always, though the front of her hair looks a little shorter, and her hat has a visor now). The sixth page is blank but says "coming soon".

CHIPP VENOM WHO'S THIS ARMORED MOTHERFUCKER

Obviously the most important question. Also, 9. Xrd site screenshots make it look like Dust launchers lock bursts. Check, please.

Biggest thing I noticed was that Ky's Burst is locked as he gets hit by the Dust Launcher. Maybe dusts lock bursts now? That'd be pretty rad. It would definitely make them more rewarding to land.

012 found something nasty. I added even more: [Airdash j.S > j.D |> 5H/2H] or [5K/c.S > 6P > 5H] > j.D, j.D |> j.D, j.D |> j.D SW |> dash c.S > 2H > TK9 SW |> c.S (2H) BR. Also saw him end a SW loop with 6P > Fafnir > Tyrant Rave. Does 269 meterless on Sol. Puts them back in the corner. 5 jump Dusts into SW loop is pretty sick.

She has DP, Backdash, and Pot Ground Throw range, in addition to Michael Blade. The frame data listed on her DP makes so little sense that I have the feeling that something is wrong. Hell, her jab and 2K were listed as overheads before I started editing her wiki page. Yes, she is outclassed in both projectile whoring and when in direct face-to-face range, but at midscreen her pokes are amazing. I get the impression that they'd feel a lot more threatening if Justice players started going for longer combos that end in nearby knockdown, like xx > air S Michael Sword FRC > 2H > nuke. She might not have backdash to Pot Buster, but between 6P, 2K, and 55 pixel ground throw, I'd start sweating under that kind of pressure.

So I pretty much filled out the wiki. Since I believe that Pichy and I are the only two players here with access to a Vita who are interested in Justice, I've taken his input and added my own to it, and that's what the current state of the wiki essentially is. Feel free to point out contradictions/suggestions/corrections that you'd like made. Or just change it yourself if you want. Everybody can do that.

I've been screwing around with 2H lately, and I think it might end up being one of Justice's most important normals. Not only can you link it into H/D nuke and c.S against heavier opponents, but it also links to j.P, j.K, and j.S. This means that Justice gets free launches and air combos if she can combo into it. Rather than simply being forced to go for knockdown out of it, you can opt to go into something like xx > 2H , j.S > j.D > j.S(1) > H Air Michael Sword, j.H for near knockdown, and j.S(1) > j.D > dj.S(1) > j.D > S Air Michael Sword for far knockdown. So, you know. The usual loafs and margarine. Also, turns out for Corner Throw > 6H > 22S, you can instead do 6H > 22H/D > 22S for a little bit more damage and the same oki opportunity. Against anybody who's not a heavyweight, you can tack on more with 2 or 3 22Ps as well. I'm not expecting her to shoot to top, but I really think she isn't nearly as trash as everybody was writing her off as. No mobility sucks, but there's some pretty sick combo potential that isn't being utilized (obviously because most people capable of playing Justice in tournament likely haven't touched +R training mode). On paper, she honestly sounds good. Amazing set of normals. Pot tier backdash. Decent defense (5 guts for 1.03 defense is a fair trade). Three awesome overdrives. Extremely high meter gain (builds meter faster than Johnny). Ludicrous throw range. Ridiculous damage, good mixup, easy combo execution and can combo from pretty much anywhere kind of easily. Her hitbox was shrunken and they matched her burst startup to AC standards, which is why she and Kliff got the same buff over the patch (and Dead Angle still isn't throw invincible. ). I really hope that I'm right in thinking that, post-console release, she ends up being perceived as better, and players really start wrecking shit with her.

If Pichy is still too busy, I might be able to do a Justice write-up in a little while. I've been playing her quite a bit on the Vita version, but I still need to go over some footage that was posted a while back. She's still not seeing much use. Kliff, on the other hand, has gone beyond my scope. I was thinking that dodge to FB Chop (with its x119 dizzy modifier) was always the best option, but the frame data fails to mention that it doesn't dizzy opponents you hit with it who are sliding...or the fact that you can't cancel into his dodge anyway. Since I'm trying to get the wiki as complete as possible, would you mind if I put character videos on their +R pages as they're released?

I don't think I've ever seen guard balance explained, but after just screw around a bit with trying to find Justice's GB +/- values, it's pretty clear that it affects how much a character's guard bar goes up when blocking a certain move, as if that wasn't suggested by its name already. Sol has a guard balance of 1. The guard bar begins flashing at +65. So, if I hit him with a general level 3 move (+10) when he's at +54, he shouldn't begin flashing. Simple, right? This ends up being the case: he ends up at +64, one point shy of free counter hits. Then we take Chipp, with a guard balance of 1.125. I hit him with a level 3 move when he's also at +54. Bam, the guard gauge starts flashing. So has this ever been written out, explained, or at least examined? I don't see anything about it in the guides. It's a minor thing, but I feel like it's worth at least a bit of explanation. Then we get to my big question. Multi-hit moves seem to have their +GB values scaled when more than one hit of the move is blocked. Example: Sol's 5K is +6 GB on both hits. So, this should total +12 GB. Yet you have an opponent block at +53 GB, and their guard bar doesn't hit +65 GB. From experimenting with other moves, it seems to cut the value in half and round it down. Justice's 6H is +20 GB on both hits, yet only +30 GB when both hits of a single 6H are blocked in sequence. Furthermore, moves seem to inflict more guard bar increase against airborne opponents, just as they inflict more blockstun. Against grounded Sol, Justice's j.S does +8 GB, but in the air it does +10 GB. j.H against grounded does +15 GB, against air it's +20 GB. Even more interesting is that moves also seem to draining the guard bar further than normal when the guard bar is flashing (+65 GB or higher). Sol's 5P does -8 GB on hit. So, with a guard bar of +73, it'd make sense to think that a single 5P would bring the guard bar down to +65, keeping it flashing. Yet, this isn't the case. It doesn't go down to non-flashing (+64) unless the GB is set to +82, meaning that, when flashing, Sol's 5P has a -GB value of 18, which is 10 points higher than its listed value of -8 GB. The same is to be said of 5K, c.S, f.S, and 2S (all level 3 moves), -7 GB normally and -17 GB when flashing. 10 point difference. j.P (level 1, airborne), is -8 GB normally, -18 GB when flashing. 10 point difference. j.K, j.S, and j.H(1) (level 3, airborne), are -7 GB normally, -18 GB when flashing. 11 point difference. j.D (level 4, airborne), is -6 GB normally, -16 GB when flashing. 10 point difference. 5H, 2H (level 5), -6 GB normally, -16 GB when flashing. 10 point difference. 5D, normally -20 GB, is -32 GB when flashing. 12 point difference. -This seems to apply to everybody's dust, except Testament's, who's 5D is only -7 GB. Throw, and Wild Throw, normally -6 GB, are the same as when flashing. No difference. Airthrow, normally -6 and -7 GB, are -6 GB (first hit), and -17 GB (second hit) when flashing. No difference first hit, 10 point difference second hit All of these were tested against Sol, with a guard balance of 1, and a guard recovery of normal. I'm sure you can see at this point as to why I'm confused: there doesn't seem to be much consistency here. The game tends to be consistent with its +/-GB values on normals: level 1s are usually +3/-8 GB, level 5s are generally +20/-6 GB, and the inbetweens are easy to see. Thus, higher level moves scale less in addition to generally higher damage and hitstun. But when it comes to +/- GB values on multi-hit moves, airborne opponents, and flashing guard bars, we get inconsistencies. I'd like to know why. So, to summarize it all: -Is it written anywhere as to how Guard Balance works, and can we put this in the wiki? I feel that it's significant enough to warrant mention. -Do we have any formulas/understanding for how +GB scales on multi-hit moves? For how +GB scales on airborne opponents? For how -GB scales on opponents with flashing guard bars? -Putting it all together, though none of this should completely alter how we play the game, I feel that we stand to benefit just from understanding why it works the way it does. If we can do that, we can simplify its explanation and attain a stronger comprehension of GG's guard bar. -Since we cannot accurately measure -GB values with a flashing guard bar for moves we don't know the -GB values of (Kliff and Justice), how can we find those values? Do we need some kind of software that I'm unaware of, or do we just have to wait for the magic ArcSys fairy to provide us with the info? Even though we can guess based on attack level, I'd rather have solid data that can be outright tested.

I don't know how this wasn't mentioned in the frame data, but 6P forces crouching on hit. Since it hits on frame 10 against standing opponents, you can combo into it out of everything that gatlings into it, provided that you're close enough. Since it's also much easier to confirm a combo into H Michael Sword on crouching hit than counter hit, 6P should probably be used in combos a lot when you need to keep the opponent close to setup oki. It obviously also makes for a great reset because it hits on 18 against crouchers (except against Pot), which we've already established with 2K. 2P could also be useful for tick throws, and 6P resets, since it's Justice's only normals that's plus on block (+1).

I was actually going to suggest Pichy for Justice and make some mentions of Kliff, but I hadn't seen him around the Justice section for a while. I'd like to add that Nukes are good for oki (it should be obvious, but wasn't outright stated), and 5K, 2S, and f.S are also good zoning tools, and. Honesly, all of Justice's normals are pretty boss. I dunno if this was mentioned anywhere so I think it should be put here at least, but I'm pretty sure Kliff's old 2H is now his 2S, and vice-versa. The move that relaunches on OTG, where he thrusts his sword into the ground, is now 2S in +R. This obviously isn't evident just by watching videos, but lo and behold, that's how it is on the Vita. 2S to disc and blah blah blah mash buttons congratulations you can play Kliff. Also: -6P does more stun damage than May's. -Crossups all day with 214K and airdash j.H and j.41236S FRC. -Dodge (214P) and 5D increase Kliff's dizzy rating, which can make the dodge fail pretty often. Kliff can never actually dizzy himself, though. -6H does 100 damage. Full charge does 200. Dodge to FB chop does *119 Dizzy damage. I think you know how this goes. -P disc (236P) is good for oki and pressure, + on block. S has huge hitbox but slow startup, causes slide. So yeah, old man and codpiece woman. Shyaa.

I have a pretty generic combo that works on pretty much everybody midscreen, give or take a normal or two. For Order Sol, it would be WT, dash (2H) j.D > j.S SW > dash 2H Jump 8 Sidewinder > c.S > Bandit Revolver, doing around 150 damage. If you're close enough to the corner, you can add another j.S SW, land BR for another ten damage or so. I do this one instead of what I see a lot of JP Sols do (switch the 2H Sidewinder and j.S SW) because often the 2H gets in a screwy position, and they lose the corner knockdown. Generally you can't do 5 Sidewinders out of WT because hitstun gets scaled down too hard, but if you do WT > IAD j.S/j.D > SW, and then do empty Jump Sidewinders, then you can if you get close enough to the corner. How I start WT combos is character specific, but dash j.D SW works for a good chunk of the cast. I use dash 2H j.D SW against characters like Johnny and Robo Ky because of how far they fall and how their hitboxes make it stupid to connect dash j.D instead. I use 2H SW against a few lightweights, especially Baiken because of the same hitbox issue.

I mean, it's cool for dizzy combos in DI, but Dragon Install is still nowhere near worth burning 50% meter for a combo that might dizzy somebody. In other news, Bandit Bringer Clean Hits on Kliff and Zappa crouching. I tried it on Faust but he still just crouches under BB.

Friend of mine lent me his Vita, finally got my hands on the game. I've pretty much been playing nonstop because DUSTLOOP. My god, two things I never thought would be addressed were actually fixed. This makes me extraordinarily happy: -On a lot of lightweights, Corner dashing 5K/c.S > 6P > Gunflame would whiff because they float so damn high. The extra two frames of hitstun fixes this issue and makes me worry less about my combos actually working. Additionally, this also makes it possible to do xx > 6P, 5H > j.D > Dustloop, for higher damage and easier setups than just c.S/2H > j.D. -In AC, landing only the second hit of Bandit Revolver against a grounded opponent was unsafe on hit. The frame dropped from its recovery rectifies this completely, in addition to making it easier to link into 5P/5K on grounded counter hit, or for BR Loops in general. AIR BR, on the other hand, still has the same issue: hitting without landing the first hit on a grounded opponent is still unsafe on hit, but you really shouldn't be using AIR BR that way anyway. However, I STILL don't get the 6H nerf. This move used to actually be worth it on hit, but now it's outright garbage. The ONLY thing it goes into is FB Fafnir for knockdown, or GV if you didn't combo into 6H, which doesn't make any sense because you shouldn't be using it by itself (or ever). They could have just nerfed the stagger a little, but now I have absolutely ZERO reason to use this move, even on punish. Overall, though, I'm quite satisfied with j.S having no prorate and with Dustloop going into whatever the fuck. To address to some earlier questions, double Clean Hit Bandit Bringer unfortunately doesn't lead into much of Sidewinder Loop, as it cuts out so much hitstun from your SWs. You can, however, go into a whiffed Fafnir > Tyrant Rave and get some seriously gnarly damage off of it (I think 303 against Sol in the corner for 75% meter? 2 GF FRCs to ClBB). That might not seem like it's worth it, but only one GF FRC > ClBB to Fafnir (whiff) Tyrant Rave does around 250, which is easy damage if they're almost dead and you don't want to risk messing up anything harder. Additionally, though you get a clean hit from FB Fafnir, two clean hits already makes it pretty damn hard to actually Clean Hit a FB Fafnir for some reason, and the 70% forced prorate on Fafnir in general doesn't really make it worth it; you're better off whiffing the Fafnir and going straight to Tyrant Rave. Which I love, btw. TR might be unsafe on block now but it links into 5K in the corner so you can actually knock down out of it. I don't know if I can go back to regular AC, now.

Nope, it's pretty much just, "delayed until further notice. Deal."

GG's Rip2ya, shoutout to 3 hour sets.

For those of you not in the know, we've got a bit of an update. Japan Arcade is still alive and kicking, and there just so happens to be a casual meetup again this Friday, the 31st. The Guilty Gear cabinet is ready for quarters, as are all the other machines, like Blazblue and Melty Blood. We've also got Virtual On: Oratorio Tangram, which is the best mech game ever. Show up! Play the best games ever; we've already got a bunch of other people ranging in skill levels, so anybody in the LA area or nearby who has absolutely no experience with Guilty Gear is as likely to find as rewarding a time as people looking for some worthy matches. Bring yourself and some quarters.