seyu

calling it 6-4 is a bit early i think. especially if you didnt have enough matches against her to determine that. makoto doesnt have a hard time to get out of carls pressure. her 2as are fast enough, the DP has its uses sometimes and parry can be used against everything except that DD where nirvana attacks. also youre underestimating her damage by a long shot. going from whats possible at max her midscreen damage ranges from about 3k to 5k(6k with DD ender) i wont doubt that makotos matchup against carls is kinda bad, but it kinda urges me to counter unorganized arguments like those you posted. p.s. nirvanas ball is so slow that you can parry easily. i had a guy do that to me, stupid off screen fireballs...still even i could counter them

sorry, but when is 5B gonna hit 3C? when im close to a litchi online this usually works pretty well, cant remember getting hit with 5B wehn doing 3C at all also: does makotos j.B beat litchis j.b[m]? i like doing IAD j.b>DP as a match opener and i had it work against the last few litchis i fought.

actually NVM

ill print that out and carve it into my BBCS disk. god i hope it works. fine work man

alright thanks for the answer and sorry for beein offtopic. also: comet canon swallows mus lazers

ive noticed that, too. especially those 3Cs from haku. theres rarely anyone good enough to do TK hotaru inbetween my blockstrings. anyway, coming from above is mostly a good idea, hakus only options there are block and counter if you go in with j2C. this gets predictable pretty fast though. against high jump ins makotos jB works wonders sometimes as long as you stay underneath haku. comet canon is dumb in most situations since its stupidly easy to cut... this matchup really is shit, especially if youre the one whos forced to approach and haku just sits there building meter...

ya i was just joking anyway. i havent fought a really serious mu yet anyway. ... um risking to sound dumb here, but: whens that patch thing going to happen anyway? i allways just hear 6 month after blaaa. but noone really defines when the startpoint for those 6 month was...

so finally a favorable matchup?XD

conditioning you opponent with 3Cs when they set steins is kinda good. usually yiour follow up combo even evades the steins shot. theyll soon start setting steins in the air and 214C~j2C will stop them easily. i havent been counter hitted much when going in with 214 moves in general though, even when mus on the ground. could just be luck though

is it hard to be harder then tsubaki or noel for tager? i mean at leas rachel can zone...a bit

i wrote ground projectiles. of course you rather use it on reaction against jCs. the reast can be beaten with makotos jB which is actually a pretty good air to air, the hitbox is just weird. also im not quite sure, but i think makotos 2A is faster, but dont quote me on that

that sounds kinda unreasonable. first there is no reason why jin could zone makoto. sehs got her parry, 3C which goes under all ground projectiles and her own projectile, which can beat out jins. his range may be better, but everyones range is better then makotos. in the air jins got an advantage with his jC, makoto has an aerial DP though from which she can combo after CH. some of her approaches are hardly usable gainst jins DPs, but the ones she has on the ground can be used like agains everybidy else.

also had some nice matches against a few good tagers, heres what i got out of it: working with aerials is allways good, most tagers arent fast enough with atomic collider or backdash. if you do it to often it can be to your advantage. if magnetized(pretty much unavoidable i fear) 3C is pretty damn good. dash into 3C will mostly provoke 5Ds and go straigt under them. same goes for spark bolt. if hes got full magnet gauge keep away and dash at him right into 3C, havent fought a tager it didnt work against. vmoet canon for oki is also good, even if it cant prevent 360s it keeps him occupied or makes him tech forward or back and you can apply mixup. just stay out of his 360 range. even dash ins with 2A worked for me guess it depends on the reaction time of your OP oh yea and dash>BBS also catches many counter attempts edit2: and also when tager goes for that elbow drop you can try to 3C under him to cross up, since the kick will change directions when you switch sides

like just 5D? o never even tried that thanks:)

played a few rachels. most were jsut a piece of cake, even if they occasionally CHed me her combos rarely do more then 2k damage. i met one really good guy though, forgot his name, he kept me occupied with projectiles so i couldnt approach through the air and constantly had george and the pumkin out without really leaving big holes in his defense. i dont have much expecience with the matchup, but id say keep your fingers away from 3C, be mobile so she cant set up her sword lilys and stuff and if you appreach through the air dont go for IADs, most rachels from CT know how to deal with that anyway.

so what do you guys do against 4D? i find it incredibly hard to approach noels that just react to your approaches with 4D. i tried to stop short and punish with break shot, but that takes a bit to long. the rest of makotos normals cant really reach her. j2C clashes(best case scenario), but since noel is on the ground already and youre not she got the advantage. so yea what to do? just sit there and wait for the noel to approach?

i was playing two pretty good noels yesterday. they gave me some tips what to do: you got hardly any way to go through her 5D. only way is IAD CC or j2C. -her unsafe drives are: spring raid(upward kick) easy to punish. -the thing where she throws her gun at you>block and corona upper. -her overhead, the axekick>also corona upper after block. still i also lost gainst some stupid drive spammer noel today. match was laggy, but still it was annoying. youre not damned to block though. dashing in with 2a(or 5a) is also okay. but still those two prorate your combos heavily and you cant do the corner combos with 214C~D, cause theyll be able to tech out.

ill write here what i wrote in the "approaching with makoto"-thread: fought a good noel, its hard to approach her. 5d sometimes goes through her drive and hits, hard to time though and only possible if they try to go in with a drive attack. faster then her drive and good for combos is 5CC. 3C is kinda bad cause it loses to pretty much any of her attacks, except her projectile thingy. if theyre scared to counter its okay. j2C is alright though, but dont get predictable cause it loses to any air attack. makes a nice overhead though

its also noteworthy that you can run up and 3C under any of his projectiles on the ground and CH him before he recovers. leads into 2C>2D and good damage in the corner.

keep blocking and counter his slow moves with A or D DP works for me most of the rime...its not failsave though...so utilize the P2 start button to practice maybeXD

haha alright, alright ill give you that. And sorry for the spelling and grammar mistakes i dont look out for my written language to much, my written german looks even worse thoughXD I guess ill go train a little more, its just kinda hard to find someone whos actually good in this here(just moments ago i had friends lamenting over challenge cause they couldnt beat the 3. one of any cahracter...)

i think you mean 10 frames right? also that goes for most overheads right? her damage is a known problem alread, i dont think theres a point to complaining about her damage from an overhead when the rest of her damage sucks too. ill admit that 6B is shit though... also for the last argument: thats what everybody else is doing too. excet for the unblockables, but with some other gimmicks. also you can pretty much beat anything with a reversal or a gold burst. noones immune to that and if its about baiting that stuff tsubaki can do that too.

if course i understand what your all saying. especially the argument that pretty much every other char has moves that simply outclass hers. ill admit though that i wasnt quite aware of her mixup problems. online i got no problem mixing up my opponents not cause im that good, but because simply noone seems to be able to IB online. and in offline practice the computer is way to fast for mixup anyway. so yea, but whats so bad about her mixup then? shes got an overhead, that isnt all that easy to distinguish and not to slow, one fast low and one deceptive low6B>_>, charge chancel and throws. Kinda like this discussion:3

oh come on. this really is kinda pathetic. where does all the complaining come from? theres so much nice stuff tsubaki can do. her A DP isnt as bad as people say, shes fast, can cover distance well, is good up close, has good air to ground and ground to air, good poke hitconformable at max reach on CH, charge cancels etc etc bla. its like everyone has already decided that shes second only to rachel for CS' biggest looser. but only because she doesnt have any attacks that can be thrown out mindlessly doesnt make her a bad character.