Bedman Q&A/FAQ thread: People play this guy I swear!

[TagAnarchy]

I get what you mean. I suppose one of the biggest hurdles in learning Bedman getting accustomed to his "airdash" and how to choose which task/Deja Vu to use in a given situation. His starting combos aren't difficult, so worry about movement first.

[Diveman]

Same as the guy befor me I'm trying to pick up Bedman. I have exp in marevl using morrigan/mags so I know a bit about movement options. My question is, what are some very very basic tips to play neutral with him plus some basic oki/mixups I can do? (besides 6HS)

 

thanks a lot

[Poultrygeist]

Movement...okay let's see.  First of all, understand that Bedman's movement is very different from the rest of the cast.  You say you play Marvel, so think of how Doom's dash kinda has that slower, clunkier effect to it, that's Bedman's dash.  However, Bedman's dash isn't so much for movement as it is for its special properties.  If your opponent attacks you during this dash's active frames, you'll disappear and teleport up to them, sort of like a parry.  His walk speed is notably faster than some characters, and he can crawl if you need to move slowly or go under stuff.  But by far his most notable movement options are his air ones.  If you press 8 in the air, Bedman will go into a "hanging" state in the air where he'll hover.  The next direction you press will send him flying that way, like an air dash but not quite.  It's worth noting that unlike most characters who can only airdash forward or backwards, Bedman can move in any of 8 ways.  Furthermore, since it's not a "true" air dash, you can actually FD while moving, which is something no other character in the game can do.  If you want to do a "IAD" your input would be something like 886, this way you go into hang state ASAP by double tapping 8 and then you instantly move forward.  Also remember that if you want to do an attack at the earliest possible point of air movement, use the button as part of the input, for example 886K.  Experiment and get used to this, it's a little awkward at first but once you get it down you realize just how much freedom of movement you have.

[TagAnarchy]

Bedman's movement is kind of iffy since he has no grounded dash and his airdash is particular, so on a basic level that is pretty recommended to learn first.

I'll just cliffnote the rest:

*On a basic level with his moves, 2K and 5S work as very good pokes that you'll be using a lot.
*2P>2S is a frame trap that I've had a lot of success with, especially since 2S can be canceled into sweep (2D) now.
*(Task B > Deja Vu B > YRC > 6HS) is one of the best setups that doesn't involve using his airdash mid screen. If you do the 6HS close enough, you'll cross them up letting the Deja Vu hit and giving you time to follow up with whatever. Alternatively, you can do the 6HS from further away so it doesn't cross for the same result if unblocked.

[NecroTheReaper]

Mixup options, you have 2K, 2S, and 2D as lows, and 5D and air moves as highs (with j.D being an instant overhead).  For left-right, you have 6H as well as some trickier usage of air dash FDing into j.K or j.S.

 

For movement, first I'd say determine if its better to keep a distance to setup DV seals or just try to use smart airdashes to close in.  Bedman has good tools, but so does every other character.  You cant just pick one way or the other (also depends on opponents playstyle with their character).  Airdashing into FD is a pretty safe way to follow a task A.  Typically it puts you at a very awkward angle to be airgrabbed while not forcing you to commit to movement.  Tk task B is also a decent movement option.  Its fast, gives you a KD, and sets up a seal.  It is unsafe if blocked however and has some landing recovery, so either make sure they are either blocking a returning task A or arent close enough to punish.  

[Tiamat]

Same as the guy befor me I'm trying to pick up Bedman. I have exp in marevl using morrigan/mags so I know a bit about movement options. My question is, what are some very very basic tips to play neutral with him plus some basic oki/mixups I can do? (besides 6HS)

 

thanks a lot

air to air: j.P and j.S

j.P for speed and j.S for range

main ground pokes: 2P, 2K, f.S, 2S

Which ones are better depends on the matchup.  If opponent character has low invulnerable moves like Axl 6H or Millia 6K you should use more 2P or f.S.  Be careful with f.S as the whiff recovery is pretty bad on it.  If they jump over it you're probably gonna get hurt.

anti air: 6P

Other than 236P you shouldn't use his specials a lot during neutral. air 236S can be whiffed safely if you're going over them sometimes it depends.  Try not to use 236H much unless you know you'll be able to whiff it safely (like a ball return is covering you).  It's not a very good anti air and loses to air normals often if you try to use it for that.

Oki mixups there are a lot of things you can do.  Midscreen you can do 6H setups from 2P or 2K gatlings, or from a blocked jump in.  You can also just use it on it's own on a waking up opponent.  From an air throw 6H will crossup even in the corner.  From 2D you can try for a 6H setup or you can do 236K, or you can try to meaty some normal or a safejump.  j.D RC into combo is good.

From a 236S knockdown you can do 981 j.S (safejump if done properly), 981 j.H whiff 2K, 983 j.H whiff 2K (crosses over), 2369K, or walk back tiny bit then 214S into something (or you can YRC it).  If they are knocked down in corner you can try for 214S repeats in short blockstrings.

From 236H knockdown you can do 214H and then meaty 5K/c.S into 983 j.H whiff 2K or 983 j.S or whatever.  You can also 214H then walk forward and grab them before the 214H connects.  In corner you can get a meterles combo with 214H 2D > f.S 5H 236H.  You can YRC 214H and do j.D/2D mixup in corner into a combo.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Tiamat

[NecroTheReaper]

Addition of 214H, you can end a combo with 236H and do an immediate 214H which hits meaty.  Then you can do either 236P or 236K and get up to 3 seals placed depending on the combo used.

[Verimeloni]

While moving is the first tricky thing to learn about Bedman, one thing I'd say you should definitely learn is to capitalize on throws, especially in the corner 'cause combos off of throws reset djv-icons and deal good damage. Also Bedman seems to have one of the largest throw ranges among the cast, which really benefits his throw/mixup game.

[GKHiryu]

While moving is the first tricky thing to learn about Bedman, one thing I'd say you should definitely learn is to capitalize on throws, especially in the corner 'cause combos off of throws reset djv-icons and deal good damage. Also Bedman seems to have one of the largest throw ranges among the cast, which really benefits his throw/mixup game.

I second that, but keep it simple in the beginning. For the most part think about having an advantageous situation rather than raw damage. The basic combo after throw in corner is T>5S>5H(1hit)>236H. Works reliably and leaves you with your opponent in the corner and a DVC seal ready to activate. Late you'll learn better combos that deal more damage and set up 2 seals, but with Bedman there's a lot to learn in neutral and that's where you should focus more at the beginning imo.

 

Tips:

j.236P (or even 2369P) goes low to the ground - a perfect IAD bait when used full screen.

2/3H - Use often, but not in a predictable fashion, always cancel into jump or Deja Vu

In mid range you can mix it up a bit by using quick ADDF S/K/P and ADDB/ADD > Land > 2S/2H.

Setting seals is more important than everything else. You can for example do j.K > j.S and if you confirm your attacks get blocked, just cancel into air task A.

On the above note, j.P/j.K/j.S can be cancelled into air dash on hit and block. Use that to keep moving and again - stray from being predictable.

Edited August 17, 2015 by GKHiryu

[Blade]

Can someone maybe give me some pointers on his 8-way dash?

I was playing against someone named "PillowFightKing" the other day and he was all over the place... even did some kinda mid-air YRC that lets him get across the screen really really fast.

He used j.P, j.K, and j.S a lot, but I don't know what inputs he used in 8-way or how to practice it.

Jumping is pretty much my weak point with Bedman, so I mostly stick to ground combos or quick air combos with him.

[Verimeloni]

if you're in the air you can do j.236s yrc to get across the screen quickly

his air movement is tricky to learn, it takes time get accustomed to inputting 8 every now and then. (to be honest I tried to play bedman in xrd 1.0 but gave up 'cause I just couldn't figure out his air dash, I play him now 'cause they made it easier in the patch)

canceling his air normals with his command dash and connecting a new normal is sorta like a link, you shouldn't mash them. they just require practice, j.p j.k and j.s all have a slightly different timing where you can cancel them. if it's your weak area you know that's something you've got to practice to improve your overall game.

you can practice them by starting from easy air combos and then moving on to more difficult ones:

midsreen: throw rrc 6p c.s 9j.p j.s jc.9 j.p j.s j.236s (very basic, can setup an air throw tech situation in the corner with correct height. you can spice this one up by replacing j.p j.s with j.k j.s or j.p j.k)

corner: throw f.s 9j.k j.s jc.3 j.s 236hs (basic corner throw combo, when you've got the hang of this you can practice the more advanced versions which have more reps of j.s)

on potemkin & bedman midscreen: c.s 5hs(2) 1hs 9j.s jc.3 j.s (6p) 236hs (again pretty basic, 9j.s 3j.s isn't hard)

on medium weight characters (sol chipp etc.) midscreen: c.s 5hs(2) 1hs 9sj. j.k jc.3 j.s 236hs (2p c.s 9j.p j.236s) (this is a bit harder already, air dash canceling from j.k might seem impossible at first but remember, it's a link, you just have to practice the timing)

 

well this post got long, I hope I could be of any assistance

Edited September 1, 2015 by Verimeloni

[Blade]

To be honest combos like those aren't a big deal so much as throwing out jumping normals from low angles (example: 8 3 j.S or 8 1 j.P).

What usually happens is I stay in the air too long doing these "instant overhead" tricks and get punished or airthrown or something like that.

[Tiamat]

Why are you getting punished or air thrown though?  Is it happening during neutral or are you doing your oki wrong?

[Blade]

It happens in Neutral situations, but I see lots of Bedman's doing jump moves as part of their offense game, so I'm not sure how good an idea it is.

[TagAnarchy]

I think a lot of it is training your opponent to respect it and not using it all too often in neutral. Use it too often, and they'll start to learn the setup and find holes in it to exploit.

[GcYoshi13]

It happens in Neutral situations, but I see lots of Bedman's doing jump moves as part of their offense game, so I'm not sure how good an idea it is.

It's crucial. His ground buttons do not have enough reach for speed to be considerably dangerous on the ground. He has a lot of options in the air.

I don't know how you are getting thrown, but Bedman's air buttons make him very difficult to be air thrown during its active frames.

Don't use them like an "instant" overhead. Your IOH is jD. You hover right above your opponents during oki set-ups. In neutral, you will set yourself up for anti-airs or air throws if you hover predictably near your opponent.

[Lynxfort]

1-what is his best burst punish combo ??
2- When i should use jP ?? and when i do jS instead. what optimal situation i should use each one ?
"in jP case i know it's useful in air to air but is there other use ??"
3- in wiki  it says that air Task C is ±0[+3] on block..now i tested it by doing it then do 2P"which is 5F" against on sol's cl.S(5F)..it trade..from what i understand i should be in 3 fr+ so my 2p should be like 2F against sol..

[Tiamat]

37 minutes ago, Lynxfort said:

1-what is his best burst punish combo ??
2- When i should use jP ?? and when i do jS instead. what optimal situation i should use each one ?
"in jP case i know it's useful in air to air but is there other use ??"
3- in wiki  it says that air Task C is ±0[+3] on block..now i tested it by doing it then do 2P"which is 5F" against on sol's cl.S(5F)..it trade..from what i understand i should be in 3 fr+ so my 2p should be like 2F against sol..

1 - for something that is usually reliable I suggest f.S 236H

2 - pick j.P or j.S based on distance.  j.P is faster so use that if you're in range for it.  Use j.S if you're further away.

3- advantage on air Task C is based on how high up bedman was.  If you do it from very high up you'll be at frame advantage.

[Verimeloni]

Been editing the wiki a little, the hemijack description is pretty wild lol

[TagAnarchy]

Just read it and I'm amused. I vote we keep it as. :p

[GcYoshi13]

I had some fun with that.

[NecroTheReaper]

I'm just gonna add in that unless the frame data is wrong, 5H is gapless into j.D unless on IB (which is a 2f gap).  So if theyre not IBing it, its a guaranteed 50/50.

[GcYoshi13]

14 hours ago, NecroTheReaper said:

I'm just gonna add in that unless the frame data is wrong, 5H is gapless into j.D unless on IB (which is a 2f gap).  So if theyre not IBing it, its a guaranteed 50/50.

Correct. The only thing that will still be a blockstring after the opponent IBs 5H would be 2D.

 

Also Task C technically.

[MLSTRM]

Hmm how does this all fit together? I'm still pretty new to using frame data information.

So 5H is a level 3 move, so if someone normal blocks it then they recover in 16f after active frames end.

The only things you can cancel off 5H are 2H, 5D, 2D, Special and jump.

Bedman has a 3 frame jump startup, and j.D starts up in 11 frames, so instant j.D comes out in 14 frames, 2 frames before blockstun ends and so they have to switch to standing block

2D starts up in 12F, and Task C in 11F so those would also be gapless, and 2D forces them to block low so the string is a true 50/50.

Task B also starts up in 14F, and 1/2H in 15F so would those also be true blockstrings? Obviously 1H/2H are range dependent, and 1H/Task B seem like pretty unsafe options in neutral.

IB lessens blockstun so this doesn't work under IB, but FD has more so you can possibly get some different options from that?

(This is more me just trying to understand how it all works, apologies if its the wrong place for it)

[GcYoshi13]

3 minutes ago, MLSTRM said:

So 5H is a level 3 move, so if someone normal blocks it then they recover in 16f after active frames end.

Correct.

3 minutes ago, MLSTRM said:

Bedman has a 3 frame jump startup, and j.D starts up in 11 frames, so instant j.D comes out in 14 frames, 2 frames before blockstun ends and so they have to switch to standing block

 

An overhead or low can be part of a blockstring, but they will still have to change their switch their block to successfully block it. The general rule of mid block strings is that you can let go of the controller and still be blocking after you blocked correctly the first time.

3 minutes ago, MLSTRM said:

2D starts up in 12F, and Task C in 11F so those would also be gapless, and 2D forces them to block low so the string is a true 50/50.

Yes. If we want to be absolutely technical, the 50/50 can be switch blocked since 2D and jD have a 3 frame difference, allowing you to technically OS or switch block it (basically the opponent rolls their directional inputs at the right time to guard both attacks). Practically speaking, it's pretty much a 50/50.

3 minutes ago, MLSTRM said:

Task B also starts up in 14F, and 1/2H in 15F so would those also be true blockstrings? Obviously 1H/2H are range dependent, and 1H/Task B seem like pretty unsafe options in neutral.

It's true block strings if they don't IB the second hit of 5H (because it's 16 frames of blockstun, which will allow those moves to contact the opponent before they can exit blockstun). 1H is safe because it's jump and special cancelable. Also 1H is a lvl 4 move and has 18 (14 on IB) frames of blockstun. 

3 minutes ago, MLSTRM said:

IB lessens blockstun so this doesn't work under IB, but FD has more so you can possibly get some different options from that?

(This is more me just trying to understand how it all works, apologies if its the wrong place for it)

FD adds to blockstun, so if you react to it to the FD, you can probably push for more interesting frame traps, but 5H is a special case. They have specifically FD the second hit. If they FD the first hit, the second hit of 5H is guaranteed to whiff.

 

You have the right idea for pretty much everything.