smooshman Posted December 12, 2009 Posted December 12, 2009 the best thing I can say about Ragna vs Jin is this: if you stay close to him you will win just keep pressure on Jin and you have a good chance and make sure never ever, get beyond mid range Jin will rape at that range
RushDownScrub Posted December 12, 2009 Posted December 12, 2009 Srry, my advice was given after I fought a friend. Absolute lolz since he IC every moment, we have way to much fun with that. And I know that he can do all sorts of things, but if you both do your 5D at start it will clash, granted he can throw his out again for another clash, and then again a third time because his recovery is better on block. =( Dumb question, but can you 6A IC? Been wanting to test it out but I always ID and go from there, worst fucking habit to break.
smooshman Posted December 12, 2009 Posted December 12, 2009 Srry, my advice was given after I fought a friend. Absolute lolz since he IC every moment, we have way to much fun with that. And I know that he can do all sorts of things, but if you both do your 5D at start it will clash, granted he can throw his out again for another clash, and then again a third time because his recovery is better on block. =( Dumb question, but can you 6A IC? Been wanting to test it out but I always ID and go from there, worst fucking habit to break. as a Jin main I've been knocked off the ice car a few times by 6A but you have to time it right though the best option is to ID straight through it
FlyingVe Posted December 12, 2009 Posted December 12, 2009 Umm... Just block ice car. The recovery on that move is terrible if you block it you can pretty much just push buttons afterwards and get a hit. Also, 5D is a pretty terrible opener because it's so slow and should really only be considered against tager. However jin's 5D is equally slow so any a/b/c move you do will come out faster and CH him. I recommend 5C because of its range and it combos into 6C on CH.
smooshman Posted December 12, 2009 Posted December 12, 2009 Umm... Just block ice car. The recovery on that move is terrible if you block it you can pretty much just push buttons afterwards and get a hit. Also, 5D is a pretty terrible opener because it's so slow and should really only be considered against tager. However jin's 5D is equally slow so any a/b/c move you do will come out faster and CH him. I recommend 5C because of its range and it combos into 6C on CH. well blocking ice car works but if it's 214B then they might 623A which could flip things around and counter you if you didn't punish fast enough though if you block that then... well Jin may have some problems... unless he RC's (which he won't)
RushDownScrub Posted December 13, 2009 Posted December 13, 2009 Blocking IC is never and option, specially his C version since they can come out mashing, plus he has wicked dp, and he stays on the ground, unlike ragna. And recovery is only terrible if the do it in the air, if you block he can touch ground and block if you aren't fast enough. Always beware a smart Jin with 25 heat.
Final Ultima Posted December 13, 2009 Posted December 13, 2009 What? Every version of Musou Senshouzan except for 214A gives you time to hit with a guaranteed 5B after regular block. No Instant Block necessary. 5 frame buffer makes retaliation easier too. Even if you're really bad at timing and let him recover, if he always mashes a Sekkajin or a DP afterwards, that's just as good, because those too are free punishes if you don't eat them. At the end of the day, if a Jin is even doing random Musou Senshouzan in the first place, he shouldn't be the kind of opponent you need to worry about.
smooshman Posted December 14, 2009 Posted December 14, 2009 Instant block all his stuff and you win. isn't that true for everyone except Ragna and Nu?
A.X.I.S. Posted December 14, 2009 Posted December 14, 2009 isn't that true for everyone including Ragna and Nu? yes.
RushDownScrub Posted December 14, 2009 Posted December 14, 2009 What? Every version of Musou Senshouzan except for 214A gives you time to hit with a guaranteed 5B after regular block. No Instant Block necessary. 5 frame buffer makes retaliation easier too. Even if you're really bad at timing and let him recover, if he always mashes a Sekkajin or a DP afterwards, that's just as good, because those too are free punishes if you don't eat them. At the end of the day, if a Jin is even doing random Musou Senshouzan in the first place, he shouldn't be the kind of opponent you need to worry about. Well, then maybe my reaction is slow, and I don't button mash, but every time I try to retaliate one of two things happens. 1) He blocks immediately, and I asdjust my attack to either a low or high depending on how he's positioned. 2) He swings back and Ch me somehow, no RC, nothing, just pure damage, and w/o a DP mind you. Granted we think it might be the controllers, since sometimes the character simply walk in the last direction pressed for a few seconds.
Nakkiel Posted December 14, 2009 Posted December 14, 2009 Keep practicing. Go in to training mode and have Jin do the ice car, land uppercut. Practice hitting him before he can uppercut. It's not hard to IB the slash of the ice car, there's no way for Jin to stop it other than RCing. There's no magical way for him to not get punished without meter. And if it's the controller, get new ones.
RushDownScrub Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 All right, figured out the problem. Barrier blocking is a bit of a habit, so I keep getting pushed out of range, granted my friend no longer plays Jin since I picked him up and went DP crazy. I thought if Jin did C. I.C then he could go into his rapid his C move after landing.
Kain Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 IIRC, Musou/Ice Car B/C/D have like -7 recov. frames on block. So it shouldn't need to be such a problem to punish a Ice Car Jin, especially if you play with someone who spams Ice Car. And there is a reason why Barrier Block is best used in spares rather than extensively. Just saying.
RushDownScrub Posted December 22, 2009 Posted December 22, 2009 Well than maybe I just suck, but it always seems that I can't get proper punish when I blocked it. Also, like I said he no longer plays Jin since I picked him up, reverting to Tager and Nu whom I can now crush thanks to all of you guys' advice.
Skye Posted January 8, 2010 Posted January 8, 2010 Blocking IC is never and option, specially his C version since they can come out mashing, plus he has wicked dp, and he stays on the ground, unlike ragna. And recovery is only terrible if the do it in the air, if you block he can touch ground and block if you aren't fast enough. Always beware a smart Jin with 25 heat. Mash Volcanic Viper.
Icarium Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 I got this game on Christmas (finally!) and have been practicing religiously to de-scrubify myself (still working on it). I played a couple Jins level 30 or so and under... oh man did this thread help. You guys are totally right that ice car and mashy swords is about all they do. I started purposely opening space against this one guy, because I knew he would try to car me as soon as I did. Then it's 5B,5C,2C,214B-214D all day long. Now I just need to learn how to beat drive-mashing Noels.
Kain Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 I got this game on Christmas (finally!) and have been practicing religiously to de-scrubify myself (still working on it). I played a couple Jins level 30 or so and under... oh man did this thread help. You guys are totally right that ice car and mash C xN is about all they do. I started purposely opening space against this one guy, because I knew he would try to car me as soon as I did. Then it's 5B,5C,5D, DC, 6A, j.C, j.D, JC, j.C, j.D, 623D, 236C, 214C all day long. Now I just need to learn how to beat drive-spamming Noels. Fix'd a couple of things cause I'm bored. In all seriousness, it's good that you're using all that info in the matchup threads to fight scrub Jins. Now do the same thing for every character.
Icarium Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 Been trying to stick to the easy BnB combos so far. I need reliability more than I need the damage at this point. The rapid cancel combos are giving me a headache, but I'll get there. The biggest problem I have is that complicated combos in training mode are one thing, and completely another in the real deal. I used to choke in high school sports too... haha. This is a little off the Jin topic, but say you have a chance to punish someone (Jin, for example) with a 5B and no meter. What reliable combo should I do that is stronger than the 5B, 5C, 2C, 214a etc...? The one listed in your post above? Thanks!
excelence Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 5b>6d>(slight delay)j.d>665b>3c>22c>5b>5c>214a>214d you might drop the 22c if u're too far away and just go straight to 665b>5c>214a and regarding dash cancel combos -> 5B,5C,5D, DC, 6A, Hj.C, j.D, JC, j.C, j.D, 623D, 236C, 214C on the 2nd j.d i always get black beat no matter how fast i do the combos, and is it possible to just use normal jump instead of high jump to perform the combo?
What Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 Actually the strongest combo ive done to punish jin with 5b looks like this 5b>6a>5c>5d(1hit)>214b>delay 214d>5c>hjb>jc>jc>jd>623d>236c>214c 3856 damage oh and in this combo 5b>6d>(slight delay)j.d>665b>3c>22c>5b>5c>214a>214d I'm pretty sure the opponent would be able to tech before the part in bold could connect. On a side note I think its generally more favorable to end combos with 22c that way you could dash back in and reapply pressure.
VR-Raiden Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 5b>6d>(slight delay)j.d>665b>3c>22c>5b>5c>214a>214d you might drop the 22c if u're too far away and just go straight to 665b>5c>214a It's worth mentioning that 5B > 6D only works on counter hit of 5B. Also yeah, the 214A>214D doesn't connect after all that, it stops after 5C. and regarding dash cancel combos -> 5B,5C,5D, DC, 6A, Hj.C, j.D, JC, j.C, j.D, 623D, 236C, 214C on the 2nd j.d i always get black beat no matter how fast i do the combos, and is it possible to just use normal jump instead of high jump to perform the combo? That's cause the you can only get 3 air hits here. So just end with your pick of j.C or j.D > ID. And yes, it works if you normal jump too but usually super is better cause you get more hits of the ID to connect. The combo What posted is the strongest free combo for normal blocking ice car, but if you wanna do double 22C stuff you need to instant block so you have time to dash 5B as the punish (unless he was in the corner). But since we're talking about Jin, that involves dash 2A after 22C pick up... edit: Instant block 2nd hit of ice car and you can get 3967 dmg with: 5C, 5D (DC), 6A (JC), j.C, j.D (JC), j.C, ID© or if you're feeling really flashy, IB first hit, CS > combo or BK > combo.
A.X.I.S. Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 yo V-rape if you IB the ice car can you 6C punish? 6C>214B>delay>214D>5B>6A>j.C>J.D>623D>236C>214C work? or really thats what we got i'm just asking because when fighting jin i seem to be stuck doing reg bnb's alot.
VR-Raiden Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 Nah, 6C too slow. 6C is 18 frames, instant blocked B/C/D ice car 2nd hit is -14.
A.X.I.S. Posted January 11, 2010 Posted January 11, 2010 i see, sucks i really wanted to nail 4k meterless of a IB'd IC...that makes me sad.
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