OkiLoki Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 Hakumen is rather well equipped for dealing with bang pressure. Just need to practice instant blocking followed by a counter. And to confirm what poster above me stated if your fast you can 5D bangs J4C crossup.
AtTheGates Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 ..and you can command throw hakus ass is he dares to counter.
OkiLoki Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 Never said you couldn't. Counter is very punishable and i will never argue otherwise. As to the Blockstring 5a/2a 5b 2b 2369D Ragna can Inferno Divider thru them and break the string. Takes quite a bit of timing but it can be done.
DaiAndOh Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 Moved Blade's thread here, as it was mostly Hakumen discussion.
sergetrigger Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 Something I just found out... Hakumen's astral can be activated by a grab...
PhantomX Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 LOL! Sounds like an unfortunate way to discover something, serge XD
sergetrigger Posted September 15, 2009 Posted September 15, 2009 LOL! Sounds like an unfortunate way to discover something, serge XD Lol, I was the Hakumen...
Lord Cruxis Posted November 15, 2009 Posted November 15, 2009 So I'm going to say no one is having trouble with Hakumen? I'm going to say I don't have trouble with intermediat Hakumens, but I only lost to AtomicOffspring a long while ago. But I never faught him again. So I'm not sure what to say if I have improved on the match up. Soooo any one got tips to throw out there. Even though I'm unsure if I need help agaisnt this fight or not :X
WUT Posted November 15, 2009 Posted November 15, 2009 It's been covered. Hakumen is really limited in his approach and has to commit himself to alot of what he does. Granted, the options that he can commit to are really strong, but in the end he's still lacking in options. Example: Hakumen tries to approach. A ground approach is ineffective due to Hakumen's movement restriction and bang's air mobility. So Hakumen's best option for closing the gap is IAD. Now, Hakumen has to use something to pin you down so he can start pressure. This ends up being some form of either IAD j.B or j.C. 1- IAD j.B is safe from Bang's AA, but if you opt to IB you can punish anything he does before he lands, or punish a 6D/2D that Hakumen will mash out once he notices you punishing IAD j.B. 2- IAD j.C is 5D/2D bait. Only jump, delayed airdash j.C lets Hakumen land in time to guard it, which loses to 5A if it isn't done from far out. If Hakumen does a straight up IAD j.C he has to cancel to his DP (j.214B) to be "safe". Personally I have trouble at this point, as I have a hard time punishing j.214B before Hakumen mashes out a counter. Guess I need to TK command throw more. 3- IAD j.214B/j.D. Hakumen's "answers" to Bang's AA. Both of these are incredibly unsafe should they whiff, but j.214B leads to quite a bit of damage should it hit and j.D gives Hakumen damage and resets the situation for him. You won't see these two options until conditioning has set in (or if they're scrubby). Everything else is pretty much "don't get hit by stupid shit". Don't eat his overhead into 5K damage. Don't get hit by the 3rd 6A he throws in a row after you baited the first two with double jump and air dash. Always break throws (especially IAD throw). Don't get hit by roll, 214B (first hit has 9F startup and a deceptively large range). And don't take obvious baits so that Hakumen can counter you.
ShoMeYaMoves Posted November 15, 2009 Posted November 15, 2009 2- IAD j.C is 5D/2D bait. Only jump, delayed airdash j.C lets Hakumen land in time to guard it, which loses to 5A if it isn't done from far out. If Hakumen does a straight up IAD j.C he has to cancel to his DP (j.214B) to be "safe". Personally I have trouble at this point, as I have a hard time punishing j.214B before Hakumen mashes out a counter. Guess I need to TK command throw more. This is, in my opinion as well, is the trickiest part of the matchup since getting that CH 5D or 2D really makes the matchup goes smoothly and 214B can mess that up. I've found alot of success with 2D the j.C>very late A teleport. You're teleporting during the 214B active frames and you arrive late enough to punish it before j.D. Doesn't work every time, but it's been pretty dependable for me. Just so long as you watch out for the empty IAD>land and grab if you're starting to 2D predictably.
Lord Cruxis Posted November 15, 2009 Posted November 15, 2009 Ahh ok thank you. I guess I am a little fine. But who knows. I just got to play him more.
Mr. Hammerfist Posted November 23, 2009 Posted November 23, 2009 How well do Nails work on Hakumen players? Are they a viable tactic to use to try and catch them off guard? When I was playing, I'd get airborn, away from Hakumen of course, throw three nails and, if they hit, air dash towards them and punish.
ShoMeYaMoves Posted November 23, 2009 Posted November 23, 2009 How well do Nails work on Hakumen players? Are they a viable tactic to use to try and catch them off guard? When I was playing, I'd get airborn, away from Hakumen of course, throw three nails and, if they hit, air dash towards them and punish. That's a very bad idea against Hakumen; he can drive the nails and Bang himself is automatically grabbed by the counter if you follow them into range of it.
Mr. Hammerfist Posted November 23, 2009 Posted November 23, 2009 That's a very bad idea against Hakumen; he can drive the nails and Bang himself is automatically grabbed by the counter if you follow them into range of it. He can grab me with the counter even if the nails hit him? Glad no one did that to me while I actually did that.
zeth07 Posted November 23, 2009 Posted November 23, 2009 He can grab me with the counter even if the nails hit him? Glad no one did that to me while I actually did that. No, what happens is they can Counter the nails and as you dash in you will get caught in the Counter animation (started by the nails) because you were within range. You are talking about if they nails actually hit him and then you dash in. In which case you probably have to be close to him anyway to continue a combo off the nails, or he will just be able to Drive Counter or just plain Counter you with another move after the nails anyway even if he got hit. So you can see why it would be a waste to use the D Nails like that.
Mr. Hammerfist Posted November 24, 2009 Posted November 24, 2009 Right. Thank you. And also, what's a strategy against Hakumen when I use Bang Install?
zeth07 Posted November 24, 2009 Posted November 24, 2009 Right. Thank you. And also, what's a strategy against Hakumen when I use Bang Install? 3.5 Choices: 1) Play hit and run - Because Hakumen is so slow and some of his moves are fairly unsafe and Bang in FRKZ is so mobile, you can literally bait moves and move in to punish him quickly. Then you could go for the usual mix-up or be safe and just back off and bait/punish again. *.5*) Run away - Get a size-able lead, have a good amount of nails in stock, and just run away the rest of the fight. When you jump in the air / double jump in the air and then do a TK'd A Nail the glide will take you across the screen. You just have to be careful because more than likely you will be in Negative Penalty and him being Hakumen 2 hits would turn the match around. I only give it half a choice because it is fairly hard (in my opinion) and it makes you look like a jerk to some people. But in a win at all costs environment or a just having fun environment if you can successfully do it, then why not. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM2o6_YCLkg&feature=related#t=1m19s 2) Rush him down...more...? - Again the mobility. Hakumen is so slow by comparison to Bang in FRKZ you can pretty much lock him down if you are good enough at controlling FRKZ, you just have to watch for the Counters. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5LaxMRkFdM#t=2m52s 3) A combination of 1 and 2.
Justice7541 Posted November 24, 2009 Posted November 24, 2009 Hakumen's got no reversal. He's got counters, but no universal one, so he's going to have to guess no matter what he does. Mix him up with crossups, overheads, and lows and generally BS him once you get Bang Install. Unless he manages to land a counter he isn't going anywhere unless you get bored and decide to run the timer instead. Which I end up doing a lot for the lulz, though it is a bit more difficult than it looks.
Mr. Hammerfist Posted November 24, 2009 Posted November 24, 2009 Thanks for the help everybody. I really appreciate it.
RushDownScrub Posted December 12, 2009 Posted December 12, 2009 How long is autoguard on daifunka? I've looked around and might have missed it, but my friend used a full power judgement on me, the big slash that crosses the screen, and it knocked me out of daifunka. He didn't win, but that was gonna be the game winning blow and somehow I haven't been able to block it since....
kenn305 Posted February 17, 2010 Posted February 17, 2010 How long is autoguard on daifunka? I've looked around and might have missed it, but my friend used a full power judgement on me, the big slash that crosses the screen, and it knocked me out of daifunka. He didn't win, but that was gonna be the game winning blow and somehow I haven't been able to block it since.... Daifunka is not an autoguard but it does have ALOT of invincibility frames *24 frames to be exact*. Sorry if this is not helping.
kenn305 Posted April 27, 2010 Posted April 27, 2010 well i dont feel like reading all the other posts before but let me say something -plz if you dont agree then reply dont flame, that is what this thread is about- LET'S GO if hakuman is 6a happy or predicts you are going to dashing in with a J.C then dash and throw and spider shuriken and a free counter hit combo right here -plz dont spam this as a bang player, not even that, just playing a fighting game DONT EVER BE PREDICTABLE!!!- haku 2C and 6D beats this if he predicts this ok if you notice hakuman IB and 2D in the middle of your block string then set a bumper as soon as he IB so that he would have to recover after whiffing 2D and do the following bnb 5b-2b-623b-dash-5b-2b-then air combo. also if you predict 2d then 5C then DAIFUNKA of course if you do not want to take the risk then 5C-Dnail- if your opponent was blocking then basically after Dnail your blockstring is rested......if they get hit then do this 5C-Dnail-dash-5a-5b-2b-2c-6d-236b and of course FRKZ -finish this post later
NedDestros Posted June 1, 2010 Posted June 1, 2010 I'm having trouble when I try to crossup my friend with 2A 5B 2B IAD crossover j.4C... Whenever i do that he always mashes A and always gets me knocked out of the pressure string. I can manage to fake out and backdash j.236A but i can never land a decent combo on him due to this annoyance. Should I do anything different?
BigLeafyTree Posted June 1, 2010 Posted June 1, 2010 If he mashes his 5A whenever you jump cancel your 2B, try a j.D or throwing D nails. After D nails you can continue mixup if necessary. If he's just mashing 5A in general, gatling 2B into 2D/5D/2C. One neat thing you can try is doing a superjump cancel off of 2B, D nails, air dash j.B/j.C since the extra height will give you time to dash before landing.
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