[CS1] Carl Clover Tactical Discussion/Questions/Help

[greystorm780]

yeah i play ps3 and i have D on R1, i have since i started playing. the volante rep seems impossible no matter what controller/stick i have

[Mr Oso]

I honestly dont use the 4D/Volante loops(Though i really want to sometimes) and usually just got for guaranteed damage(2D Loopz/Sandwhich).

It really is going to come down to checking your spacing and using moves that lead to the 4D/Volante stuff easier.

All i can really say is keep messing around with it and try to find that sweet spot.

Im sure someone else here could give you a better anwser though TBH . . . .

[greystorm780]

well sounds good bro, im trying to get ready for the ranbats in my area and i want to be prepared

[ZONG_one]

Honestly, you've just got to hit training mode HARD for a few hours straight each night until you get those hard things you're trying to get.

No other advice from me.

[greystorm780]

that's probably what im gonna have to end up doing, thanks for the help

[Mascarpone]

Kinda? I'm definitely using that instead 4D now for my sandwich crossup that jizz was awesome XD.

Probably good to use both since using one or another too often has an element of predictability ;D

[ZONG_one]

that's probably what im gonna have to end up doing, thanks for the help

Sorry if that sounded jerk-ish/whatever.

It's just that since it's an execution issue, and not something matchup/experience related, training mode is the only way you're going to be able to grind that out.

I think it's safe to say that's what we all had to do.

[njmamm]

Probably good to use both since using one or another too often has an element of predictability ;D

Well, I mean, they're both just crossup resets... 3D is just easier to combo from. (Never really did learn those 4D combos ;-; )

[greystorm780]

yeah i know i do understand what you mean, its just frustrating because i have been playing him since BBCT came out

[Zoogstin]

yeah i know i do understand what you mean, its just frustrating because i have been playing him since BBCT came out

Doesn't matter. Carl's combos are harder than the throw loop. My hands hurt for 2 weeks trying to learn his CS combos.

[greystorm780]

i never learned the throw loop because i thought the throw loop was stupid. doing one thing to win is boring, i like sandwiching them and mixing them up

[njmamm]

i never learned the throw loop because i thought the throw loop was stupid. doing one thing to win is boring, i like sandwiching them and mixing them up

high five bro XD

[greystorm780]

high five bro XD

hahaha thanks =D

[Mascarpone]

Well, I mean, they're both just crossup resets... 3D is just easier to combo from. (Never really did learn those 4D combos ;-; )

the more complex suff is a bit brain shaking but off a 4D starter it's pretty easy to get 3k-ish off just doing a rep or few of 2D loop into allegretto 8]D[ and generally you get 2-3k off of 1 ground loop (character Dependant lol) so even if you aren't doing the fanciest of stuff a 4D reset into a 2D loops is like 5k total damage (more if you have meter) + KD so it's nothing to be scoffed at. except by the super pros who don't fall for resets apparently lol. They may scoff all they like.

[njmamm]

Eh, I don't know. I've always felt more comfortable on the ground (lol obviously) but I guess I'll switch it up with 4D if I'm feeling confident. But really, all I have to do is practice.

[Mascarpone]

yeah the ground is a more comfy place to be. I'd say too that you have more options to be creative with on the ground but if you can do the air stuff it is much more definite damage, alas. You can't predict your way out of a k juggle like you can 2 3k resets.

[Zoogstin]

i never learned the throw loop because i thought the throw loop was stupid. doing one thing to win is boring, i like sandwiching them and mixing them up

Honestly I think that is great, really. But you mentioned a couple of times that you've been playing Carl since CT like it should automatically make doing his CS combos easier. I'm just saying if you didn't practice the throw loop then you have no idea how hard his 5k-7k CS combos are.

[Kyle]

i find the toughest part to be the spacing... like the execution can be flawless but standing just a few pixels to close/far away and the combo drops at a numerous locations.

I have been playing around with the big one lately zoogstin... i seem to drop on the J.B/J.C, 4]D[ part too often...

[ioKain]

Just to add a little to the learning Carl's more damaging loops. I just started playing Carl about a month and a half ago. There are so many different variations to the 2D loops that it seemed really overwhelming at first. So what I did was learn the simplest variation to the 2D loop and I left it alone for awhile and focused on learning resets and mixups. While in training mode resets n mixups were my main priority and towards the end of my sessions I would try some more advanced combos, but spend very little time on them. Low and behold, literally last weekend at the end of a training session I thought I would try out 5C, Volante, and something just clicked. I couldn't believe it and I ended up in training for about an hour longer, lol. I guess what I'm trying is if you really wanna learn his 2D loops and you don't have great execution like me. Learn the easiest 2D loop and then just let the other stuff come naturally. I think it was just a combination of patience while building up my execution with other Carl stuff. Most importantly, don't give up!

[soujiro seta]

the more complex suff is a bit brain shaking but off a 4D starter it's pretty easy to get 3k-ish off just doing a rep or few of 2D loop into allegretto 8]D[ and generally you get 2-3k off of 1 ground loop (character Dependant lol) so even if you aren't doing the fanciest of stuff a 4D reset into a 2D loops is like 5k total damage (more if you have meter) + KD so it's nothing to be scoffed at. except by the super pros who don't fall for resets apparently lol. They may scoff all they like.

yeah the ground is a more comfy place to be. I'd say too that you have more options to be creative with on the ground but if you can do the air stuff it is much more definite damage, alas. You can't predict your way out of a k juggle like you can 2 3k resets.

THIS. All his resets are on the ground, but his damage is in the air. You really have no choice but to learn his volante/4D combos if you want to get the most damage. His resets are great and all, but when you hit confirm with his situational 3C, or get an unblockable hit confirm off 2D (which is easier than hitting with 3C) then not doing his volante/4D combo is just selling yourself short. It's 5.5k meterless and you gain 50 heat in the process for dat extra DD to make it 6.4k, lol, so if you do it at the start round you'll gain 50 heat anyway.

Even if you don't start combos off with 2D/3C, a simple j.2C allecan 5B 6C 6D j.C 2B 3C 2]D[ j.2C allecan (2D hits) j.2C allecan volante 5C (volante hits) 5C j.B j.C 8D j.2C 2]D[ j.C is like 4.5k then you tack on gear super or j.2C allegretto 8D fermatta and thats around 5.3-5.5k. On the ground you would have settle for 2-3k and attempt a reset which your opponent can guess right on.

It can be hard in the beginning to get his 4D/volante stuff down, but it's a must imo. As zong said you'll just have to grind it out in training.

[soujiro seta]

i find the toughest part to be the spacing... like the execution can be flawless but standing just a few pixels to close/far away and the combo drops at a numerous locations.

I have been playing around with the big one lately zoogstin... i seem to drop on the J.B/J.C, 4]D[ part too often...

OMG this has been the story of my CS play lately. Everytime I attempt the volante/4d online the 2nd hit of 4D always whiffs by like a few pixels, or after 5C sjc j.B dj.2C 8D allegretto....my opponent techs like a hair's width right above 8D.

[greystorm780]

Just to add a little to the learning Carl's more damaging loops. I just started playing Carl about a month and a half ago. There are so many different variations to the 2D loops that it seemed really overwhelming at first. So what I did was learn the simplest variation to the 2D loop and I left it alone for awhile and focused on learning resets and mixups. While in training mode resets n mixups were my main priority and towards the end of my sessions I would try some more advanced combos, but spend very little time on them. Low and behold, literally last weekend at the end of a training session I thought I would try out 5C, Volante, and something just clicked. I couldn't believe it and I ended up in training for about an hour longer, lol. I guess what I'm trying is if you really wanna learn his 2D loops and you don't have great execution like me. Learn the easiest 2D loop and then just let the other stuff come naturally. I think it was just a combination of patience while building up my execution with other Carl stuff. Most importantly, don't give up!

that sounds like a great idea! btw i never really learned his loops at all, i like resetting which actually seem to come very naturally for me. but when i try those loops its like i cant them haha. but i guess it comes down to practice makes perfect

[Zoogstin]

ioKain. I think thats how I started off as well. I first started out doing repetive 2D combos. And after a while I started to incorporate volante and then later 4D. The damage is so good!!!!

When it comes to the 4D part of his combos. I can get those pretty consistently (although I'm probably gonna develop premature arthritis because of it). Usually if I do mess up the 4D part of the combo, its because I try to do 4D too soon because I know how quickly you have to do it after the allecan.

COME ON CARL PLAYERS GET THOSE COMBOS!!!!

My next goal is to learn the timing of 2D in combos like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaQCUJRMYcg (1:10)

I can only get the 2D to hit sometimes.

[soujiro seta]

ioKain. I think thats how I started off as well. I first started out doing repetive 2D combos. And after a while I started to incorporate volante and then later 4D. The damage is so good!!!!

When it comes to the 4D part of his combos. I can get those pretty consistently (although I'm probably gonna develop premature arthritis because of it). Usually if I do mess up the 4D part of the combo, its because I try to do 4D too soon because I know how quickly you have to do it after the allecan.

COME ON CARL PLAYERS GET THOSE COMBOS!!!!

My next goal is to learn the timing of 2D in combos like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaQCUJRMYcg (1:10)

I can only get the 2D to hit sometimes.

I can help. Lets say you do the 4D vivace reset crossup. 4D vivace A vivace A 66 5C j.2B]D[ allegretto......So for that one in the vid: B+C fermatta 5C j.2B]D[ allegretto. That's how I do it .

[ZONG_one]

That's how I do it too.