Button Binding tourney legal?

[Keo-bas]

I'm interested in participating in some tournaments.But Ive been concern about the community perception on Button binding.

Lately I've been having this impression that Button binding is frowned upon.

I play on pads (traditional pads, not face six button ala sega aturn pads) and with certain games I find myself dependent on Button binding. I must admit as pad player that button control can be problem. Especially with two button combination with opposite side buttons. (three or more even less accurate)

I do understand that each event will have its own set of rules regards to this

Because Ive yet actually participate in events should I assume Button binding not acceptable? I'm using them currently in my casual but I prefer to make habit of playing on tournament regulation mandatory.

[SethDahlios]

I've never heard that button binding is frowned upon. Quick Sticking (using right thumbstick) is HEAVILY frowned upon though. there is a reason my friends call it noob sticking. I really only use it when fooling around with a character I don't know, or I'm stuck on a ps3 pad (gods be DAMNED I HATE THAT THING!)

[Circuitous]

You'll want to check with your local scene to make sure, but for the most part I think any binding that can be done in options is legal when you're on a pad. It's macros that are banned.

So a Roman/Rapid Cancel button is (usually) fine, for example.

I've actually never seen that sort of thing banned anywhere, come to think of it. Not in GG/BB anyway.

[Abominable K]

PPP/KKK macros are frowned upon in Street Fighter, but most of the Donjon Community doesn't really care.

[Circuitous]

On pads, really? I find that kind of surprising, actually.

[Keo-bas]

@SethDahlios- Well luckily I don't use right thump stick

Well if BB and Doujin scene are acceptable with it than All is well.

[DoomieJ]

They usually let you bind FRC/RC to a button since it is a bit harder to get off with a pad. Havent seen anyone bind anything else though.

[St1ckBuG]

Almost all tournaments will ban 1-button-specials but allow an RC/Barrier binding.

All majors are run this way atleast.

Also, I don't think beginner mode will effect this rule at all.

[Keo-bas]

I think their a few misconception I should address.

When I refer to button mapping I mean only buttons. I most likely confuse some of you guys saying button commands. I meant commands such as roman cancel,grabs, burst,ect. The whole button special or shortcuts is a different matter though i usually refer them as macros.

Sorry for the mix up.

[Abominable K]

On pads, really? I find that kind of surprising, actually.

Yeah, they're pretty strict about that sort of thing for whatever reason. SRK gets into flame wars about it every week lol. I guess it's a matter of that scene being based on arcade players, and GG's coming up from (mostly) console making our scene more lenient in that regard.

[4r5]

Who still sometimes gets accidental EX's or supers when they try to do ultra? I saw it happen to someone on the EVO stream. For as little as it happens, it happens. PPP/KKK macros remove any possibility of that error. That's why people don't really like the idea. But hey, atleast they'll let you now.

[FunkyP]

Who still sometimes gets accidental EX's or supers when they try to do ultra? I saw it happen to someone on the EVO stream. For as little as it happens, it happens. PPP/KKK macros remove any possibility of that error. That's why people don't really like the idea. But hey, atleast they'll let you now.

Actually that happens a lot, very very common. The actual reason is due to the game's recognition of command inputs rather that actually buttons. A big problem in vanilla 4 was Bison's ultra would always come out as teleport, and various other screw ups as such.

[4r5]

Not even talking about people doing the motion wrong. Just plain hitting three buttons at the same time.

[SethDahlios]

Actually that happens a lot, very very common. The actual reason is due to the game's recognition of command inputs rather that actually buttons. A big problem in vanilla 4 was Bison's ultra would always come out as teleport, and various other screw ups as such.

How many Abel players wanted to bash their skull in when soulless came out as air grab?

EDIT: 4R5 that's what we're talking about, you could do the motion properly and have something else come out entirely. I hate the fact that I cannot for the life of me get Juri's ultra to come out reliably, I end up getting the EX fireball instead more often than not. Similar motion, just one more QCF, and usually its not user error its the game reading it as something else entirely.

[4r5]

If you're getting something else, then I think it's quite apparent that you are not doing the motion properly. Whether it was a good idea to change the way Street Fighter reads inputs is another matter entirely. The game reads inputs the same way every single time. If you aren't getting the move you want, it is always user error.

Anyways, to get back to whatever topic is left... People like to pretend execution ain't real. As if at some point it disappears all together. If it does, I haven't seen it. Specials moves will always take time to perform, there will always be room for error when pushing multiple buttons, and links will always have some amount of executional risk. And this is where a lot of the old SF players are coming from. Back when the game was a machine with one joystick and six buttons for each player. That was the game as intended, with whatever execution hurdles came with it. This is why a lot of old SF players oppose the button macros. But now that EVO has gone ahead and allowed all in-game macros, it has effectively made it the standard. So now while you're holding down your one trigger button, to charge up your Turn Around Punch, all they can do is call you a scrub.

So.. I think if BB tournaments allow button macros, they should also allow move shortcuts. Why be half assed? Where is you all's conviction?

[qwerty]

frc macros are cheating, but you know they lag anyways so who cares

macros in bb? the game practically macros itself for you, lol

[ZONG_one]

Qwerty, that statement makes no sense.

[Circuitous]

If you mean the first part, there's apparently a couple of frame's worth of lag in the PKS macro for GG.

And for BB, well, qwerty doesn't like BB.

[Jason D.]

Well, regarding most fighting games, some types of moves certainly will take priority over others if a similar input is performed. For instance, let's say you're Ryu, and the opponent whiffs something in front of you. You're a little too far away to punish, so you want to walk forward a short step, and then do a crouching forward kick into a fireball. DON'T. You will cancel into an uppercut instead, and open yourself up to punishment. 6236 Punch will always be an uppercut, even though that's clearly a fireball motion, properly done, right there. As far as overlapping inputs, the general rule is that qcf < dp < double qcf. And by the same logic though, EX fireball instead of Ultra really is a user error.

But regardless of the SF community's arguments on the issue (and I think both have very valid points), I've also never seen any GG or BB tournament have a problem with binding multiple keys to something. Mostly because it's just for the sake of making RCs possible on a pad. And if you are able to enter a tournament and not get worked over, I don't think any non-whining-loser doubts your capability to slam your hand down on three buttons. Hell, if you have it on the left shoulder it's actually harder to do on pad than on a stick anyway.

Anyway, and to the OP's desire to start joining tourneys, you might want to just start learning stick. I know, I know, no one ever wants to hear that. But it will make it easier to do this stuff that you need to hot-key, and at some tournaments, especially ones with arcade setups, you won't have any option to use a pad in the first place.

[qwerty]

Qwerty, that statement makes no sense.

well i mean there's only four buttons in bb, rarely do you ever have to press three at once (and when you do, it's not like you're frc'ing or anything) and the game literally autofires held inputs for five frames anyways.

so uh letting people macro in bb seems a bit dumb

[Dacidbro]

It's not dumb if the poor soul is playing pad, where his thumb has to clumsily mash over 3 buttons while praying not to hit the fourth and burst or get an improper move

[SethDahlios]

So.. I think if BB tournaments allow button macros, they should also allow move shortcuts. Why be half assed? Where is you all's conviction?

There is a difference between mapping AB or ABC to a single button for pad players, and mapping moves.

A huge difference. One requires that you still input proper directional inputs, the other requires that you hit a direction on the right thumb stick roughly when you need the move. One is merely allowing someone working a pad to be on roughly the same ground as someone on a stick. The other is allowing someone to preform moves they might not be able to preform normally, stick OR pad, without requiring any effort on their part.

You can argue allowing one button to push multiple buttons is the same thing as macroing moves, but I don't think even you are willing to make that argument.

[4r5]

I thought I just did?

[SethDahlios]

I thought I just did?

And just how is binding A+B the same as binding 236236D?

[qwerty]

It's not dumb if the poor soul is playing pad, where his thumb has to clumsily mash over 3 buttons while praying not to hit the fourth and burst or get an improper move

eh, i played gg on pad for over a year and i was able to do frc's and the like pretty consistently, and i never used a macro. i think people make far too much of a fuss over it, honestly.

and on principle, there really is no difference between macroing button inputs and directional ones; either way, you're letting the game do inputs for you.