What makes Tager "fair" ?

[Cooldudenotu]

I think he is upset because you clearly know jack shit about the game. Look at Tager's spot on the tier list, look at high level matches, read Tager's matchup threads. All the signs point to one truth: Tager sucks balls!

Even worse, you admit it is your third day. You constantly argue back like you know more about the game than the veterans on this site.

You came off as ignorant and arrogant. That is why people are getting mad at you.

Hostility for no reason. It's clearly agreed that tager wrecks new players with ease. You yourself say I don't know anything about the game so wouldn't you expect tager to wreck me? But then you reply by saying that "tager sucks balls!".

This type of arguing I'm doing (with you for example) has nothing to do with knowledge of the game, it's pure common sense. Waaay to defensive.

[Isorropia]

lol @ those saying I'm arrogant and arguing with vets. The only things I argued were things I knew from years of experience in fighting games. I've never played GG and this is my first BB game - big change of pace for me over here but it doesn't mean that I don't know anything about fighting games. I had never encountered ANYTHING like tager before. How can I be arrogant when I openly admit I know next to nothing about this game / character and ask for information? shm xD.

To be fair, you could have made a topic titled "Help against tager" and asked for some assistance in dealing with tager. Instead of that you titled a topic "what makes tager 'fair' " and continued to assert and insinuate that he was a cheap character. This is why people have perceived you to be arrogant. There are multiple ways to ask for information and I hope you realise the flaws with how you chose to go about it.

[Phoeniks]

that is the joke you...where is my cane I am gonna rock you!

Lol, well now I feel silly.

Glad we could help Cooldude. The two most important things I can imagine doing to improve yourself are frequenting the Litchi topics, especially the Litchi vs. Tager matchup thread, and watching how professionals play Litchi and Tager, especially if you can find a match with both of them. I believe there's one of MikeZ fighting a Litchi and if I'm remembering names correctly, Bleed and ObiWanBaloney are two popular Litchi players (sorry if anything here is inaccurate, I know like two CT Litchi combos and that's the extent of my Litchi experience). Good luck and feel free to ask questions.

[Phoeniks]

To be fair, you could have made a topic titled "Help against tager" and asked for some assistance in dealing with tager. Instead of that you titled a topic "what makes tager 'fair' " and continued to assert and insinuate that he was a cheap character. This is why people have perceived you to be arrogant. There are multiple ways to ask for information and I hope you realise the flaws with how you chose to go about it.

This has some validity but if people were more willingly constructive and less prone to "anti-casual" behavior (including yourself) there would have been no "arguing."

A correct response would have something along the lines of "In the future please direct such queries to the Beginner Section, but here is my constructive advice."

Not, "OMFG what a stupid noob you are. You clearly have no life skills and don't you dare think something differently from me."

[A.X.I.S.]

see my gripe is not that he is a new player, its the fact that he made a thread saying things that makes the character instead of asking a direct question.

hell he could have went to his respective character forum or went to the tager forum's and asked for specifics, we are a community and we are willing to help if you want it, but the thread name...that shit just put a bad taste in my mouth.

seriously OP if you need to ask something about a match up go to your respected character forum and ask...there are gonna be people who wants to help, trust me.

[Phoeniks]

This is true, but at least he knows how to go about things now.

[Heavy_Mental]

To be fair, you could have made a topic titled "Help against tager" and asked for some assistance in dealing with tager. Instead of that you titled a topic "what makes tager 'fair' " and continued to assert and insinuate that he was a cheap character. This is why people have perceived you to be arrogant. There are multiple ways to ask for information and I hope you realise the flaws with how you chose to go about it.

Acting like a smug bastard doesn't help your case either. Admitting your ignorance doesn't make you any less arrogant if you still act like you know more about the game than you do.

To emphasize Isorropia's point, you should have gone directly to the Litchi matchup forums on advice against Tager instead of making a thread complaining about his "fairness". Making a thread complaining about Tager, the lowest tier character of CT and close-to-lowest in CS, and his supposed "overpoweredness" exposes how much of a scrub you are, because only scrubs complain about Tager being overpowered. As mentioned before, the only reason it appears like that is because Tager's strongest suit is punishing mistakes and sloppy, autopilot playing and scrubs are suspect to both. Mistakes you might get away with against other characters will get you raped against Tager.

My advice?

Stop sucking.

[Phoeniks]

I think we've all learned a lesson about hypocrisy today kids.

[Cooldudenotu]

The thread wasn't meant to be a match up tager vs litchi thread, it just so happened people posted and helped out and that's what it turned out to be.

My post was to really ask everyones opinion on tager being fair, as stated I never encountered a character like him in any fighting game before and was very puzzled by the tools he had, and I couldnt find his weaknesses.

Take my OP how you want to take it, I figured me saying "this is a serious QUESTION" two times would hint at the fact that I was asking a question, not being arrogant and stating facts. Adverse reactions don't bother me any, but it does make me weary of other new players joining the community because the type of thing can really scare away some people.

I'm not going to apologize for not going about this the "perfect way" because hey, things don't always go perfectly - that's life I don't feel I did anything to offend anyone.

EDIT:

To emphasize Isorropia's point, you should have gone directly to the Litchi matchup forums on advice against Tager instead of making a thread complaining about his "fairness". Making a thread complaining about Tager...

Did you even read my OP? Where I started and ended with please don't take this as complaining but as a serious question?

[Isorropia]

I think we've all learned a lesson about hypocrisy today kids.

I'll admit my first posts in this topic were more strongly worded than was wise, but I must wonder how it feels to look down on people for looking down on people. >.>

(light-hearted, not serious, btw)

[Phoeniks]

I actually wasn't referring to you at all in that post. :D

[Eshi]

new players need to spend more time reading character forums and match-up specific tactics and less time making whine threads. This is Dustloop, not gamefaqs. It would take you 10 minutes of reading to find out all of the many tools Litchi has to shut down Tager.

[Almadiel]

Well, if you wanted opinions, you certainly got what you asked for.

Your problem is that you are spurning help by blaming your problems on the character. When you assign blame don't be surprised when some of it comes back to you. If you want constructive discussions then try asking things like "how do I beat Tager". And simply claiming that you are not complaining does not make it so.

[Isorropia]

Did you even read my OP? Where I started and ended with please don't take this as complaining but as a serious question?

While you said that, whether or not you were complaining/questioning is more likely to be determined from the general tone of the post. I mean, if I took one of the angrier posts in this thread and added "not angry, super happy and I love you" at the end it wouldn't actually make the post any less of a rage post just for having a (potentially contradictory) disclaimer. >.>

[Heavy_Mental]

Did you even read my OP? Where I started and ended with please don't take this as complaining but as a serious question?

Don't insult me. I read your OP. Your prevailing tone was one of complaint, ignorance, and general condescension and smugness, even if you claim otherwise. Claiming that the sky is red won't make it not blue.

Why Phoeniks who seems otherwise sensible sides with you is beyond me. I don't feel the need to nurture your kind of mentality or behavior.

My main point (which you so carefully avoided addressing) still stands - only scrubs consider Tager overpowered because Tager is particularly effective at punishing scrubby play. You are clearly a scrub. Scrubs need to get to Training Mode, learn their combos, learn their fundamentals, read up on their character's guide, and actually gain some knowledge of the game and decent matchup experience before making threads debating the fairness of a character.

Don't expect to get taken seriously without having done all that. Expect to be ridiculed and demeaned if you do, as happened here.

[Cooldudenotu]

Don't insult me. I read your OP. Your prevailing tone was one of complaint, ignorance, and general condescension and smugness, even if you claim otherwise. Claiming that the sky is red won't make it not blue.

Why Phoeniks who seems otherwise sensible sides with you is beyond me. I don't feel the need to nurture your kind of mentality or behavior.

My main point (which you so carefully avoided addressing) still stands - only scrubs consider Tager overpowered because Tager is particularly effective at punishing scrubby play. You are clearly a scrub. Scrubs need to get to Training Mode, learn their combos, learn their fundamentals, read up on their character's guide, and actually gain some knowledge of the game and decent matchup experience before making threads debating the fairness of a character.

Don't expect to get taken seriously without having done all that. Expect to be ridiculed and demeaned if you do, as happened here.

How do you discern a tone on an online post? You read the words, I don't even understand how you get more information from a supposed "tone" then the actual words written down while reading.

lol @ your desire to tell me I'm new to the game (aka scrub) while I never claim otherwise. The rest of your points have already been made by others and already been addressed.

[Phoeniks]

I don't side with him as much as I support treating new players respectfully. This is not to say that he was entirely blameless, but everyone would have been much happier if his question had been answered and his mistakes politely addressed. Personally, I did not sense condescension or smugness as much as light confusion and frustration. Most of the replies to his query were vague or purposefully bitter, and in his desire to understand people misinterpreted his tone as condescending. Just be grateful he thanked the few of us that were helpful and that he now knows effective procedure.

[Cooldudenotu]

It would take you 10 minutes of reading to find out all of the many tools Litchi has to shut down Tager.

This is true, after reading up / doing everything I could to figure a way past Tager with Noel (I started with her not litchi) i had a strong dislike towards tager and when I started litchi went into the match up with the same mind set. There is some helpful stuff in the litchi forum for dealing with tager (not so much with noel) and if I had looked there first I wouldn't have had any trouble with him any longer.

Poor Noel though...

[mAc Chaos]

Hole -> stop digging

[Leaf]

tager is only cheap in america

[Heavy_Mental]

How do you discern a tone on an online post? You read the words, I don't even understand how you get more information from a supposed "tone" then the actual words written down while reading.

If you don't understand how to tell tone from words, you clearly still on grade school level with Reading Comprehension. Don't ask me to spell it out for you. You know what I'm talking about. If you don't though, you're even more thick than I originally suspected. If you're insistent on not letting this go, then you can go bother other members who share my stance. I'm sure they'll be glad to inform you on your complaining behavior.

lol @ your desire to tell me I'm new to the game (aka scrub) while I never claim otherwise. The rest of your points have already been made by others and already been addressed.

lol @ pulling the "I already admitted to my ignorance/scrubiness therefore I am exempt from any ridicule/criticism of my acting like one" card. I'm explaining to you why you're getting the shit and flak you're getting and telling what you should do about it. Leave it to you to try to find some fault with it. I realize I'm being very argumentative as well, but not for the sake of it in itself, but to drive home a point.

I'll repaste my main point of my last post in bold because it clearly needs reemphasizing. Put it on flash cards or write it on your wall if you must.

You are clearly a scrub. Scrubs need to get to Training Mode, learn their combos, learn their fundamentals, read up on their character's guide, and actually gain some knowledge of the game and decent matchup experience before making threads debating the fairness of a character.

Don't expect to get taken seriously without having done all that. Expect to be ridiculed and demeaned if you do, as happened here.

That'll be all from me. This thread was doomed to be a crapshoot from the start and I'm rather dissapointed in how far it got and how much of a part I played in helping it get there.

Only question that remains to be asked is when the clean up crew will get here.

EDIT: My post on the 8th fucking page, Jesus Christ. Hopefully the last. One last note to Phoeniks though, if you want to demonstrate high-level Tager play, you're sure not going to get it with American vids. Mike Z, despite how much acclaim he gets, is prone to sloppy playing and various mistakes.

In my opinion, only Galileo is demonstrating how devastating Tager can be at peak performance. He has tons of casual vids on GAMEacho. Look for the golden Tager.

[TheGreatReptar]

new players need to spend more time reading character forums and match-up specific tactics and less time making whine threads. This is Dustloop, not gamefaqs. It would take you 10 minutes of reading to find out all of the many tools Litchi has to shut down Tager.

Lol 6B

[The_Zawmbee]

Your welcome, but I must admit you did come off in the beginning as that you somewhat took what was said as direct flame, more than the possibility what you said was demanding the troll to come out of its cave, metaphorically speaking.Personally I believe you were right to ask us Vets what the deal with Tager was but i think you did it in the wrong order.

Also do you have a PS3 or seXbox360

[rei-Scarred]

Oh and by the way Bang does 500 more damage off 5A then Tager gets off his command grab. Guess which one is easier to hit people with :p

[A.X.I.S.]

In my opinion, only Galileo is demonstrating how devastating Tager can be at peak performance. He has tons of casual vids on GAMEacho. Look for the golden Tager.

don't look just at galileo, the people he faced are conditioned badly.

I won't deny galileo is good but he has some flaws that irks me, if you like I can pm you why I can tell you what I mean.