Guilty Gear 2: Overture released

[Xithmos]

I understand it's my fault for not sticking with what I said. However, there are other things that get in the way, such as school, outside work, applications, etc. I can't control when I get more work assigned and such. As I've said, Panda, I'll make the video for you tomorrow. Tobal, I'll work on character strategies for each character during winter break. I'll also throw in combo videos for each character so your friend has something to reference. My winter break starts in two weeks (12/21/09), so the very first video might be up the next day.

[Ayumu Gardevoir]

Pocket Scheduler Anyways, does that mean no night of Shenanigans? Dammit, I was actually free this weekend .-.

[Blackgenma]

Holy Sh*t guys, give Xithmos a break, is the Izuna combo video THAT important? And don't say anything about "it's the principle" because in the end, it's just a game.

Maybe it's just because I haven't played GG2 since kickingark got off, but I agree that Sol should at least have weak mobile, than none at all. Comparing Sol with mobile to Valantine with armor is ridiculous if you ask me. Valentine doesn't need armor, Sol does need mobile. I agree the game is relatively balanced, but sadly, only if you ignore Sol . Of course he does have the advantage at the start, but if you don't finish it relatively quickly after that it's got no where to go but down hill. Nothings better than waiting 30 minutes for 1 match to know that you've got a relatively bad chance of winning:vbang:.

two things.

first of all, PLEASE don't shove your nose rudely in something such as expressing disdain over someone breaking their word. in all honesty, it isn't any of your business and you have no right to judge, nor are you in any position to do so. it wasn't baseless slander, panda is not one to start crap, and I don't need to justify me being disappointed when something which was promised to me isn't delivered. it IS about principle. I'm not going to go to Texas hunting for xithmos' head for not not making a video, but I will be upset for being led on. if we openly express it, so what? your just making yourself look silly by intruding on something that doesn't have anything to do with you.

second point, though sol is in my opinion the worst character, there really isn't anything that he can't handle. I'm watching a CRAP LOAD of videos kimera cryin is putting up, and he plays Sol in the majority of them, and he does really well. one thing to notice is that sol DOES have answers to armors, himself, other armors (blade and Gigant), hunchback, queen, and if you want, even blockhead. it isn't easy to deal with them, but he has answers.

generally speaking, this game IS balanced enough for good players to have a chance with everyone. you may think that Sol has it rough, but look at paradigm when he fights sin at master fights. unbelievably terrible disadvantage. even good paradigm players get their ass kicked at master fights.

Sol is NOT a beginner friendly character, he is easy to play in master fights, but NOT in actual servant battles thanks to his retarded servants. you want to know something else? playing RTS in the organ with paradigm is also really easy, just like it's easy to beat shit up with Sol. do you think paradigm is a beginner friendly character? that's my point. I lose almost every match with paradigm when I play with him, he's hard as hell to play with, just like Sol.

oh, and lastly, Panda plays Sol, and he wins with him. a lot. HE KNOWS MORE THAN YOU. besides, Sol's elites are no joke, they excel at their intended purpose (yeah, even Gigant, he just isn't used to his fullest potential). so the match only going downhill for Sol later in the match is not really true. with dragon install, sol can actually change the tide of battle, you just need to be good and know what you're doing.

if you lose with Sol, its because YOU SUCK. get better with him or switch to Ky or something.

I only suggested the crappy mobiles because I myself suck.

I understand it's my fault for not sticking with what I said. However, there are other things that get in the way, such as school, outside work, applications, etc. I can't control when I get more work assigned and such.

As I've said, Panda, I'll make the video for you tomorrow.

Tobal, I'll work on character strategies for each character during winter break. I'll also throw in combo videos for each character so your friend has something to reference. My winter break starts in two weeks (12/21/09), so the very first video might be up the next day.

if you still care to make videos its cool. if you want to make some combo videos, make them.

[PandaKingEX]

I'm terribly sorry about that Panda. I've been busy with ACT prep and studying for finals. I won't be able to do it Saturday and Sunday since I gotta finish a project for Math. Plus, I wanted to get a 4 player game going in Borderlands so you could see the online portion of it, but no one else has it on my friends list. I'll make it for you tomorrow, since I'm totally free then.

EDIT: Plus, after a week I offered to make the video, my software for my capture card stopped working, so I couldn't have tried to make it anyway. Luckily I got it fixed last weekend.

I don't want this topic to get too out of hand, but Xithmos, not making the video isn't really the problem, at least not for me, but you could have at least said that you were busy with other things, or that your capture card wasn't working right. Keep people informed on the situation, even if it's not with a favorable answer. Also, the way I called you out was a bit childish, so I'm sorry about that. That's all I gotta say about that situation.

you make a good point regarding the units of Sol. I never thought how sol would be if he had if he had mobiles. but if they did give him mobiles, they could balance them by making those mobiles suck, like the rest of his units. hunchback is a mobile, and it's not fast, just rapes armors and magics. Valentine's mobile isn't fast either.

but don't mind me, just doing complaining. the game is relatively balance.

Sol having mobiles is an interesting subject, but I guess maybe they just wanted you to take better advantage of stuff like his gigant. All of Sol's current units have a pretty hard time being integrated into his game effectively as it is, so giving him another type to worry about, might just make things more confusing. Sol not having a mobile doesn't bother me much anyways, since that's less I have to think about when putting together my army.

[Blackgenma]

Sol having mobiles is an interesting subject, but I guess maybe they just wanted you to take better advantage of stuff like his gigant. All of Sol's current units have a pretty hard time being integrated into his game effectively as it is, so giving him another type to worry about, might just make things more confusing. Sol not having a mobile doesn't bother me much anyways, since that's less I have to think about when putting together my army.

yeah I know what you mean. it's hard getting good use out of pencil guy, blockhead and Gigant, though it can be done.

thanks to your advice, I like using queen now.

as you said earlier, I believe it is just to balance him out, and also to add variety to the roster. I keep thinking about sin and how strong of a character he is when I think of strong masters and strong servants, but Sin is less flexible than Sol is, so I can understand why they made sol the way he is. without tension, Sin is garbage, which doesn't apply to Sol.

I'm satisfied with him, his clunky ass army is somewhat endearing in their garbage quality, and makes me feel bad ass when I win.

I <3 Gigant.

[Sol.Badguy]

two things.

first of all, PLEASE don't shove your nose rudely in something such as expressing disdain over someone breaking their word. in all honesty, it isn't any of your business and you have no right to judge, nor are you in any position to do so. it wasn't baseless slander, panda is not one to start crap, and I don't need to justify me being disappointed when something which was promised to me isn't delivered. it IS about principle. I'm not going to go to Texas hunting for xithmos' head for not not making a video, but I will be upset for being led on. if we openly express it, so what? your just making yourself look silly by intruding on something that doesn't have anything to do with you. .

It's an open forum >.> I read this thread daily. And i'm not judging you or calling it "baseless slander" I'm just saying move on. I guess it is my fault for insulting your video game principles though, Oh noes, now i feel so silly .

second point, though sol is in my opinion the worst character, there really isn't anything that he can't handle. I'm watching a CRAP LOAD of videos kimera cryin is putting up, and he plays Sol in the majority of them, and he does really well. one thing to notice is that sol DOES have answers to armors, himself, other armors (blade and Gigant), hunchback, queen, and if you want, even blockhead. it isn't easy to deal with them, but he has answers.

generally speaking, this game IS balanced enough for good players to have a chance with everyone. you may think that Sol has it rough, but look at paradigm when he fights sin at master fights. unbelievably terrible disadvantage. even good paradigm players get their ass kicked at master fights.

Sol is NOT a beginner friendly character, he is easy to play in master fights, but NOT in actual servant battles thanks to his retarded servants. you want to know something else? playing RTS in the organ with paradigm is also really easy, just like it's easy to beat shit up with Sol. do you think paradigm is a beginner friendly character? that's my point. I lose almost every match with paradigm when I play with him, he's hard as hell to play with, just like Sol.

if you lose with Sol, its because YOU SUCK. get better with him or switch to Ky or something.

I only suggested the crappy mobiles because I myself suck.

Trust me I already know I suck >.> I don't invest nearly enough time to be good at this game, however If I saw a pro sol lose to kimera cryin's sin I don't think I'd say the Sol sucks, but hey, your words not mine.

oh, and lastly, Panda plays Sol, and he wins with him. a lot. HE KNOWS MORE THAN YOU. besides, Sol's elites are no joke, they excel at their intended purpose (yeah, even Gigant, he just isn't used to his fullest potential). so the match only going downhill for Sol later in the match is not really true. with dragon install, sol can actually change the tide of battle, you just need to be good and know what you're doing.

I wasn't trying to insult your God. I was simply stating my opinion. I sincerely apologize for you getting butthurt.

[Ayumu Gardevoir]

Panda = God? lolwut? I assure you, If I was able to beat him in a couple of games then he is not god.

[Blackgenma]

snip

the xithmos thing actually isn't heavy at all, you shoving your nose in is just annoying. random person shouting HEY GUYS STOP when the most you say is you can't count on someone for something was pretty fucking stupid. I hope this carries my message across better then the the word "silly". your "LOL video game principles" comment comes from a genuine lack of understanding of the term "principle". the particular comment about principle is the the reason I got pissed, and it was rather arrogant on your behalf.

the Sol rant was a rant, though I meant what I said. I don't know what your trying to say about expert Sol lose to Kimera Cryin's Sin comment. what are you trying to say there? my words? what? I can't even remember a match where Kimera plays Sin and fights a Sol.

the comment about panda was less along the lines of him being god and more along the lines of random guy making assertions who pissed me off and I just kind of rolled with it. I will avoid comments like that in the future, don't want a creepy reputation here.

you sound really cool trying to make fun of me by the way. clever. must hurl insults in arguments on the interwebs of coarse.

don't take what I say too seriously though, like you said, it's just a game. sorry for getting riled up like that.

[Blackgenma]

GG2 VIDOE THREAD IS BACK! combo video post is under construction, since I gotta add more to the nocturnal rights combo video inputs. will redo the inputs for Sin, and put up the inputs for Izuna, if I can. figuring out the inputs for these combos is actually a lot of work, considering how advanced the combos are. as far as the main post, I'm lacking 1 vs 1 material. I need to get my hands on some, but not right away. will save a copy of the thread in my computer, in case dustloop explodes again.

[Xithmos]

Panda, I don't know if you saw the video yet, but here it is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31xQ877sXEw

I've always wanted to make combo videos (nothing stylish) for each character. Might as well add in strategies and such.

If anyone's interested, the Blazblue Night of Shenanigans video is almost done (over 30 videos converted into .mwv ). Might be up either today, or Wednesday (since I have a half day that day).

[Blackgenma]

If you are going to put more down than just combos, I would suggest you write an outline for each video you will record. it will organize exactly what you want to display in your videos. I think it will give you better results than just winging it, but that's just how I would handle it. write here what you plan to showcase in these videos, and maybe we can give you some Ideas to add or refine the ones you already have. if they're good, I'll link them in my GG2 video thread.

[Xithmos]

This is what I have planned... Next Wednesday is my first day of finals, but I get off of school at like 12. So I'll make combos (from intermediate, to advanced, to item combos) for maybe 2 or 3 characters. Then finish the rest on Thursday and Friday. As for character strategies and tips, I won't start that until the Monday before Christmas. I'll have those videos outlined as... 1. Masters -What to do in master vs. master situations 2. Servants -Which servants are useful and when to use them 3. Personal skills -When to buy character specific skills and how they are useful 4. Offensive and defensive strategies -How to be offensive and defensive with said character 5. Extra -If I think of anything (instant kill combos, item tricks, etc), I'll put those here

[Blackgenma]

wow, that's bigger in scale than I imagined. I just wanted you to make videos based on master fights, and get all the ins and outs of that subject.

Item combos seems like a great Idea, I myself almost never use them, but I've seen how powerful they can be.

if there's anything I would put off, it might be the servant one. that sounds like a lot of work, seeing as there are so many servants and so many uses for them, it seems like it would require extensive research.

for example, the one unit for Sol I never use is blockhead, because I have no Idea HOW to make it useful, which is strange considering I know exactly what it does. other things include paradigm's rollers, I don't know if they are really needed, or his spirit seeker, just how effective is its long range capture cannon? how strong are the mini bowers it summons? when should I use Izuna's giant armor elite, valentine's elite range, and when should I summon a convict hammer over Sin's other two elites?

theres so much that can go in that subject I think you should narrow it down to a smaller scale. why not do something like the first elite in most situations you should summon for each character and why, or which elites make good body guards.

well, there are all kinds of ways you could tackle the subjects I suppose. do what you think is best.

EDIT:My GG2 video thread has been moved to the guilty pleasures section of the forums. look for it there.

[Sol.Badguy]

the xithmos thing actually isn't heavy at all, you shoving your nose in is just annoying. random person shouting HEY GUYS STOP when the most you say is you can't count on someone for something was pretty fucking stupid. I hope this carries my message across better then the the word "silly". your "LOL video game principles" comment comes from a genuine lack of understanding of the term "principle". the particular comment about principle is the the reason I got pissed, and it was rather arrogant on your behalf.

Once again all I was saying was drop it, and now it has been so I'm satisfied.

the Sol rant was a rant, though I meant what I said. I don't know what your trying to say about expert Sol lose to Kimera Cryin's Sin comment. what are you trying to say there? my words? what? I can't even remember a match where Kimera plays Sin and fights a Sol.

I was just trying to come up with the example of a pro sin vs a pro sol, sin has a much greater advantage, your words were that "If you lose it's cause you suck" which seems like a ludicrous thing to say considering you also said that sol is just as hard to play as paradigm, no offense, but I don't know anyone who agrees with that.

the comment about panda was less along the lines of him being god and more along the lines of random guy making assertions who pissed me off and I just kind of rolled with it. I will avoid comments like that in the future, don't want a creepy reputation here.

After all of your posts about him I guess I misunderstood:v:lol

you sound really cool trying to make fun of me by the way. clever. must hurl insults in arguments on the interwebs of coarse.

..?

Oh well I'm bored and done with this.

[Xithmos]

Blockhead is EXTREMELY useful in either a group, or with the master. It can heal the master and buff up other units. Personally I bring this unit out around the 3rd round, but only if there are a lot of armored units to get rid of. Using that plus Sol's item servant can take down armored units quickly. I don't think Sol needs a mobile unit since his armored units can handle their own against other armored units. I also don't think Valentine needs armored units since she can easily take out armored units with her magic units (and sometimes a giant mob of melee units). Oooh, I might use the last section for what to do in team battles. EDIT: In the servants section, I'll give tips as to how useful some servants are over others and when to use them.

[Blackgenma]

Once again all I was saying was drop it, and now it has been so I'm satisfied.

ok, sorry to get nasty on you like that, I can say that was uncalled for on my part.

I was just trying to come up with the example of a pro sin vs a pro sol, sin has a much greater advantage, your words were that "If you lose it's cause you suck" which seems like a ludicrous thing to say considering you also said that sol is just as hard to play as paradigm, no offense, but I don't know anyone who agrees with that.

bad example. I would have to watch the player's performance before making a judgement like that. but this may also be a case of you taking my words too literally. I've seen really good Sin players get crushed by Sol players, so it's not really an clear case of Sin >>>>>>>>Sol. when it comes to masters, I believe the relationship between the two characters usually fall along the lines of all or nothing, since both of them have high output when it comes to damage. Sol may lack range and a fast projectile, but he isn't reliant on tension like Sin is, and is like 100x better in your face than he is. he can also cheat sin out of his counter.

Sin doesn't have an overwhelming advantage to Sol, just an advantage to him. I'd say Paradigm is worse off.

and yeah no duh paradigm is harder than Sol. I said Sol is hard to play as, like paradigm. didn't say he was harder. I play paradigm, I would know that. I can only win in 2 vs 2 with paradigm, and that's if I'm lucky.

After all of your posts about him I guess I misunderstood:v:lol

understandable.

..?

your reply was ripe with mocking messages. I am sensitive, and may be took it harder than I should have. will toughen up then.

EDIT: On the discussion of character balance, people shouldn't use the character they're playing as an excuse as why they lost. when I said this game is relatively balanced, it really is. skill is primarily the deciding factor. there are some beastly Dr. Paradigm players, and although he's unwieldy he's very strong character wise. he's just got weaknesses because he's unbalanced in his strengths. I compare Sol and Paradigm because both are very unbalanced in their strengths (I also play both of them, so I know a lot about them.). Game play wise, they are polar opposites, it's up to the players to cover each characters weakness and take advantage of what they are good at.

so yeah, to rephrase what I said along those lines: If you lose, it's your own fault.

on a side note, I really need to get my hands on some 1 vs 1 match up data.

[Blackgenma]

Blockhead is EXTREMELY useful in either a group, or with the master. It can heal the master and buff up other units. Personally I bring this unit out around the 3rd round, but only if there are a lot of armored units to get rid of. Using that plus Sol's item servant can take down armored units quickly.

I don't think Sol needs a mobile unit since his armored units can handle their own against other armored units. I also don't think Valentine needs armored units since she can easily take out armored units with her magic units (and sometimes a giant mob of melee units).

Oooh, I might use the last section for what to do in team battles.

EDIT: In the servants section, I'll give tips as to how useful some servants are over others and when to use them.

hmm.

sounds good.

I especially like your advice for Blockhead. not sure if the unit fits my play style though. there's really such a toss up when deciding what elite Sol should bring out. I'm really liking queen though. if both you and queen happen to come across the enemy master together, she puts on a lot of pressure.

my fav is probably Engulfer and Fire wheel though. tag team body guards for the win.

on an unrelated note

th japanese GG2 wiki is still being updated to this day. they put up a page about master ghost assault and master ghost defense today. bananas.

EDIT: Just found out that all three of Sol's dragon install forms couldn't be dispelled. I thought only the 100 dragon install couldn't be dispelled. must correct FAQ.

aslo, 25 dragon install makes Sol attack faster, especially his power attack apparently (attack power 1.1). this benefit is not carried over to 50 dragon install (attack power 1.5, no other benefit). I can't believe I overlooked this skill so much.

[Sol.Badguy]

he can also cheat sin out of his counter.

? how so? i usually do the nooby thing and just burst so he can't stun me >.<

Sin doesn't have an overwhelming advantage to Sol, just an advantage to him. I'd say Paradigm is worse off.

and yeah no duh paradigm is harder than Sol. I said Sol is hard to play as, like paradigm. didn't say he was harder. I play paradigm, I would know that. I can only win in 2 vs 2 with paradigm, and that's if I'm lucky.

I don't think we'll ever agree, but that's ok.

Played with conte(top of leaderboard) this weekend he was actually quite fun to play with and it made me feel good to beat him master vs master even though I was Sol xD I didn't know he used raven though:vbang:.

Side note, does anyone else oddly enjoy being pushed back to your master ghost as sol? I don't think I could count how many matches I've won because of how good Sol is with servants and himself at a masterghost:yaaay:

[Blackgenma]

? how so? i usually do the nooby thing and just burst so he can't stun me >.<

I don't think we'll ever agree, but that's ok.

Played with conte(top of leaderboard) this weekend he was actually quite fun to play with and it made me feel good to beat him master vs master even though I was Sol xD I didn't know he used raven though:vbang:.

Side note, does anyone else oddly enjoy being pushed back to your master ghost as sol? I don't think I could count how many matches I've won because of how good Sol is with servants and himself at a masterghost:yaaay:

when you strike the counter with a a normal attack, do volcanic viper. he can't strike sol afterwards. the move eats an insane amount of tension for sin.

you'd agree with me if you got better with sol, uncerstood how Sin worked, or at least watched the matches I put up in my GG2 video thread. Sol plays differently than the rest of the cast, so he can't be used like sin. making comparison between the two sin't that clear cut.

being pushed back to your master ghost with Sol is scary, but if you have the right items, you can push anyone away, provided you have a good number of units by your side. bombs are your friends. managed to push a paradigm away once, he tried to high tail it, but goofed up and got seperated from his army. I killed him and won.

[Sol.Badguy]

when you strike the counter with a a normal attack, do volcanic viper. he can't strike sol afterwards. the move eats an insane amount of tension for sin.

you'd agree with me if you got better with sol, uncerstood how Sin worked, or at least watched the matches I put up in my GG2 video thread. Sol plays differently than the rest of the cast, so he can't be used like sin. making comparison between the two sin't that clear cut.

Sweeeet.

I know how sin works and a while ago I used to play this game all the time with only Sol obv, and after talking to friends like kickingark who've played like...over 1500 matches and agree with me I don't think I'll ever think differently. who knows. robo ky

[Blackgenma]

Sweeeet.

I know how sin works and a while ago I used to play this game all the time with only Sol obv, and after talking to friends like kickingark who've played like...over 1500 matches and agree with me I don't think I'll ever think differently. who knows. robo ky

no offense to kicking arc, but he ain't all that.

kicking arc has played more games than both me or Boundary (my friend who used to play Izuna) and yet we were both better than him.

playing lots of matches does not make you good.

[Ayumu Gardevoir]

1) Robo <3 2) Kickingarc is... weird... I'll say that 3) It doesn't matter how many you play, it's how much you learn.

[Blackgenma]

1) Robo <3

2) Kickingarc is... weird... I'll say that

3) It doesn't matter how many you play, it's how much you learn.

I lol'd

and yes to number 3.

[Xithmos]

1) Robo <3

2) Kickingarc is... weird... I'll say that

3) It doesn't matter how many you play, it's how much you learn.

He complains A LOT when you work your way around his units. I just couldn't stand it. Also, he thinks sending two units to his base is 'cheap shotting'. It's not my fault he doesn't protect his base. His friends think I play a 'noobish Sin' too. They always attempt to do the SAME COMBO every single time. It nets me a free counter every time. :P

/rant

EDIT: Never make a predictable burst agaist Sin. EVER. His most damaging combo works fom 8X > [L] 5Y > 8X > [L] 8Y. I think this does over 350 damage. And of course you can add any variation after 5Y or after the second 8X. After one of these variations, it can lead to an item combo (such as rapid fire + slow feet), so... don't ever burst.

[Blackgenma]

He complains A LOT when you work your way around his units. I just couldn't stand it. Also, he thinks sending two units to his base is 'cheap shotting'. It's not my fault he doesn't protect his base. His friends think I play a 'noobish Sin' too. They always attempt to do the SAME COMBO every single time. It nets me a free counter every time. :P

/rant

EDIT: Never make a predictable burst agaist Sin. EVER. His most damaging combo works fom 8X > [L] 5Y > 8X > [L] 8Y. I think this does over 350 damage. And of course you can add any variation after 5Y or after the second 8X. After one of these variations, it can lead to an item combo (such as rapid fire + slow feet), so... don't ever burst.

I burst against Sin all the time. it's easy because all of Sin's Combo's from beak driver require him to get close to you, and BAM, easy, safe burst. you just need timing and a close eye on what Sin is doing.

EDIT: I also almost do the same combo every time too, and it works for the most part.

(L) x, x, x, y, j, x, 2y, y.

yeah, I know and do other combos too, but that's like my bread and butter right there. IT NEVER FAILS.