Aginor Posted October 1, 2011 Posted October 1, 2011 CryingVoid: You're also missing a point from my post. fireball/srk is also a tactic. And you need basic play in order to even do well with Mu. Without it, you're done. I'm not saying you shouldn't aim higher but starting off that isn't the most important thing. That's just something you can practice on the side. If you face a strong opponent, without strong basics you won't get a chance to mash oki/setups. This situation has already happened to me. But what I'm getting at is, setups are meaningless if you don't even have a chance to land them. But yea, you're right that it is the first step to mastering Mu. Advanced character knowledge I'd agree with you on the setups but the advanced stuff for any character and any game you play still comes down to basics. It comes down to tactics, adapting on the go, noticing on your opponent's habits and capitalizing on them, decision-making, and overall anticipating what your opponent will do next. Even if what you said was true, I'll admit in that stream (I think that's H.H) he did make some bad decisions but overall I think he's great. There aren't even that many people on Dustloop that has the level of basics that he has if any. Which means, work on your basics. bakahyl: That's the right mindset. And it will take a long time to master basics. I mean just practice setups and gimmicks on the side because that could be really useful if your opponent doesn't know it and/or doesn't have that much Mu experience. That 2c thing might depend on when you hit the button. If you do it too late, you might get hit. I'd rather just bait it out.
Cryingvoid Posted October 1, 2011 Posted October 1, 2011 Yeah, I also think that Mu is great. And I agree with your point, setup knowledge must power the rock-solid basic play, this is what an advanced Mu should be like.
xntrikcat Posted October 3, 2011 Posted October 3, 2011 How do you guys practice basics? I've lately had this importance of basics revelations, but I'm not sure how to practice basics, aside from just playing more. When I play a match and feel that I played a "solid basics game," I was thinking more, adapting more, varying up attacks and approaches... Is this something that can be practiced in training mode?
Aginor Posted October 3, 2011 Posted October 3, 2011 You have to learn it on your own. It comes with time. You can't practice this in training mode. The only thing training mode will help with this is learning the spacing of your moves. Other than that, it's all in playing other people.
YukiBlue Posted October 3, 2011 Posted October 3, 2011 How do you guys practice basics? I've lately had this importance of basics revelations, but I'm not sure how to practice basics, aside from just playing more. When I play a match and feel that I played a "solid basics game," I was thinking more, adapting more, varying up attacks and approaches... Is this something that can be practiced in training mode?Everyone plays their MU differently. She doesn't adhere to a fixed playstyle, You should watch some Combo Videos, Learn her normals and then play how you like. However, Most people find that Keep away > Steins > Rushdown > Combo into Knockdown / Mixup > Repeat Is the best way to play here
Kayahtic Posted October 3, 2011 Posted October 3, 2011 Everyone plays their MU differently. She doesn't adhere to a fixed playstyle, You should watch some Combo Videos, Learn her normals and then play how you like. However, Most people find that Keep away > Steins > Rushdown > Combo into Knockdown / Mixup > Repeat Is the best way to play here I love this post Yuki. Very well said. <3
cookiehours Posted October 3, 2011 Posted October 3, 2011 Everyone plays their MU differently. She doesn't adhere to a fixed playstyle, You should watch some Combo Videos, Learn her normals and then play how you like. However, Most people find that Keep away > Steins > Rushdown > Combo into Knockdown / Mixup > Repeat Is the best way to play here Very true.
xntrikcat Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 Yuki tbh that's not the idea of basics I had. I was thinking more about spacing normals, working on tight footsies, and being able to take advantage of every stein to the max potential. I know a few good setups but when the opponent has patience and a good approach game you can't score hits on him without solid basics.
Cryingvoid Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 I've recently happened to practice "no risk" play. It seems that one Mu gets most of the pain because of risky decisions, so as I see basics for myself now, it is being able to maintain a solid n safe neutral game forcing yourself not to do risky stuff, even if you feel like it. Meaning, since I can do keep away/zone/rush strategy, I now am trying to master even a safer strategy, to oppose players with godlike defense.
SolarMisae Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 Yuki tbh that's not the idea of basics I had. I was thinking more about spacing normals, working on tight footsies, and being able to take advantage of every stein to the max potential. I know a few good setups but when the opponent has patience and a good approach game you can't score hits on him without solid basics. If thats what you meant, than you just answered your own question. You need to just play. This is something that applies to all characters not just Mu. Knowing the range of your normals and how you characters drive works comes from playing them frequently. It's not something that can be practiced in training mode really. You just get a feel for things eventually. This is a general question. For character specific, Yuki covered Mu basics...but otherwise it's just universal.
YukiBlue Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 Solar knows her shit. That sums up what I was going to write.
xntrikcat Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 Yeah, I guess just playing different opponents is the only way to improve. I've been working on mixing up approaches. Some rounds I'll zone all day and go in only when it's very safe, and other rounds I'll forego stein placements for simple rushdown, etc. When I get around to it I'll record some matches and post so you can all chew me out, lol
YukiBlue Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 Well. If it helps, The 3 Mu commandments. 1) Thou shalt not use 6C outside of a Combo unless your opponent whiffith a move with gargantuan recovery 2) Thou shalt sacrifice damage for Oki midscreen 3) Thou shalt 2C Anti Air the majority of jumpins
Kayahtic Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 Haha Yuki, be my private teacher! =P You know your shit too!
Cryingvoid Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 3) Thou shalt 2C Anti Air the majority of jumpins I shall disagree just a little. Or just complement the line, if you wish. 2C is strong when you use it to catch the edge of opponent's air attack hitbox. 2C is very vulnerable on whiff, you never want to whiff it. It is strong due to its hitbox, but the slow startup and long recovery make it very risky against air-smart characters, like Jin, Noel, Tao, Bang, Hazama and more. They can easily bait 2C whiff and get some meaty CH damage for free. If you take a look at JP Mu's footsies, you'll see them using 6A instead. It's hitbox may be narrow and less vertical, but 11f startup and fast recovery makes it much more convenient for a "reaction AA". It may be harder to get it in, since you must let the airborne opponent come closer to you, but the reward of 6A CH is almost the same with 2C, and the risk of the efficient 6A use is way lower. I'd personally recommend everyone not to get used to 2C too much, but get yourself used to 6A instead. "6A AA on reaction"-habit is a good thing.
C0R Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 2C is strong when you use it to catch the edge of opponent's air attack hitbox. 2C is very vulnerable on whiff, you never want to whiff it. It is strong due to its hitbox, but the slow startup and long recovery make it very risky against air-smart characters, like Jin, Noel, Tao, Bang, Hazama and more. They can easily bait 2C whiff and get some meaty CH damage for free. If you take a look at JP Mu's footsies, you'll see them using 6A instead. It's hitbox may be narrow and less vertical, but 11f startup and fast recovery makes it much more convenient for a "reaction AA". It's actually quite good in terms of recovery due to the range. Most characters cannot punish a whiffed 2c due to the inability to fall all the way down there then stick out a normal. The characters you've mentioned are character where you shouldn't be antiairing due to matchup specifics, regardless of the normal you use. Their character specific tools simply beat all antiair options for the most part. I happen to see quite a few of the better Mu players consistently poke with 2c antiair, it's just rather too good in this iteration of the game. However, I do agree that 6a is quite a bit better in terms of using the head invulnerability to beat out incoming air approaches. For reference the 6a combo and the 2c combo are identical in terms of damage and performance.
SolarMisae Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 2C and 6A are both good AAs. 2C is good for jump ins from further away, 6A is better for opponents who are closer when they jump in. Both have advantages and disadvantages, you have to use your own judgement which one is appropriate for any given situation. 6A isn't better than 2C, and 2C isn't better than 6A....it's situational....don't rely heavily on either one. Use em both when the situation calls for them.
Cryingvoid Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 C0R, I see Japanese doing successful 6A's on those said characters due to the very fact, that 6A's specifics allow you to let them get closer to the extend where no action of theirs will cancel their air approach or CH you. So it is not like they can't be AA'red at all. It is a matter of your reaction, and it is a nice way to develop your Mu. When I see some really fast and efficient stuff better Mu's perform, I really think I'm still a long long distance behind -__-"
C0R Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 C0R, I see Japanese doing successful 6A's on those said characters due to the very fact, that 6A's specifics allow you to let them get closer to the extend where no action of theirs will cancel their air approach or CH you. So it is not like they can't be AA'red at all. It is a matter of your reaction, and it is a nice way to develop your Mu. When I see some really fast and efficient stuff better Mu's perform, I really think I'm still a long long distance behind -__-" If Hazama or Jin is eating antiairs of any sort, they are not using their air-to-ground tools properly. I have a lot of experience in those matchups, and can honestly say that they have the perfect tools to bait and crush every antiair in the game.
Cryingvoid Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 There are times when they are sure, you'll be blocking or just won't reach them, so they act. These situations always occur. And that's where 6A's or dash > 6A's magic begins. You may call it their failure, bad judgment or whatever. I consider it more like a nice reaction and great 6A timing of a Mu player. It is not like I say fight these characters with anti airs It is just 6A that truly can work wonders sometimes, and many Mu players just abandon it.
pulsr Posted October 11, 2011 Posted October 11, 2011 I think the true power in 6A is that you can mash it if they double jump :P
C0R Posted October 11, 2011 Posted October 11, 2011 I think the true power in 6A is that you can mash it if they double jump :P This guy knows what's up. Pulsr when am I seeing you again. Evo was too brief. Far too brief.
YukiBlue Posted October 11, 2011 Posted October 11, 2011 I just mash 2C.. I sometimes get a counterhit. viva la scrub.
cookiehours Posted October 11, 2011 Posted October 11, 2011 I just mash 2C.. I sometimes get a counterhit. viva la scrub. -pats-
Lord Pwnge18 Posted October 14, 2011 Posted October 14, 2011 I rarely get a hit on 2C, so I barley use it. I actually don't use 6A that much either, but I'm learning. Also, can someone tell me if Mu's DP isn't complete ass? That's probably the one move I never use with her, and now that we're getting it in the air, I'm wondering how good it actually is.
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