[CS2] Tsubaki Yayoi Video Compilation v3 - We have hope guys lol

Kiba · June 20, 2011

LTG X PGC 2 Matches

Top 8

Kiba (Tsubaki/Valk) vs Hexanoid (NOEL)

Semi Finals

Kiba (Tsubaki) vs Kid-Kun (Ragna) - You need to watch this match VERY carefully...

Edited June 20, 2011 by Kiba

BatousaiJ · June 21, 2011

Some very uncharacteristic choke moments there for ya Kiba in that Ragna set.

Also, you really need to stop using 2D and losing untechable corner advantage by charging for too long >_<.

Lastly, I've found a lot of success timing neutral tech to invul through dead spike and then punishing scrubedge for being predictable.

Edited June 21, 2011 by BatousaiJ

Daedron · June 21, 2011

Not a match video but just something REALLY random:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrxIf1yT_ds

I was hoping I would never come back down xD

Errol · June 21, 2011

Kiba (Tsubaki) vs Kid-Kun (Ragna) - You need to watch this match VERY carefully...

The most notable thing I saw was Ragna jabbing in the middle of pressure a whole lot and I can't explain it. 2b>b doesn't have any gaps except to IB DP..

and really annoying commentary.

Was that it?

Kiba · June 21, 2011

Some very uncharacteristic choke moments there for ya Kiba in that Ragna set.

Hence da salt.

Also, you really need to stop using 2D and losing untechable corner advantage by charging for too long >_<.

It was actually deliberate, and although I have reasons for doing so you're right. I'm just very wary of DPs which is why I try to play super safe. I should try to make the most of corner advantage though, especially when Tsubaki has stock.

Lastly, I've found a lot of success timing neutral tech to invul through dead spike and then punishing scrubedge for being predictable.

I've actually recently started doing that. What do you punish with? I usually dash in and go for a 2a but if you have something better that's cool.

Not a match video but just something REALLY random:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrxIf1yT_ds

I was hoping I would never come back down xD

-Trying to think of stuff we can do with that - Nice.

The most notable thing I saw was Ragna jabbing in the middle of pressure a whole lot and I can't explain it. 2b>b doesn't have any gaps except to IB DP..

Exactly this, which is why I couldn't rely on my normal pressure. It made me near heavily reliant on 236C/D, and even that didn't help me much. If I did 2BB he WOULD have used ID. Even though Ragna only gets 1.3k from it, it's not the damage I'm worried about. It's being put back to square one, blocking all over again. Despite this even when I used 2B and stopped he'd use 2a which then resorts to me blocking again. Maybe I should try something like 2B - 22C/623D - followup :/

He was getting CH 5B because I tried to use 5B as well but as we know Rag's 5B beats Tsubaki's.

We play each other too often...

and really annoying commentary.

What was annoying about it?

BatousaiJ · June 21, 2011

It was actually deliberate, and although I have reasons for doing so you're right. I'm just very wary of DPs which is why I try to play super safe. I should try to make the most of corner advantage though, especially when Tsubaki has stock.

I've actually recently started doing that. What do you punish with? I usually dash in and go for a 2a but if you have something better that's cool.

You can't let em shut down your blockstring and pressure options and let them get free resets when they've got their back to their corner though, make them guess and if they guess wrong and you bait the DP, you can get a juicy CH combo in the corner which leads to big damage. When you've got them in the corner, you can't back off. You have to play the risk vs reward scenario and the reward is much greater than the risk basically everytime you're not going to die from one ID.

5B or dash 2A is generally what I go with. They both work given your timing is right but often times they'll be too far and that second hit of 5BB will miss leading to a derp moment so I think I like quick dash 2A a more. Even if they block, at the very least you can start a block string of your own and hopefully you have one charge in stock so you can 236D during the string to turn the corner against them in a instant.

Kiba · June 21, 2011

Yea you're absolutely right. Thanks I'll bear that in mind next time, and I'll see what I can do at this week's tournament!

Errol · June 21, 2011

Exactly this, which is why I couldn't rely on my normal pressure. It made me near heavily reliant on 236C/D, and even that didn't help me much. If I did 2BB he WOULD have used ID. Even though Ragna only gets 1.3k from it, it's not the damage I'm worried about. It's being put back to square one, blocking all over again. Despite this even when I used 2B and stopped he'd use 2a which then resorts to me blocking again. Maybe I should try something like 2B - 22C/623D - followup :/

He was getting CH 5B because I tried to use 5B as well but as we know Rag's 5B beats Tsubaki's.

We play each other too often...

I think this is the same as what BatousaiJ is saying re: 2d in the corner. If you did 2b>b every time, he'd IBDP it for the 1.2k and pressure reset. He wasn't dping at all there, he was 2a'ing almost every single time because he knew you almost never gatling'd out of it. Reaction doesn't come into this at all, the few times you did gatling to something, like 5c I think you got counterhits. Whenever someone gets jab happy on me, I do like to fish for 22b/22c counterhits. Then they'll have to start doing DPs, and then you can start baiting dps sometimes (infrequently).. but the payoff for him getting a dp vs you getting a combo from baiting the DP is way larger for you.

What was annoying about it?

Seemed like a lot of complaining about Ragna getting nerfed, and the part about Tsubaki always being good but just doing bad damage before. Tsubaki's A DP is totally legit. His info just seemed really off to me (the only guy I could hear, they had mic trouble).

Kiba · June 21, 2011

Reaction doesn't come into this at all, the few times you did gatling to something, like 5c I think you got counterhits. Whenever someone gets jab happy on me, I do like to fish for 22b/22c counterhits. Then they'll have to start doing DPs, and then you can start baiting dps sometimes (infrequently).. but the payoff for him getting a dp vs you getting a combo from baiting the DP is way larger for you.

Funnily enough I noticed the 5C CH. Another thing to bear in mind, thanks. You guys have really helped with the way I can/should adapt my game and I really appreciate it.

Seemed like a lot of complaining about Ragna getting nerfed, and the part about Tsubaki always being good but just doing bad damage before. Tsubaki's A DP is totally legit. His info just seemed really off to me (the only guy I could hear, they had mic trouble).

Ah understandable. I'll talk to others so we can try to make the commentary more appropriate and informative. Bear with me personally though please, because I can't commentate at all. I'm still trying to get better.

Airk · June 21, 2011

Have you considered delaying your 2B to mess up his IB timing? Or I guess you could just go 5BB>5CC, which should be airtight?

And, uh, I guess you could try RCing 2BB? Can you RC a move during its startup?

If yes, don't mind me, I'm just forcing my views on the community. :eng101:

Er, and alternatively, are there any strings he uses that you could do the same back to him?

Edited June 21, 2011 by Airk

Kiba · June 21, 2011

Have you considered delaying your 2B to mess up his IB timing? Or I guess you could just go 5BB>5CC, which should be airtight?

I've actually started doing that recently and I've been getting alot of CHs lol. I'll try 5B-5CC more though.

And, uh, I guess you could try RCing 2BB? Can you RC a move during its startup?

Yea I might actually have to start doing that to bait his DPs. Funnily enough I was thinking the same thing. I'm not entirely sure about the RC during it's startup though, sorry.

If yes, don't mind me, I'm just forcing my views on the community.

Every little helps You've also given me some thought on some strings. Thanks alot.

Er, and alternatively, are there any strings he uses that you could do the same back to him?

I block against him, but if he does anything into 2D I usually DP. Anything he uses after 5D may be a high (214B) and will most likely be unsafe so I DP that too. SOMETIMES I DP after he uses dead spike too.

Online matches with Daedron. Hope you don't mind dude.

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Tsubaki)

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Platinum) 1

Daedron (Tsubaki vs Kiba (Platinum) 2

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Valkenhayn) 1

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Valkenhayn) 2

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Valkenhayn) 3

STenSatsu · June 21, 2011

Just slowroll a 2b>5c gatling. I don't think there would be enough time to 2a out even with an IB. Might not even have to slowroll it. If you frame trap him a few times into CH 5c big damage he'll have to change it up. If he just blocks you keep pressure on.

Airk · June 22, 2011

Just slowroll a 2b>5c gatling. I don't think there would be enough time to 2a out even with an IB. Might not even have to slowroll it. If you frame trap him a few times into CH 5c big damage he'll have to change it up. If he just blocks you keep pressure on.

This might work against jabs - you're giving him 3 more frames to get his jab started. I'd avoid going too slow, truthfully. Full speed seems safest, because there will definitely be a gap. It'd be easy inferno divider territory though.

In terms of maintaining pressure, the 'Japanese mixup' of 2A/5A * X is still valid. Partly you probably need to respect the ID a little bit less though, because the reward he gets from that is smaller than from a jab, and, it's also a lot more risky.

MOSTLY though, it's probably what you already knew - that you play him a lot, so he knows what you normally do. So you'll just have to change up whatever that is. Sounds like you pretty much have it figured out already. Though while I'm making %^$% up, doing 5BB>6B would probably catch him offguard a bit too.

Daedron · June 22, 2011

Online matches with Daedron. Hope you don't mind dude.

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Tsubaki)

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Platinum) 1

Daedron (Tsubaki vs Kiba (Platinum) 2

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Valkenhayn) 1

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Valkenhayn) 2

Daedron (Tsubaki) vs Kiba (Valkenhayn) 3

I'm used to you kicking my ass so it's alright ;p

That reminds me, I still have like 7-8 matches I didn't upload yet, I'll get around to that this weekend (probably, I'm so lazy)

Airk · June 22, 2011

Only watched one of those vids so far (Valk #1) but dang, Daed. Very nice pressure and defense. Clearly a bit of weakenss in the hitconfirm area though. You landed a lot of pokes that you didn't manage to turn into anything. Still, I wish I was that good. :P

Edit: Oh, one other thing while I'm being "helpful" to people who are better than me: I see both of you (I think. I KNOW I saw Kiba do it.) doing DP-whiff combos with the A DP. Don't do this! C DP has more damage and significantly better proration, so you'll be doing more damage, and if things come down to the wire about whether your combo is going to hit or not, a C DP combo will be less likely to drop. The cancel window is basically the same, in that both moves can be cancelled as soon as they hit, and the startup is identical so... get in the habit of using the C DP for this!

Edited June 23, 2011 by Airk

Daedron · June 23, 2011

I know that I only use the C DP unless I make a mistake and do an A DP for some reason, I also use j.214C(whiff) now instead of j.214A(whiff) except in the corner. Doesn't seem to be any negatives about using j.214C and you're right in position for 2CC without needing to dash.

Kiba · June 23, 2011

Nah Airk I didn't use the 623A at all, well at least I don't think, since there is genuinely no good reason for me to use it over 623C.

Airk · June 24, 2011

I dunno; I sure feel like I saw lots of blue particle effects and no red ones in that Tsu vs Tsu match, but I guess that could be just the cancelling j.214a. Nevermind me, I guess.