Starlight777 Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 You've been a very naughty boy... YES!
Chazmobile Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 It's hard to believe you're my offspring.
Toasty Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 After testing the fuzzy/instant overhead combo, I confirmed that it does indeed work. Here it is: jC (as low to the ground as possible) -> 6D -> rising jA -> jB -> 5B -> combo of choice In order to make this work properly, you must land the jA before the 6D connects, so you must activate the 6D while you are in the jumping frames. Also you must hold the jA for just enough hits to make your momentum begin to start carrying you down so the 5B can connect after the jB. I would advise not using a very Ignis-demanding combo after the 5B, since you probably used Ignis before the setup in order to land the falling jC (unless the gauge was full or near-full beforehand, in which case you might try something larger). Using a followup of 3C -> 2D -> 6B -> sjB -> JC -> jB -> jC -> j236C -> j214B does around 2.5k with this setup, but uses a little over half of Ignis' gauge, assuming the bar was full before you used Ignis to set up the falling jC.
Toasty Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 Can you clarify? jA does not hit overhead. Well, it's not exactly an instant overhead per se (I should have used different wording the first time around, sorry about that), but it still acts as a fuzzy and the jB will hit overhead soon after (but still most likely in time to react to). It's a good way to extend pressure after a blocked 3C if you cover your jump with Ignis and allows you to go for more mixup afterwards. I will see if I can find a true instant overhead with a similar fuzzy setup as this one.
C0R Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) I'm pretty sure deep j.c > rising j.c is an instant fuzzy. After testing the fuzzy/instant overhead combo, I confirmed that it does indeed work. Here it is: jC (as low to the ground as possible) -> 6D -> rising jA -> jB -> 5B -> combo of choice Blocking 6d dispels the fuzzy property. As does blocking any of the multiple hits of j.a. Edited January 1, 2012 by C0R
Toasty Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 Blocking 6d dispels the fuzzy property. As does blocking any of the multiple hits of j.a. You sure? It was working fine for me. Either way, you're probably right about the rising jC, which would be better to use anyway.
St1ckBuG Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 This isn't a fuzzy. It's not an instant overhead either. It's not even a tight blockstring. A fuzzy is when you're blocking low, but instead of having your regular crouching hitbox you retain your standing hitbox from the deep jump-in so that you can be hit with a rising normal. The problem with your idea is that you can just crouch after the deep jC and the jA wiffs because your character is able to crouch and doesn't retain it's standing hitbox. There's a gap where you can crouch and jA's hitbox isn't big enough to hit a crouching opponent while rising (except for Tager, and you only get 1 hit of jA). Even after 3C the jA will wiff on crouchers. :/
Toasty Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 I tested it on a crouching opponent set to block everything, and the rising jA was hitting the hitbox of the opponent in a fuzzy (their animation was crouching, but the marker indicating where they hit was far above the crouching hitbox). Like you said earlier, regardless of it working or not, it isn't an instant overhead so it is not as effective as it could be. Also the falling jC -> rising jC fuzzy works, but won't lead to a combo without Rapid Canceling the second jC. When I tried it (meterless), both 6D and 2D did not allow for enough time for you to recover from the rising jC and continue the combo, and an air D move would not combo either.
C0R Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 I tested it on a crouching opponent set to block everything, and the rising jA was hitting the hitbox of the opponent in a fuzzy (their animation was crouching, but the marker indicating where they hit was far above the crouching hitbox). Like you said earlier, regardless of it working or not, it isn't an instant overhead so it is not as effective as it could be. Also the falling jC -> rising jC fuzzy works, but won't lead to a combo without Rapid Canceling the second jC. When I tried it (meterless), both 6D and 2D did not allow for enough time for you to recover from the rising jC and continue the combo, and an air D move would not combo either. Set up the... whatever it's called, I think it's 236d, the one where she reels you in, you should be able to combo off j.c using either that or 2d before j.c hits, so long as you start it up early.
huey253 Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 yo. I heard instant overheads and or fuzzies usually cost sort of resource.... i'm pretty sure that if you wanted anything reliable to come out of that sort of mixup with relius, one must spend the meter to get actual results.
Toasty Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 yo. I heard instant overheads and or fuzzies usually cost sort of resource.... i'm pretty sure that if you wanted anything reliable to come out of that sort of mixup with relius, one must spend the meter to get actual results. But you know it would be awesome if you didn't need heat. @C0R: I'll try it with 236D, thanks.
goldenxservbot Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 Im just curious since this is the Relius general thread, what are Relius's matchups against the top tier class in extend? Im talking about Valkenhayn, Mu, Taokaka, Ragna but more importantly against that damn Valk since hes S-tier? Ive seen some videos of Relius against valk but some have him winning (but its a bitch) and some losing
Starlight777 Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 So how difficult was it for everyone who has extend here to pick up and learn Relius? I want to pick him up and sub him, because it just occurred to me that I play no male characters in this game.
Kurushii Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 So how difficult was it for everyone who has extend here to pick up and learn Relius? I want to pick him up and sub him, because it just occurred to me that I play no male characters in this game. Being I use to main Plat, and I see you do I can tell you he's much harder to pick up than her. Combo wise I won't say he's too difficult even though some of his advance stuff does have some odd timings (but what character doesn't for their advance stuff). I say the biggest challenge he'll give people is managing his doll meter properly and attacking in correct sequence with Ignis. Besides all that he's a very fun character with a lot of options for someone to experiment with.
Starlight777 Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 Being I use to main Plat, and I see you do I can tell you he's much harder to pick up than her. Combo wise I won't say he's too difficult even though some of his advance stuff does have some odd timings (but what character doesn't for their advance stuff). I say the biggest challenge he'll give people is managing his doll meter properly and attacking in correct sequence with Ignis. Besides all that he's a very fun character with a lot of options for someone to experiment with. Can't be anywhere near as bad as the time I played CS1 Rachel lol. His combos don't look too difficult to do, and I kind of figured the challenge came from using Ignis correctly. I think I can make it work, he doesn't look anywhere near as beginner unfriendly as his son and Arakune.
Critical Edge Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 Relius's combo difficulty is definitely pretty normal. Big damage is pretty easy in the corner and his midscreen combos are simple. His more advanced combos deal more with using Ignis midscreen to get over 3k damage. There's also specific combos to save Ignis meter with rapids, j.C fuzzy rapid combos, 6B TK 236C combos... other than that, it's just proper spacing and using Ignis in the best way possible. Tori's told me that what you need to remember about playing Relius is 5B, Lanto(214A), and Anti-Air 2C. If you can read the opponent then taking a match is cake. Then there's proper combos and okizeme.
Guymam Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) On an unrelated note, we still need to find a forum tagline so we can be cool like all the other character subforums. Kiraboshi ~☆ As far as matchups go, it seems like he can have trouble with good zoning and runaway. His air normals don't really control any sort of horizontal range or above him. Doll meter manage can be an issue, especially if a character like Valk gets a life lead and runs away, since you'd have to spend some amount of doll meter to try and get in. Under pressure you'd have to have good defense, and only Kiraboshi (Led Ley) if you manage to read them really, really well. Most Relius' seem to use meter for CA and to RC and put Ignis away to recharge her meter. I've fought a couple fights against a decent Mu, and it seems that to win in a match like that you need to control momentum, or get a life lead and play really defensively. I imagine this'll hold true for most of the zoning and movement based characters (i.e. Tao, Valk, Hazama). All in all, it seems like you'd have to dominate the ground game, especially against those with great air normals (Jin, Hakumen, Mu etc.), keep momentum in your favor, and manage doll meter effectively and know when to play defensively to win. Honestly, it seems so far that foregoing j.B jc J.B j.C 236C 214B for j.B j.C 236C 214B 66 is useful for keeping momentum. I might be wrong though. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Edited January 2, 2012 by Guymam
Kurushii Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 Nah I agree with you. His air game is lacking compared to the rest of the cast but he makes up for it with a really strong ground game. I personally have a love with using 236236D even for some reversal situations cause of it's armor, full screen carry, and mixup options.
RinHara5aki Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I need help BADLY with Relius's neutral game. I mean, his combos are fun and easy enough to pick up in training mode, but the range of his normals, how he optimally uses ignis midscreen to get in, and correct movement is a awkward as hell to me :[ What do you do to get in? First of all, coming from a Tao players perspective my neutral game might be skewed, but i need to learn anyways. And also, I'm getting beat up by 0% and 3% win percent people with Relius. THATS how bad it is =w= Edited January 2, 2012 by RinHara5aki
Kurushii Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 214A is your main tool of life for stopping rushdown and for getting in. If the character isn't rushing down (playing defensive, or charging) then you can try 214B to give you a opening. Send Ignis in and followup behind. If they block Ignis, go for a mixup. If they get hit see if you can 2D Ignis while she is still near them to hold them still longer for you to get in to combo.
RinHara5aki Posted January 2, 2012 Posted January 2, 2012 I would love to know what your typical blockstring is. Because that's my problem. I've actually been using 214a and 214b (Even though i get CH'd out of it like every time lol) My blockstring is 5b 6d 66 5d 6d... into like a 6a or something. I can't see what kinda mixup you CAN do, maybe i haven't seen enough match videos, but I'm having a VERY hard time opening up players, especially because everyone just mashes 2a like a scrub and hits me out whenever i try to throw or overhead. I mean there's GOT to be some sort of CH frame trap that I can combo off of right?
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