yashanyu1 Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Greetings sir. Please leave your coat and fedora at the door, you will be seated shortly. Enjoy the trolls.
Dorro Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 ... Finally. Got dang finally. I now understand the delays needed for 5C -> 2C -> TK 214B loops. FINALLY. So ecstatic. And hello there new person. =D
Xx_Hoshi_xX Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 please! can someone explain the timing for hazama's j214b loop? i can't seem to get it... do I delay 2c, j214b? Do I not delay them at all and do it as fast as possible?
MetalMaelstrom Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 Patience is the key. Please read these posts: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?12859-Lane-Changin-Chain-Swangin-!-Lane-Changin-Chain-Swangin!-Fedora-Boyz&p=1239866&viewfull=1#post1239866 http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?12859-Lane-Changin-Chain-Swangin-!-Lane-Changin-Chain-Swangin!-Fedora-Boyz&p=1229084&viewfull=1#post1229084
Sadeyo Posted February 3, 2012 Posted February 3, 2012 I'm only getting two loops in the corner, I must be asking for too much for trying to get three in the corner. <---no Counter or FC I'm a little upset that I can't get corner version (facing from the wall) down. 5c Jayoku 214D~C 6c 66 5c 2c TK 214b 2c jc x3 2c jc x3 214b I don't think this is a valid combo until Extend, practiced it on Jin.
Zeron_X25 Posted February 3, 2012 Posted February 3, 2012 I'm only getting two loops in the corner, I must be asking for too much for trying to get three in the corner. <---no Counter or FC I'm a little upset that I can't get corner version (facing from the wall) down. 5c Jayoku 214D~C 6c 66 5c 2c TK 214b 2c jc x3 2c jc x3 214b I don't think this is a valid combo until Extend, practiced it on Jin. Did you like that tk loop I did on you?
Sadeyo Posted February 4, 2012 Posted February 4, 2012 Did you like that tk loop I did on you? 3 loops must have been hard on CSII because I don't recall making it pass two, I should've took note on the start up. I didn't burst just to see how much you could actually do, way to surprise the whole room. lol, Lambda's are boring to fight. THAT RUNNING BITCH!!!!
CaseOak Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Trying to get back into this game after a few weeks off is fkkn punishing. Previously, I'd been winning about half the time against level 50+ opponents; every match I played today was a wash-out. I feel a lot like giving it a break until Extend. Speaking of which, who's imported EX and played around with the new Haz? In broad strokes, how is he different? The impression I got was weaker combos but juicier specials: that's a trade-off I could live with.
MetalMaelstrom Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 In broad strokes, how is he different? His mobility is better despite his chains attack level being decreased. Some gatlings/cancels feel faster than they used to (specifically mid-air stuff like chain-in>j.B>j.C>land>whatever). Midscreen throws are also not garbage without meter this time around. Corner carry is a part of his game now more than ever. The impression I got was weaker combos. I do believe we have a madman in our midst. Please, read or re-read the combo section of the wiki or any of Sey's posts in this thread and perhaps that might remedy you of such insane talk.
ZeroRaider Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 The impression I got was weaker combos but juicier specials: that's a trade-off I could live with. The impression I got was weaker combos weaker combos weaker combos
CaseOak Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 *realises that a Wiki has appeared in his absence* I stand corrected then. It looks like we've been generously compensated for the 6C nerf. :D If Haz hasn't gotten weaker, why do you think he's slipped so many spaces on the tier list since CS2? Are there several characters as strong as CS2 Noel/Makoto?
MetalMaelstrom Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Which tier list are you referring to? That weird English-Russian one is based off jp bbs (iirc) and is inaccurate. In any case, it's probably because all of the characters that were not as good before got better (Rachel, Valk, Lambda, Bang, Ragna, Plat, Tager). And no, these characters are not CS2 Makoto/Noel stupid.
ZeroRaider Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Please don't bring up tiers. Mostly any lists I see are pretty wrong or just lightly bias. I'll just sit back, research, and wait for before even considering a list.
CaseOak Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 In any case, it looks Haz has quite a few new goodies in EX. Which combos should I work on in CS2 in preparation? And what are his biggest nerfs? I know about 6C proration and attack level (meaning projectile level?) on chains - what else should I worry about?
ZeroRaider Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Only things that actually annoyed me was the 420F heat cooldown for jayoku and 6B NOT breaking a guard primer.
_Sey Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 (edited) *realises that a Wiki has appeared in his absence* I stand corrected then. It looks like we've been generously compensated for the 6C nerf. :D If Haz hasn't gotten weaker, why do you think he's slipped so many spaces on the tier list since CS2? Are there several characters as strong as CS2 Noel/Makoto? He doesn't really feel any weaker, his max damage is SLIGHTLY lower mostly because you don't always get to finish your combos with Mizuchi now, but I'd say his average damage is alot higher now thanks to the throws buffs and being able to do 3~5 loop reps off anything in the corner. His worst nerf was definitely losing strike invicibility on his command grab; His new 2B is pretty godlike though. His corner oki off 3C 214D~ is also pretty tricky as you can either let the 214D charge and get a ~A/C/B(2) or ~D and mix up with his ~C chains/bait stuff/whatever. As for the 6B "nerf", well, at least we got 214D~A(2) breaking primers now Overall Hazama is still a pretty good character, if anything his worst nerfs may have been the changes to the BB's engine (losing 1 primer off a CA, barrier's increased push-back, etc). In any case, it looks Haz has quite a few new goodies in EX. Which combos should I work on in CS2 in preparation? Learn how to do his hiren loop, as that's what makes Hazama a very good character in CSEX. Yes, you can do it in CS2 as well. No, it's not any easier in CSEX~ Edited February 5, 2012 by _Sey
Guymam Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Learn how to do his hiren loop, as that's what makes Hazama a very good character in CSEX. Yes and no. Getting good damage and heat off his extended combos is part of what makes him good, but Japanese Hazamas win all the time without doing the loop. What really makes him scary is that he can hit buttons after chain pulls faster, making him harder to AA reliably. His new 2B is probably the strongest buff, going from -11 to -1, and recovering 9 frames faster (22 to 13). 2B oki after 214D~A is very scary, and his corner oki of 214D~B or 3C is also really strong. Command grab nerf sucks, but people still get hit by it so it's still really good. The system changes can also help him too, like 214D~B(2) being almost impossible for much of the cast to punish if they block it in the air. What will really kill the opponent most of the time is tricky chain movement, and being able to attack faster after pulls is really strong. Coupled with the fact that his extended combos do good damage and build good heat, this is what makes Hazama good.
_Sey Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 (edited) Ahh, yeah, you are definitely right, guess I worded that poorly. I guess a better way of saying what I meant would have been "Learn how to do his hiren loop, as that's what makes Hazama a very dominant character in CSEX." His dash 2B oki after 214D~A is indeed a lot scarier now. It only loses to backdashes and some backward rolls (and any DPs but Jin's dpC, since Hazama can just do dash 2B~[A]~4 to bait/cover that), which can be beaten with pretty much every other option. It also leaves Hazama at +1 when done meaty. In other news: Mitsurugi is 6th in the arcade PSR Rankings! Edited February 5, 2012 by _Sey
Sadeyo Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Here's a helpful hint for those who tend to ignore them. It's time that we practice our new mid-screen BNB- 214D~C 6c 66 2c jc (x4) 2c jc (x3) 214b Some exceptions to this combo is doing 5c instead of 2c before the jc just to make up for range or easier possibility (just loss of heat and damage with this choice). Another big hint is to do a normal jump tilting in the direction of your opponent before the first jc and then you can either super jump or normal jump for the last jc. This is also possible in the corner as another staple BNB. I'll most likely post the variations of the corner one tomorrow.
Fluck Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Just to make it clear, his damage HAS been nerfed from CS2. Midscreen Jayoku combos hurt significantly less.
Guymam Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 214D~C 6c 66 2c jc (x4) 2c jc (x3) 214b I don't get it.
MetalMaelstrom Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 It's time that we practice our new mid-screen BNB- 214D~C 6c 66 2c jc (x4) 2c jc (x3) 214b ...What? There are so many things wrong with this. First of all, please be consistent with letter capitalization. Second, when you say "jc" are you referring to a jump cancel or the attack "j.C"? I assume it's the latter, but still, the notation is a bit iffy. Also, who in their right mind only does j.C four times in the air as opposed to going for the regular five times? Or are you saying that we should attempt four reps of j.C x 5 in a row? In any case, I can't agree with any of this at all. Here's the real midscreen Zaneiga combo for those who were wondering (it's on the wiki): 214D~C > (dash) 6C > dash 5C > 2C > tk j.214B > dash 5C > j.C x 5 > 2C > tk j.214B > dash 5C > j.C x 5 > 5C > 214D~B > 3C It carries to the corner if you're in the exact middle of the screen. If you're closer to either corner, then either do one or two more TK loops after the second TK Hirentotsu if the corner is in front of you, or do 6D~A > 4D~A > 623D after 5C > 2C if the corner is behind you.
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