[P4A] Akihiko vs Elizabeth

[Skye]

TL;DR verdict: ??:??

Elizabeth's tools

Akihiko's answer to them

-----------------------

Akihiko's tools

Elizabeth's answer to them

[Verard]

This was mentioned elsewhere but you can 214C through Elizabeth's B normals. Weaving a 5B at the max distance will give you a clean Corkscrew punish(if you time it just right you can get a 6D before the screw, giving you a full combo), just make sure to wait until the cards are gone or you will eat a CH when they are traveling back to her.

[Mechmainiac]

I feel like when we have awakening our Maziodyne puts kinda of a lock on stupid persona usage I mean theres always C or D but thats nothing a quick jab couldn't fix

[Eshi]

This was mentioned elsewhere but you can 214C through Elizabeth's B normals. Weaving a 5B at the max distance will give you a clean Corkscrew punish(if you time it just right you can get a 6D before the screw, giving you a full combo), just make sure to wait until the cards are gone or you will eat a CH when they are traveling back to her.

C weaving only works on 5B, gets hit by 2B

also, for some reason weaving doesn't work on her magnetic blast, for some reason it doesn't count as a projectile? but 214A/B will parry it and duck > corkscrew will eat her.

[iw2ma]

The magnetic blast hits low and we can't weave low. Because it's so HUGE.

[kazukifafner]

Weave is a fine enough option at the edge of 5B's range, but it's typically best on approach just after her persona pressure, since she can just blow you up with her that instead of 5B otherwise.

As with Yukiko, the last place you want to be is just out of range to attack, as she can keep you pinned until she gets you in a combo (especially in the corner). A well-placed parry can break it up, as well as make it harder for them to pressure you as much in later exchanges.

Naturally, Liz is a major glass cannon. It only takes a two good BnBs and a super to finish her off (toss in another BnB w/ super if she enters Awakening). So it really doesn't take much to kill once you get going.

As for neutral, just watch her persona's animation for grab attempts (he hunches over) and punish her for it. Breaking her persona is as good as death for the character (even considering her B normals). Also, don't try and challenge her air-to-air. jB will always stuff your attempts, and at worst, you'll get thrown by her persona for your efforts. Ground-to-air or air-to-ground is where you want her most. Especially the former, since her persona isn't nearly as scary then. A solid 2B or a well-spaced jB can put you in prime position to wreck her.

[a Lisianthus]

mash 2a after she does 5c, if she cancels to 5d command grab 2a beats it, if she cancels to 2c counter it for meter or corkscrew

her 2b rapes everything, including j.C

[Eshi]

mash 2a after she does 5c, if she cancels to 5d command grab 2a beats it, if she cancels to 2c counter it for meter or corkscrew

Huh, this is a clever idea! I'm definitely gonna test that out when I get home!

[a Lisianthus]

its more of a gimmick more than anything to be honest, but it can sort of help if you're having trouble with full screen thanatos raping you - she can cancel 5c early to mess with your timing (1 hit 5c>2c or grab, etc) easily, and timing is sort of tight to be honest (though ex makes it easier - you get the EX meter back anyway if you see the 2c and use ex instead)

haven't really tested this much, but you can parry the fire pillars and the rest will whiff. at closeish range, a whiffed maziodyne (lazer) can be weaved

[Skye]

Never Weave vs Liz, in pressure she can DP you almost for free, and it doesn't low profile enough to be useful.

2a Thanatos like he owes you money, if you block 5c well enough, you can 2a before 2c comes out.

Watch out for jump back j.b.

Watch out for 2b.

Stay out of the Corner.

[a Lisianthus]

weave is great vs 5b tbh

can only mash out 2c vs 5c (1) on ib.. 5c (2) its gapless between blockstun and super armor frames if they dont mess up timing

[LoD776]

Hope they suck at playing as liz. If not prepared to take a maziodyne and MaAgidyne to the face.

[Eshi]

Hope they suck at playing as liz. If not prepared to take a maziodyne and MaAgidyne to the face.

Maziodyne isn't that threatening. If she does 236A then EX Kill Rush that bitch. In general she doesn't get much reward for just throwing any version of it out so just block.

Using any Maragidyne is actually a free punish for Akihiko, just do D duck > EX Corkscrew on reaction to get a free fatal counter every time. It's flat out impossible for her to land it, even with a well spaced knockdown.

Another thing to keep in mind, if this bitch ever corners you and you block a 2C, do not try to hit it. She'll just 5B you in the face and start corner pressure again. Priority 1 is to GTFO so you don't immediately die, so jump out or maybe e-action or even weave > corkscrew to predict the coming 5B. Other characters will hit the persona with something jump cancelable and immediately jump away, but akihiko doesn't actually have anything jump cancelable on block (which is what hitting a persona counts as).

Edited September 10, 2012 by Eshi

[LoD776]

Maziodyne isn't that threatening. If she does 236A then EX Kill Rush that bitch. In general she doesn't get much reward for just throwing any version of it out so just block.

Using any Magidyne is actually a free punish for Akihiko, just do D duck > EX Corkscrew on reaction to get a free fatal counter every time. It's almost impossible for her to land it without a really long knockdown.

Another thing to keep in mind, if this bitch ever corners you and you block a 2C, do not try to hit it. She'll just 5B you in the face and start corner pressure again. Priority 1 is to GTFO so you don't immediately die, so jump out or maybe e-action or even weave > corkscrew to predict the coming 5B. Other characters will hit the persona with something jump cancelable and immediately jump away, but akihiko doesn't actually have anything jump cancelable on block (which is what hitting a persona counts as).

I fought about 3 Elizabeths online, and all of them did that annoying chakram move that she does and then MaAgidynes me out of nowhere and then auto combos me to a corner and then a Maziodyne, it is more annoying than anything.

[Eshi]

well if you're just talking about her combos then that's just the way she works so nothing you can do. But in neutral or knockdown situations, Maragidynes are just a free EX corkscrew. Aki's one of the few characters that shuts it down completely (another is Naoto).

Edited September 10, 2012 by Eshi

[Robawtninja]

That's interesting. I didn't know hitting a persona counts as hitting someone on block. Well what I do is cancel the 2A hitting the persona into kill rush. It works until they catch on and start 5B'ing you. So if you were looking for normals to jump cancel from, his 5A and 2A are both jump cancelable on block.

[CrimsoHMD]

That's interesting. I didn't know hitting a persona counts as hitting someone on block. Well what I do is cancel the 2A hitting the persona into kill rush. It works until they catch on and start 5B'ing you. So if you were looking for normals to jump cancel from, his 5A and 2A are both jump cancelable on block.

Does this also help when it comes to her persona either grabbing you or using the force field thing, because I really need a good answer for that...

[Eshi]

Does this also help when it comes to her persona either grabbing you or using the force field thing, because I really need a good answer for that...

A huge portion of Elizabeth's damage comes from this basic mix-up but it's actually incredibly easy to beat with experience. One option is to react to Elizabeth's animation, her 2C (shout) and 5D (grab) make her do completely different things. Another option I see a lot of players do is up back after 5CC, if the persona is spaced too far away then 2C won't hit during jump start-up so it beats both of them plus 5CC staggers. It only loses to 214A since it's air unblockable, but then 5D/5CC stagger/214A all lose to mashing. Liz has to make really good reads once people know the match-up.

[Robawtninja]

Don't forget she could wait and do jD which comes out super fast.

[blackstar21595]

my advice for this matchup is

NEVER jump on her, her 2B is too good

if you wanna bait her DP and punish it well you can Weave D or EX Weave into AOA

Weave C-EX Corkscrew into J.B 5B loops on her

Closeout Blow Thanatos when appropriate

watch out for tech traps into her 5D

[Dacidbro]

Eshi, don't forget 2A and 5A are both jump cancellable on block.

Also, the option select 5A >5B > 44 during any place where Liz can use roll or DP is amazing. If she rolls or DPs, you get a backdash and fatal. If she doesn't, you continue pressure or confirm combo.

[tuka]

I think it was mentioned already but 5A > 214A option select against her usual 5C > 2C/6D is fucking hilarious and amazing

[Dr.Patient]

Eshi, don't forget 2A and 5A are both jump cancellable on block.

Also, the option select 5A >5B > 44 during any place where Liz can use roll or DP is amazing. If she rolls or DPs, you get a backdash and fatal. If she doesn't, you continue pressure or confirm combo.

You mind explaining that option select a little more in detail, I don't really understand when I should be doing it, on wakeup or what?

[Dacidbro]

You mind explaining that option select a little more in detail, I don't really understand when I should be doing it, on wakeup or what?

Ah, the freedom of it is you can press it literally any time you think she might DP or roll. Good examples are wakeup, after a high jump in, after a C duck, or after using 5A or 2C to reset your pressure; such as, 5A, d5A 5B 44, or 2C, d5A 5B 44.

It's very free-form.