Chrono Phantasma Speculations/Theories [rules updated 10/14]

[Master Of Chaos]

@Shinhwa: Honestly, I think that would be a terrible idea. It would lead to all sorts of stupid arguments, character and member bashing, and other general silliness. Trust me, these things get out of hand REAL fast.

@Toxin: Nothing of the sort has been confirmed (Concerning Saya's soul, anyway. We know Noel is MU). And I personally doubt it. It just...Doesn't make sense. Why would she? I think she inherited more of Saya's personality because she wasn't tempered until CS, and that got reversed.

[Shinhwa]

Just inheriting personality doesn't really make sense of how she called Ragna "Nii-sama" unconsciously if you ask me.

[LordSpectreX]

IRL talk here. Since memories are formed through repeated processes of data done in the brain, then cloning a brain's DNA (especially with the super advancing cloning in BlazBlue) would theoretically transfer many of core aspects of memory based in the brain. It would explain why they have familiar instincts like their affection towards Ragna and their ability to have human-societial functions without teaching (e.g. Language, the ability to walk etc.)

[Shinhwa]

Also we have to consider that Noel is in fact an "irregular" who did not actually exist before.

[Toxin45]

thought Nu or Lambda doesn't' seem to remember nor Inherit Saya's memories like Noel so it seems that Parts of Saya's soul did escape heck Nu or lambda barely know who ragna is.

[LordSpectreX]

Also we have to consider that Noel is in fact an "irregular" who did not actually exist before.

I thought that is was that she always existed, but always died in the research lab she was made in when it gets nuked by Takemikazuchi(sp).

[Toxin45]

so yeah the slide scaling of villain effectiveness has been wain a little because Terumi is dead and Relius is defeated with loss of their resources including the good guys running the NOL.Izanami since she's the real antagonist and terumi and Relius were disc one final bosses she can be more effective than the two combined plus she's a goddess and has Phantom the high provider of effectiveness but only time will tell.

plus since after the events of Cp the last would be having idealism being equal with the Cynic side of the scale and tone down the crap-sack world concept a bit.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Toxin45

[heavymetalmixer]

so yeah the slide scaling of villain effectiveness has been wain a little because Terumi is dead and Relius is defeated with loss of their resources including the good guys running the NOL.Izanami since she's the real antagonist and terumi and Relius were disc one final bosses she can be more effective than the two combined plus she's a goddess and has Phantom the high provider of effectiveness but only time will tell.

plus since after the events of Cp the last would be having idealism being equal with the Cynic side scale and town down the crap-sack world concept a bit.

Don't forget Beast Ragna :V

[Toxin45]

Don't forget Beast Ragna :V

Yeah and maybe the Black Beast will be seprate

also Izanami can summon demons and undeads so yeah she could be also a Hero Killer if she Kills Hakumen in Extend.

[Shinhwa]

thought Nu or Lambda doesn't' seem to remember nor Inherit Saya's memories like Noel so it seems that Parts of Saya's soul did escape heck Nu or lambda barely know who ragna is.

Nu had memories about Ragna but it was way too vague. Lambda I have no idea as her original soul was shown to be dead in the beginning of her story, so it was never revealed if she had remembered Ragna herself when she was still alive before she got killed by the mad scientists. Noel pretty much had the most memories about Ragna in the "beginning" and even about Jin and Celica, however those memories were erased and it became really vague, but still more than Nu kind of.

[Master Of Chaos]

Actually, now that I think about it, this ISN'T exclusive to Noel. In one of Nu's story paths in CT, she encounters Jin and her personality shifts and makes her seem EXACTLY like Saya's, even to the point of getting her voice in non-yandere mode. They actually have a conversation about Ragna where it seems like both of them are in the past, talking as if they are still at the orphanage. This continues until Nu suddenly turns back into her robot voice and calls herself Nu, which makes Jin realize that it isn't Saya and returns his mind to the present.

[Toxin45]

Agreed but still Saya really has some of her mind inside her possessed body. Maybe Saya was maid by relius for a body maid from Izanami's likeness similar to kazuma.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Toxin45

[Toxin45]

One thing to think about Izanami/Saya is that she sure is emotional for being "death". She seems to take insults very personally (like when Jin said she was of no worth since she is death), calling Noel garbage, and wants Ragna by her side.

It could be like Terumi said in the prologue, Izanami could be to much fused with Saya, thus being effected by Saya.

Given what happen to Izanami in the myth it's pretty not hard to imagine the things she is reminded

Also Es is hinted to be in the master unit so she should be freed

[Shinhwa]

Actually, now that I think about it, this ISN'T exclusive to Noel. In one of Nu's story paths in CT, she encounters Jin and her personality shifts and makes her seem EXACTLY like Saya's, even to the point of getting her voice in non-yandere mode. They actually have a conversation about Ragna where it seems like both of them are in the past, talking as if they are still at the orphanage. This continues until Nu suddenly turns back into her robot voice and calls herself Nu, which makes Jin realize that it isn't Saya and returns his mind to the present.

Except all of those were a dream :I

[Zedar90]

I have been trying to think what happened before the Appearing of the Black Beast in the year 2100 A.D. This could be a possibility.

I'm running on the assumption that the war in the Age of Origin (原初の時代) = The Priestess of Azure(蒼の巫女) invited the Black Beast in to the world.

During one of the times the Priestess of Azure talked with the Azure trough the gate she happened to invite the Black Beast into the world. The Black Beast went around on rampage and the Priestess of Azure used the knowledge gained from the Azure to create weapons(Murakumo, Kusanagi, Hihiirokane, Izayoi) to fight the Black Beast since the Black Beast is ”outside of the laws of the world”(世界の理の外) and normal weapons wouldn't work on it.

They were able to cut out a part of the black beast (which would be turned into the Grimoire of Origin) but couldn't kill it, so the Priestess of Azure lured it back into the gate and went into the boundary together with it and sealed it in the boundary.

The Amanohokosaka then swore to protect the land of Wadatsumi to prevent the resurrection of the Black Beast, but as years passed by Amanohokosaka would start to believe the stories of the Boundary and the Black Beast was nothing more then mere myths.

After some time the Magic Guild started their crusade to rid the world of all other supernatural abilities then their own and hit Amanohosaka hard making them in financial crisis and their reputation destroyed. At that time Takamagahara went in to buy the Wadatsumi from them and Amanohosaka agreed. Takamagahara began to dig in the mountain and first excavated the Susanoo Unit which they immediately hidden away. And after the further digging they found the Gate, and turned the Wadatsumi into the Wadatsumi Labrotory. Upon further investigating the Gate they found out about the boundary and started to start the Project Takamagahara and develop the T-system.

But in order to create the core of T-system, the Embryo, Takamagahara needed the Grimoire of Origin, so either Magic Guild gave it to them or they traded for it with the Susnaoo Unit.

Then the Wadatsumi Incident happened and Kagari Ryouko stopped the tempering mid way and someone took out the Code: Embryo and hand it over in Yuki's care. Unomaru survived and had his memory still even tough it is said that all the survivors of Wadatsumi lost their memories.

Takamagahara dissolved after the incident and Unomaru fooled Mitsurugi Agency to give him funding and continued to develop the T-System.

After the end of Xblaze, either Magic Guild moved the T-system from Wadatsumi or they in parallel developed one as well (Izanami went through the Gate in Ishana to enter the Takamagahara System in BBCP) and since the Embryo was gone they decided to use three A.I's as observers instead, but when it went active Amaterasu blocked them from doing anything.

Ayatsuki and Relius worked in Wadatsumi Labratory (now known as First Area, 第一区画) and Terumi appeared infront of them asking them to make Kusanagi and was ment to hand them Susanoo Unit as data but Susanoo Unit got picked up by Alucard.

[Toxin45]

I have been trying to think what happened before the Appearing of the Black Beast in the year 2100 A.D. This could be a possibility.

I'm running on the assumption that the war in the Age of Origin (原初の時代) = The Priestess of Azure(蒼の巫女) invited the Black Beast in to the world.

During one of the times the Priestess of Azure talked with the Azure trough the gate she happened to invite the Black Beast into the world. The Black Beast went around on rampage and the Priestess of Azure used the knowledge gained from the Azure to create weapons(Murakumo, Kusanagi, Hihiirokane, Izayoi) to fight the Black Beast since the Black Beast is ”outside of the laws of the world”(世界の理の外) and normal weapons wouldn't work on it.

They were able to cut out a part of the black beast (which would be turned into the Grimoire of Origin) but couldn't kill it, so the Priestess of Azure lured it back into the gate and went into the boundary together with it and sealed it in the boundary.

The Amanohokosaka then swore to protect the land of Wadatsumi to prevent the resurrection of the Black Beast, but as years passed by Amanohokosaka would start to believe the stories of the Boundary and the Black Beast was nothing more then mere myths.

After some time the Magic Guild started their crusade to rid the world of all other supernatural abilities then their own and hit Amanohosaka hard making them in financial crisis and their reputation destroyed. At that time Takamagahara went in to buy the Wadatsumi from them and Amanohosaka agreed. Takamagahara began to dig in the mountain and first excavated the Susanoo Unit which they immediately hidden away. And after the further digging they found the Gate, and turned the Wadatsumi into the Wadatsumi Labrotory. Upon further investigating the Gate they found out about the boundary and started to start the Project Takamagahara and develop the T-system.

But in order to create the core of T-system, the Embryo, Takamagahara needed the Grimoire of Origin, so either Magic Guild gave it to them or they traded for it with the Susnaoo Unit.

Then the Wadatsumi Incident happened and Kagari Ryouko stopped the tempering mid way and someone took out the Code: Embryo and hand it over in Yuki's care. Unomaru survived and had his memory still even tough it is said that all the survivors of Wadatsumi lost their memories.

Takamagahara dissolved after the incident and Unomaru fooled Mitsurugi Agency to give him funding and continued to develop the T-System.

After the end of Xblaze, either Magic Guild moved the T-system from Wadatsumi or they in parallel developed one as well (Izanami went through the Gate in Ishana to enter the Takamagahara System in BBCP) and since the Embryo was gone they decided to use three A.I's as observers instead, but when it went active Amaterasu blocked them from doing anything.

Ayatsuki and Relius worked in Wadatsumi Labratory (now known as First Area, 第一区画) and Terumi appeared infront of them asking them to make Kusanagi and was ment to hand them Susanoo Unit as data but Susanoo Unit got picked up by Alucard.

Perhaps Xblaze 2 would be a prequel to CT and maybe we can see Izanami as the main villain and Terumi would be there as well.

[Shinhwa]

Perhaps Xblaze 2 would be a prequel to CT and maybe we can see Izanami as the main villain and Terumi would be there as well.

Actually, I would say it is more of a prequel to Phase Shift series as XBlaze takes place like 50 years before Phase Shift.

[Toxin45]

Some people think that Murukmo units 11-13 have Saya's DNA and some who are obviously shippers that that only the bodies were inspired by Saya.

Also Noel and Nu both seem to have Saya's memories perhaps some of Saya's soul are within her or they have DNA.

Also your right about Phase Shift CT was pretty much a time loop unti Noel broken it.

Edited December 14, 2013 by Toxin45

[harmless kitten]

Except all of those were a dream :I

Does not negate the fact that she has at least a few more of Saya's memories beside that one image of Ragna.

Though it was definitely Saya's memory from the church. Jin says that Ragna must be sweeping the hills looking for her. Nu asks, looking for Nu? Jin reacts with confusion, saying, "that's not who Brother is looking for. Brother is... Brother is..." Cut to a flashback of Ragna killing one of Nu's previous bodies, then back to Jin who is totally crazy. Nu reacts with fear and feels "foreign emotions" taking over her. Jin screams at her not to take "his brother away from him." I think they were all jumbled memories from Saya.

[Shinhwa]

I am truly not sure if Nu has inherited parts of Saya's soul like Noel, but Nu definitely inherited some of her memories but it seems it was very vague. I can't tell as Nu really hasn't had much of a great plot in the entire Blazblue series about her own character that much except in CT and CS in only a few moments which showed what kind of person she truly is at heart. CP only had her as an enemy pretty much and her explaining about Noel's erased memories and past that she pretty much got a bad treatment this game plot and character development wise if compared to her stories in CT and CS (As Lambda except although it revealed that she is truly a good girl at heart, this development pretty much became nothing due to her turning back to her Yandere personality, although it is not explained why she reverted to her old personality, although it is speculated that her body and Hazama/Relius' adjustments are at fault).

There is the possibility that Nu represents Saya's dark side and Noel represents Saya's good side, but what doesn't make sense about this theory is that Nu is actually good herself soul-wise but that her programming and body adjustments, her Azure Grimoire included, are at fault for turning her into Yandere, but in the end this is speculation.

[Toxin45]

I am truly not sure if Nu has inherited parts of Saya's soul like Noel, but Nu definitely inherited some of her memories but it seems it was very vague. I can't tell as Nu really hasn't had much of a great plot in the entire Blazblue series about her own character that much except in CT and CS in only a few moments which showed what kind of person she truly is at heart. CP only had her as an enemy pretty much and her explaining about Noel's erased memories and past that she pretty much got a bad treatment this game plot and character development wise if compared to her stories in CT and CS (As Lambda except although it revealed that she is truly a good girl at heart, this development pretty much became nothing due to her turning back to her Yandere personality, although it is not explained why she reverted to her old personality, although it is speculated that her body and Hazama/Relius' adjustments are at fault).

There is the possibility that Nu represents Saya's dark side and Noel represents Saya's good side, but what doesn't make sense about this theory is that Nu is actually good herself soul-wise but that her programming and body adjustments, her Azure Grimoire included, are at fault for turning her into Yandere, but in the end this is speculation.

Well without her Grimore and Izanami driving her Crazy Nu is pretty much representing Saya's dark side and Noel pretty much is Saya's good side.While Saya's original body had Izanami inside her with Izanami in most of control and making Saya's soul neutral which allowed Izanami to be in control.Since Ragna,Jin,and Saya are found in a lab it's possible that Saya could be a vessel for Izanami like how Kazuma is for Terumi but they need to test it out on Ragna who had someone's soul inside of him alongside parts of the black beast.

Edited December 15, 2013 by Toxin45

[Shinhwa]

Well without her Grimore and Izanami driving her Crazy Nu is pretty much representing Saya's dark side and Noel pretty much is Saya's good side.While Saya's original body had Izanami inside her with Izanami in most of control and making Saya's soul neutral which allowed Izanami to be in control.Since Ragna,Jin,and Saya are found in a lab it's possible that Saya could be a vessel for Izanami like how Kazuma is for Terumi but they need to test it out on Ragna who had someone's soul inside of him alongside parts of the black beast.

I just said Nu can't really represent the dark side because she is actually good in heart but other influences are affecting her. This was proven when she was in Lambda's body. Also we can't really put either of them as Good or Evil because then Lambda's existence itself would become questionable. Ragna didn't have parts of Black Beast till Rachel gave him the Azure Grimoire.

[Toxin45]

I have a theory that Murakumo units have at least parts of Saya's soul as Relius created the bodies but not the soul which means they pretty much had a piece of Saya's soul.

[BlackYakuzu94]

I don't think saving Ragna suddenly makes Nu "good".

[Appledash-]

I don't think saving Ragna suddenly makes Nu "good".

What do you mean? Anyone who has that kinda dedication to their waifu can't be a bad person. Just look how cute she is.