[Xrd] Slayer Gameplay Discussion

[Uncivilized Elk]

Looking at Slayer Xrd footage and looking at myself play Slayer... I honestly don't see that much similarity. +R seems quite different, so I've been playing other characters in +R more even though Xrd Slayer is my primary interest at the moment.

[Ballermachine]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3we1H-q8ats#t=1568

 

The Potemkin here blitz-shielded a Helter Skelter but nothing happened. What happened here exactly? Was Slayer too high up to be hit by the blitz-shield hitbox?

[OneSanitarium]

The stomp may be considered a projectile where it hits I suppose.

[Yuhoke]

Slayer can straight up gatling his air normals now? Like j.P/j.K>j.S>j.HS>j.D. This isn't possible in +R right? (Except j.P>j.K)

[OneSanitarium]

Yes, he has air gatlings again similar to pre-AC Slayer.

[Yuhoke]

Does anyone know if DHD still has the separate tail hitbox that does more damage?  The 4gamer wiki states the following on DHD:

(take it away, Google!)
"It is to be noted that there are attack also determined to shock wave that occurred on the back side of the Slayer, given the large damage when it was applied at the same time as the rush part."

That sounds like it's still there? Has anyone ever seen it hit/happen in Xrd? Anyway, I hope it's still in, specially since I've been finding ways to combo into it in +R (and I hope there's some gimmicky way to combo into it in Xrd too!)

[Wirya]

Hello, guys. 

 

I've been wondering about something in this video....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t36juqY-6kU

At 06:11, Slayer (Hase) does Crosswise Heel to catch Ky mid-burst. Not a strange thing, I know, because we've been using Crosswise to bait burst since forever. But what Hase does right after that should make our jaws drop.... He directly links to 6H after the Crosswise. 

DIRECTLY. Without RC-ing the 2nd hit of Crosswise. 

This was possible back in #Reload (not anymore in Slash and AC, AFAIK), and it was known as Crosswise Heel Loop. So basically depending on your opponent's character, you could do {214P, K, 6H} x n. The thing is, the loop was REALLY HARD to do. Linking the 2nd hit of Crosswise Heel to 6H requires PERFECT timing. I myself NEVER saw it in any match videos back in #Reload days, only in some combo videos. 

So the question that's been bothering me is: Did Hase perform it because he's so freaking badass, or did something happen to Crosswise Heel in Xrd (probably it's air untechable time got lengthened)? 

[SuperJ]

DHD tail is still there.

 

2nd hit of xwise has slightly more untech. good thing the 1st hit doesn't launch grounded opponents anymore! serious

 

i anticipate optimal slayer play will incorporate xwise loops whenever possible. something like CH mappa -> 2D, RC, 214PK, 6H instead of 5K mappa, RC, 214KK, 5H. (i don't know if 2D RC xwise actually works but that would be p sweet)

 

 

the biggest buff to xrd slayer is probably BB input buffer lol.

[Wirya]

Thanks, SuperJ. 

 

 

2nd hit of xwise has slightly more untech

 

Yeaaah.   
 

the 1st hit doesn't launch grounded opponents anymore!

 

What...? I hope the 2nd hit launches, or else....   

 

 

i anticipate optimal slayer play will incorporate xwise loops whenever possible. something like CH mappa -> 2D, RC, 214PK, 6H instead of 5K mappa, RC, 214KK, 5H. (i don't know if 2D RC xwise actually works but that would be p sweet)

 

Yeah this would be sweeet.   

[Maho]

This was possible back in #Reload (not anymore in Slash and AC, AFAIK), and it was known as Crosswise Heel Loop. So basically depending on your opponent's character, you could do {214P, K, 6H} x n. The thing is, the loop was REALLY HARD to do. Linking the 2nd hit of Crosswise Heel to 6H requires PERFECT timing. I myself NEVER saw it in any match videos back in #Reload days, only in some combo videos. 

So the question that's been bothering me is: Did Hase perform it because he's so freaking badass, or did something happen to Crosswise Heel in Xrd (probably it's air untechable time got lengthened)? 

Back in #R, I did a combo movie almost entirely focused on Crosswize loop, to make it work the second hit of Crosswize had to hit in his very last active frames which required specific setups, but if it happened, linking 6HS after it wasn't really hard. Why we didn't see that much in actual matches was simply the fact that getting Crosswise to hit like that was extremely character and situation specific, and #R Slayer didn't need that to get damage so there was little interest trying to go for it.

 

Now in the video, Slayer hits Ky quite high in the air which was the situation where most of #R loops were possible, but the delay between the two hits isn't as abvious as it was in #R, so I'm not sure if it works like in #R or if it's just thanks to Crosswise having more untechable time, hopefully it's the latter so it's more viable than in #R.

[Wirya]

Well it's likely that Crosswise has more untechable time now, because if it's like in #R days, I'm not sure Hase would do the loop and take the risk of failing it in a real match (unless, like I said, he's that badass, lol). :D

[onemic]

So BDC's are still a thing in Xrd? I have #reload on steam so I'm using that to practice. can 5k still link into 2k and 5k on hit like it can in AC? I can't seem to get it to connect in #reload. Does that even connect in Xrd?

[OneSanitarium]

AC was a complete overhaul to Slayer. He had link's out the ass. Reload doesn't actually have that many links, and it seems Xrd has a similar amount.

 

The 4gamer wiki shows his gatling routes, and AFAIK his only links are:

 

f.S>c.S/5K/2K.

2K>c.S

 

It seems 5K>c.S works if they're crouching or on CH. May be forgetting a few.

 

And yeah, BDC works, just don't know how much invincibility is transferred.

[onemic]

Ah, do all his Xrd combos work in #reload or only some? What would be the most important specials that I should focus on getting BDC down with?

 

Also if Xrd Slayer is like #r slayer, why is he only seen as mid-tier? #r slayer was top tier wasnt he?

[OneSanitarium]

Doesn't have the consistent easy damage that #R had, his BDC isn't as invincible as it was before, only meterless combo from overhead is from Helter Skelter (25f), Bite needs meter to get a guaranteed combo from. PB has less range too. He can still do damage, and he still has things, he just seems under explored really. His PB has stun to it again, which is nice.

 

BDC anything if you want. BDC Bite is still decent as far as ignoring something and going for it. BDC IAD still has uses, BDC Mappa isn't terrible. Reversal BDC Jump FD is still going to be good for getting out of oki and stuff. Can't really tell you anything yet without having the game, outside of watch match videos and see where they do it.

 

I'm probably saying wrong things since I haven't looked at Slayer as closely as I've looked at I-no.

[BRD21]

What is some good neutral tools for slayer in XRD?

[bluzenblazen]

What is some good neutral tools for slayer in XRD?

5k is an amazing spacing tool. You can jump cancel it and airdash j.s to get into your opponents face. You can also buffer it into mappa and still be safe. If mappa hits, you can rc into stuff.

6hs will catch people low airdashing toward you as well as people trying to jump away. It leads to fat damage and has a massive hit box.

I use p d.step into slash quite a bit if my opponent is conservative with their buttons or likes to press quick normals when they feel uncomfortable. On counter you get decent combos especially with tension.

6p can beat a lot of good pokes with its invincibility, don't know mid screen combos though.

Pilebunker is a high risk, high reward neutral tool. It has its place.

[HoudiniJr100]

Pilebunker is also a good way to send an opponent out if it's on counterhit I think.

[Yuhoke]

I think P step and K step CH Pilebunker have different effects. P step PB wall sticks in the corner on Ch and K step PB sends them rolling on the ground on CH.

Correct me if I'm wrong though.

[SuperJ]

i think i wrote that a while back. whoopsies. yuhoke is correct

[Yuhoke]

Happy Xrd Day! Could someone post what Slayers challenge mode combos are like?

[bluzenblazen]

Happy Xrd Day! Could someone post what Slayers challenge mode combos are like?

I can tomorrow after work. If no one else has by then. Does anyone know if crosswise heel into 5hs works on Potemkin? I can't get him early enough to juggle. Have to use c.s. Maybe he is too heavy and falls faster?

[fogelstrom]

Happy Xrd Day! Could someone post what Slayers challenge mode combos are like?

Un-optimal but educational.

Mostly the hardest but not always the best. But they show what you can and can't do really well.

I'm sure someone will post doing all the combos on YouTube soon enough.

 

 

I can tomorrow after work. If no one else has by then. Does anyone know if crosswise heel into 5hs works on Potemkin? I can't get him early enough to juggle. Have to use c.s. Maybe he is too heavy and falls faster?

I really hope this isn't the case :/ Need to try it out. I like the 5HS, j.HS, j.2K combos. But only time will show if they're better than j.S stuffs.

[Wirya]

I think (5HS -> jump cancel, j.HS) was a tight link in #R or even impossible, since 5HS caused 18 untechable frames on aerial opponent, and j.HS had 13 (or 14?) startup frames, and his jump also had some startup frames, so.... 

In #R days people usually did (5HS -> jump cancel, j.K), anyway. 

[fogelstrom]

Just to get some things going... I haven't seen alot of people use 6P in the corner but I still think it's a good move so tried out some combos.

 

6P, c.S, j.S(2), j.H, j.D, j.2K, j.P, j.K, dj.K, j.D - 184 dmg
I'm gonna use this aerial combo to try out on more combos and characters to see if it holds up as a bnb. Works with;

 

5K, 236K, RRC, 214K~K, c.S, j.S(2), j.H, j.D, j.2K, j.P, j.K, dj.K, j.D - 147 dmg