[Xrd] Bedman Gameplay Discussion

[Lynxfort]

I'm puzzled..did DVB and DVC from behind the opp was pushing him toward  Bedman in the old ver ??

[sterkenburger]

- DV Task C new hit stop can allow for some pretty interesting new combo on hit, but will need to be precise as it cause hard knock down, you can do DV Task C 1st hit > c.S > 2nd hit > c.S > 5HS > etc.

 

- 6HS now spoon the opponent up in a weird way when u RC into it from 2nd Hit Task C, although the opp clearly touched the ground, follow up with Task C and the combo will count as legit, you can do it twice with 100 meter now , which wasn't possible before.

 

- Task A' now put us futher away when hitting opp from the front, roughly the same space as our dash does, thus reduce it reward, you can still do c.S > 5HS task B. Hitting from behind still put us right next to them

 

-5HS > 1HS > sj.SPS > Air Task C > 2HS work on Faust, Leo and Ky

 

The new float timing is kinda weird for me, caused me to do some weird air hang from time to time but i guess i would just need to adjust to it.

[WonderTonic]

I'm puzzled..did DVB and DVC from behind the opp was pushing him toward  Bedman in the old ver ??

In the old ver. the opponent was always pushed away from Bedman. regardless of seal position.

 

One real minor issue this causes is now if you do DV Task A' with the seal behind the opponent. When it connects Bedman goes behind the opponent, but the opponent is slightly pushed away.  This means 2K>5HS(2) is no longer possible after that

 

- Task A' now put us futher away when hitting opp from the front, roughly the same space as our dash does, thus reduce it reward, you can still do c.S > 5HS task B. Hitting from behind still put us right next to them

 

This seems unchanged to me.  Bedman always ended up farther away on a front hit Task A' compared to a rear hit.

[sterkenburger]

One real minor issue this causes is now if you do DV Task A' with the seal behind the opponent. When it connects Bedman goes behind the opponent, but the opponent is slightly pushed away.  This means 2K>5HS(2) is no longer possible after that

 

I manage to get 2 hit of 5HS off just fine, weird.

 

I get some really close front  A' before the patch, mainly cause i use it as a meaty a lot, allowing 2 hit of 5HS. Also previously you can do Task A' > DV A' YRC > 6H > A' hit > c.s > 5HS x 2 > 1H , it isn't the case now

 

Also the 5HS buffed hit box is really nice , the 2nd hit manage to land on opponent further away where it previously couldn't.

[Lynxfort]

"Throw invincibility added to the latter half of the move."
actually it's the opposite .. the first half is Throw invincible.

[WonderTonic]

Yea I noticed that. It helps when you do a meaty 6H starting right on top on the downed opponent since now 6H will hit far enough away from the opponent that they can't throw you anyway.

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[NecroTheReaper]

So, anyone got a more consistent combo for May (and probably El) than xx>5HS>1HS>sj.883P>236HS>2P>c.S>236HS? It works but the sj.883 is killing me

[kex]

Throw invincibility on first frames of 6HS... Thought they were afraid of creating such killing machine. Its both throw and hit invincible now. Its like DP with follow up.

Yes, 5hs hitbox is little larger, but there are some characters this change not affecting too much, like Millia, probably Ky.

With all this changes and weakenings of others we have new top tier.

[GcYoshi13]

Throw invincibility on first frames of 6HS... Thought they were afraid of creating such killing machine. Its both throw and hit invincible now. Its like DP with follow up.

Yes, 5hs hitbox is little larger, but there are some characters this change not affecting too much, like Millia, probably Ky.

With all this changes and weakenings of others we have new top tier.

 

Don't want to turn this into a tier discussion, but he feels the same albeit with much more reliable tools.

 

Of course once we optimize the really good combos that generate 2-3 seals with nasty set-ups, we have ourselves a nutty character. 

 

The large problem is that a lot of these combos are very character specific. We'll have to work together make a list sometime.

[NecroTheReaper]

From my testing, double seal corner combos are all universal. In fact, the tk task B is actually pretty lenient, doesnt even need to be a real tk. I've got most combos down, but May is gonna be the death of me

[GcYoshi13]

From my testing, double seal corner combos are all universal. In fact, the tk task B is actually pretty lenient, doesnt even need to be a real tk. I've got most combos down, but May is gonna be the death of me

 

My main issue with the TK Task B is the link afterwards. I can't seem to get non-otg 2P, or c.S. It has to do with how the opponent is juggled by Task B, but I don't know the trick so far.

[NecroTheReaper]

After testing it some more, I couldnt get it to work on I-no, Ram, or Zato. Chipp, Sol and Venom I had to do 2HS>7>j.P>6j.P>j.236S for 2 seals, everyone else seemed like my original one worked on

[NecroTheReaper]

Man. Even after all we got, getting dp'd, grabbed, or mashed put of A' oki is still a thing. Do I just need to start mashing 2P on task A' tele? Cuz I'm tired of people thinking IB>ID is a thing

[Tiamat]

what is ID?

[NecroTheReaper]

My bad, VV. Getting my Dps mixed up

[GcYoshi13]

Man. Even after all we got, getting dp'd, grabbed, or mashed put of A' oki is still a thing. Do I just need to start mashing 2P on task A' tele? Cuz I'm tired of people thinking IB>ID is a thing

 

I feel like Task A' on block/hit puts you in a situation where you generally win if they mash. I do 2K after my teleport usually.

 

You may need to adjust your timing.

[NecroTheReaper]

Well, its mostly cuz this guy got away with A' IB>VV. Yeah, I could've just blocked, but I just wanted to get him to know that wasnt a legit thing Dx still beat me several times, but whatever

[Tiamat]

I think I've tested it before and if you time your 2K correctly they can't VV it even on IB.  The problem is during match play you don't' always time it correctly, so they get away with it.

[NecroTheReaper]

Exactly. And I didnt time it right more than once. So it made me mad and I lost patience and ate more VVs. Aaaaanyway, I'm still not havin luck in air to air situations. I still feel like float is inferior to airdash when at neutral, cuz regardless of which button I push, even j.P seeems to get beat by other j.P's or j.K's

[SectumSsempra]

Exactly. And I didnt time it right more than once. So it made me mad and I lost patience and ate more VVs. Aaaaanyway, I'm still not havin luck in air to air situations. I still feel like float is inferior to airdash when at neutral, cuz regardless of which button I push, even j.P seeems to get beat by other j.P's or j.K's

There were just certain characters before who's air normals were flat out better air to air then all of our options so it's not too surprising. 

[Woolay]

Seems like the infinite/invisible/indestructible Deja Vu glitch that would happen when you super just as a symbol is disappearing is gone, but there's another way to cause this glitch that's still in the game (Or it might just be new?) that occurs if a Task A' hits (or is blocked/armored) just as you are replacing an old symbol with a new one.  For example, you have A' and C symbols out, do Deja Vu Task A' and time a Task C so that the Task A' hits just as the old Task C symbol disappears; the original Task C symbol is no longer visible on-screen, but is still usable infinitely until you make a new one and cannot be destroyed.  This can be done mid-combo in ways that don't drop the combo if timed wrong, but it's tricky to time and set up.

[Tiamat]

I played some matches.  You need to be really careful with Task B oki now because it is highly vulnerable to reversal Blitz shield which will stun you now.  Thankfully it's much easier to combo to Task C than it was before.  It makes me want to use Task B as combo ender a lot less.  The dash teleport change is pretty cool.  The increased distance helps keep them off your back.  

[NecroTheReaper]

Someone tell me some anti-El tech please? This MU is gonna make me kill myself. I dont even care if I'm not in the right thread right now.

[KDowah]

Anyone have some nice and easy tech traps? One fun one I discovered was grab>5K>f.S>j.S>j.236S>land>airgrab. I remember Tiamat talking about one using the usual throw combo, and I also experimented with OTG>air throw as well

 

5HS > 1HS > sj.SPS > 236HS (Task C) > 2HS > air grab works now. Oddly satistfying.

[SectumSsempra]

What do you guys do to characters to have options to stay entirely vertical over us if they get a knockdown?

Those are my personal absolute WORST matchups

 

For example

-may using both her dashes to stay out of range of our 6P, and being able to use her attack, that can lead to another knockdown combo

-Sol and his gorilla JC (if I'm not mistaken, its JC at least, funny enough, I have no trouble keeping him out, but if he gets a knockdown towards the corner it takes a bit of effort to get back out)

-Venom, using his balls to hold us in place then pretty much staying in that no 6p range

 

I know we don't have a solid answer for a lot of things, but I was curious as to how you guys deal with them.