Zeero Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 so 5b does less damage but prorates less, 2b does more damage but prorates more... j2c definitely does more damage tho, more damage and less prorate it seems. good stuff =) maybe i should buy one too... where'd you get it?
Kyle Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 You are confused about proratioin. Zeero. there are two values. regarding proration -initial ( only added when you you START a combo with this move) -Scaling ( added every time you use the move :unless it's the first hit of a combo) scaling wisse, those two are equal. I'm still updating that post with a few more moves for us to discuss. Found Carl he is on page 150 of the mook. answers coming. =P His letter are like (NIJIJ) Input-Cancel-Damage-Level-initial Proration-proration scaling-startup-active-recovery-frame advantage-counter-untech-guard level- GuardCrush- 5B------SjR- ----430----3-------90---------------- 89---------- 9------ 2------ 21-----------(-6)-------------------- 22------- 17- ----1200 2B------SR------390----3-------70---------------- 89----------- 9------ 4------ 13---------- (0)--------------------- (18)----- 17------ 1200 2.C-----SR------600----4------100---------------- 92---------- 14------ 3------ 24---------- (-8)-------------------- (22)------ 52----- 1600 J.2C-----SR-----700-----4------100---------------- 92---------- 9---- Until hit/land----something30 ---------------------------28-------1600 5C-----SjR- ----620----4-------100---------------- 92---------- 15------ 5------ 18-----------(-4)-------------------- 31------- 19- ----1600 J.C-----SR------660----3------90---------------- 89---------- 13------ 6------ 24---------- (--)-------------------- (27)------ 17----- 1200 6D-----(--)- ----960----4-------90---------------- 85---------- (16+32)------ 9------ 69----------------------------------------------- 8D-----(--)- ----720----4-------90---------------- 90---------- (16+57)------ 5------ 61----------------------------------------------- 5B does 40 more dmg per rep. compared to 2B J.2C alle~can is far better than J.C for sandwich combos. 40 extra DMG per rep. & better scaling. J.2C alle~can is better then 5C during 236236D super combo. 80 extra DMG per hit! 8D & 6D tall character loops depends on how many reps and needs testing to further clarify which is better. 8D does less DMG and scaline while 6D does more DMG & scaling. Combo lengh is a HUGE factor for this answer. I'm also volunteered to do a full translation. =) So, work in progress guys.
Zeero Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 oh wait sorry. read the wrong value Thanks for your hard work! finally i'll know what to spam when 236236D hits, 5c, 6c, or j2c for lowest proration + damage.
Kyle Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 I've done as much translating as I can without knowing Japanese. If anybody has the mook and feels like finishing what I've done please e-mail me. Kyle.Wattula@Gmail.com
|||||| Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=AutonomousR&view=videos
Braver Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 I'm liking what carl is becoming. He's waay better than when he first started. I actually think he may have a chance with the new stuff players are discovering. -Carl using a gimmick to quickly land after a IAD by air-dashing into air grab making carl fall faster to the ground as he air-dashes -new 60% air-grab loop trap http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R64bmsVk3I0 - Carl vs Taokaka @0:33 - Uses that quick-land trick @1:13 & @2:02 60% air-grab loop @2:50 - didn't understand what the carl player was doing there but I found it funny lol
Kyle Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YgZbTSt-vw&feature=channel_page @1:05- I think Carl could have canceled J.A into 236236]D[, used the invincibility to whiff Litchi's burst. Anyone find a confirmation video/ or able to try it out in their arcades?!? P.S.- Cali. VIP Party looking for Carl players. ;( Work shifts came up so I can not go. Sorry guys.
Zeero Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YgZbTSt-vw&feature=channel_page @1:05- I think Carl could have canceled J.A into 236236]D[, used the invincibility to whiff Litchi's burst. 236236D doesnt have invincibility, so carl will still eat the burst. But litchi will land into the punching super. Carl has developed a lot combo/pressure wise, but his overall problem of low life and hard to get in range (with nirvana) to do anything and stopping people from pressuring him still exists. (i'd rather people pressure me when nirvana is nearby though, but that just means your opponent doesnt know their matchup)
Kyle Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Well, are people invincible after a gold burst in BB? P.S.- One of my favorite things to do with Carl is to super Cancel once I notice my opponent has bursted and my attacks are being absorbed. =P 63214, 6HS FTW I can't read the japanese or else I be able to tell if the Ne~san super has invincibility. Also, IF the opoonent is vulnerable after a burst, than the 214214]D[ super timed well will do damage. It might even be enough hit stun to tech the burst and continue a combo. 0.o~ !!!!!!!!!!
Zeero Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Well, are people invincible after a gold burst in BB? P.S.- One of my favorite things to do with Carl is to super Cancel once I notice my opponent has bursted and my attacks are being absorbed. =P 63214, 6HS FTW I can't read the japanese or else I be able to tell if the Ne~san super has invincibility. Also, IF the opoonent is vulnerable after a burst, than the 214214]D[ super timed well will do damage. It might even be enough hit stun to tech the burst and continue a combo. 0.o~ !!!!!!!!!! people i play with dont bother bursting against me anymore, because they will always get hit by the gear super when they do Gear super is that great. im not sure how the burst invincibility thing works, but i know you can punish them before they land on the ground... so it might be possible...
Kyle Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Just realized that gear super, RC, 6HS UB can be done anywhere on screen as long as you buffer ne~san from preventing push-back. Damn he's such an interesting character
A.B.A-can-do Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Carl may be the C.viper of the game. hard and complex to use but once you learn him he turns SS tier.
Zeero Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Carl may be the C.viper of the game. hard and complex to use but once you learn him he turns SS tier. i wish this was true
A.B.A-can-do Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Hey ppl are finding out new stuff about him all the time when they bother to play him for a while. i may just be. "Carl Clover for pros only. No scrubs allow" XD
Shining Aquas Posted March 25, 2009 Posted March 25, 2009 Be proud Carl players. Although the character you've decided to main is indeed not likely to win matches (yet), he has probably got more potential growth and development than any other character in this game by far.
Kyle Posted March 26, 2009 Posted March 26, 2009 "Gimmicks & Tricks compilation" CONTROLLING NE~SAN- Ne~san activates on the press of D. -[D]-. Ne~san attacks on the release of D. -#]D[-. Ne~san has to reactivate every time you command her, UNLESS you re-buffer D. This will cause her to stay vulnerable & interactive while reducing all those extra activation/start-up frames for your loops. You will end up negative edgeing than re-buffering 90% of the time. Like ST boxer, you spend more time buffering the button than actually leaving it idle. ALLEGRATO CANCEL - I’m referring to this as his Alle~ Cancel. The special move of J.214C drops Carls’ elevation during start-up frames. IF Carl touches the ground during these start-up frames its INSTANT recovery. Hence a short J.2C, 214C is a fast & beastly overhead with amazing recovery. LOOPS- 1- Sandwich: C/6B, 6]D[, 66/jump, Attack… C/6B, 6]D[, 66/jump, Attack… C/6B, 6]D[, 66/jump, Attack… 2- Sandwich: 2C, 8]D[, 2C, 8]D[, 2C, 8]D[, 3- In corner: C/6B, 236A&6]D[, Attack… C/6B, 236A&6]D[, Attack… C/6B, 236A&6]D[, 4- In corner: C/6B, 6]D[, IAD, J.C, Attack… C/6B, 6]D[, IAD, J.C, Attack… C/6B, 6]D[, IAD, J.C, Attack… 5- In Corner: 2C, J.C, 8]D[, 2C, J.C, 8]D[, 2C, J.C, 8]D[, TALL CHARACTER LOOPS- This includes Tager & Haku-Men. Both of these do terrible damage. Not worth anything except cool-points. =( 1. IAD, J.A (J.A, J.A, J.2C) xN 2. C/6B, 8]D[, 66/jump, Attack… C/6B, 8]D[, 66/jump, Attack… 3. 2C, 236A, 2C... (works on Nu as well) ATTACK/COMBO NOTES- J.2C, Allecan is FAR better than J.C/C/6C for damage & scaling B, is FAR better than 2B for damage & scaling AIR TRAJECTORY- It seems a missed AirThrow during an AirDash drops Carl’s elevation, FAST. This makes very useful landing low mix-ups while opponent is in guard stun from Ne~san. INPUT: J.66B+C, Land, 2A… ANTI-AIR- The most reliable A.A. attack I’ve seen is to jump into the opponent, IB, J.A/land&6P. J.A only has 5 frames of start-up, his fastest move! NE~SAN HEALING- Ne~san heals two different ways in BB. It’s quicker to self repair after defeat, at least with idle you can bank on her supers if needed. =/ I. Self repair after it’s broke down. II. Remain idle for a long ass time. BURST BAITING- Burst punish in BB. WTF! O.0 I. While grounded, just super cancel into gear once you notice a burst. 632146C II. While aerial, just super cancel into 214214]D[. When opponent is vulnerable, than you can recover and combo off of the launch. IV. As always, you can jump into a burst & Instant Block. Punish with C, J.B, 8]D[, 2C, Raise the roof loops. UNBLOCKABLES- 1- (Pressure/Neutral Tech Trap) of 2B/3C/6B/2A&2]D[ 2- (Pressure/Neutral Tech Trap) of 6C/J.2CAlle~&3]D[ 3- Gear, RC, 66, 6[C]. Notes: I.CAN be Carl exclusive if opponent is in corner. II. Can be done mid-screen IF buffering Ne~san to avoid additional push-back. 4- 236236]D[, 6[C]. Notes: Depends on position of Carl & Ne~san, have to be close enough to not waste hit-stun putting Carl into position. 5- J.B+C & 8]D[. Note: I. Throw break causes re-launch, IF low enough to the floor Carl can continue a combo with 2C, RINSE&REPEAT. KARA THROW- 6~C. Use it!
Zeero Posted March 26, 2009 Posted March 26, 2009 UNBLOCKABLES- 1- (Pressure/Neutral Tech Trap) of 2B/3C/6B/2A&4]D[ i think you meant 2D
JackG Posted March 26, 2009 Posted March 26, 2009 632146HS6[HS] Silly Kyle, there's no HS in this game
|||||| Posted March 27, 2009 Posted March 27, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=AutonomousR&view=videos
Zeero Posted March 27, 2009 Posted March 27, 2009 Silly Kyle, there's no HS in this game lol, I didnt catch that either. its too natural that everybody knows HS is C. but does what A B and D refer to?? pkd? psd? ksd? pks? I'd say P S HS D = A B C D
Kyle Posted March 27, 2009 Posted March 27, 2009 2B leaves Carl in +/- 0 Frames. This is a great frame trap! 2B, Recover, 2A 2B, Recover, J.2C~Allecan 2B, Recover, 632146HS. >_>
Zeero Posted March 27, 2009 Posted March 27, 2009 how bout 6B? i think it'd be more useful since it pushes you forward. And whats the startup of 2A? if its slower than everybody else's 2A then kinda pointless...
Kyle Posted March 27, 2009 Posted March 27, 2009 Recover on 6B is (-2). that's not bad. his personal 3rd best. as 2B & 6C are both +/- 0 Frames. Carl's 2A & 5A have 6 frames of start-up. That is equal to or better than the entire cast. as most other character have 7 frame start-up on their 2A, the rest have 6 as per Carl. The only issue is the two character that have 5 frames standing A's & DP's. =P
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