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When you do the first Gurren after 2B, delaying it a little to get the maximum height out of the 2B kick OTG helps a lot. It also helps in combos where the opponent may be too low normally.

I can do them both, but she's too high for the 2C. Let me test this out and I'll get back to you. EDIT: Why not just do 3C > 2B > Gurren > Hop 2C > Etc.?

That combo works on Noel. What problems are you having?

Congratulations on becoming the EVO2K11 champion, Spark, and for potentially bringing some good traffic to the Haku boards. XD Well, back to work.

The reason j.D is like that is to set Hakumen's lower mobility in stone. What I mean to say is that in CS1, you could easily get by Hakumen's slow ground movement by air dashing around and using the threat of j.D to prevent someone from doing anything about it. In CS2, you get guaranteed damage and the risky chance to make your jump-ins safe. That's all j.D should do and for it to do anymore would basically negate why Hakumen has those weird little hops in the first place. Seems like the uses of FC 4C in 1.02 were improved on by making it able to be special-cancelled. If you are using that Astral enough to get this worked up about, you could have used that meter from other things most any other time. I do understand the pain of not having the sixth guard primer, I really do. However with that much health and a burst to blow, I would give him 2 guard primers after a burst as a game designer as well. Bursts are used as a last resort and having three whole primers makes it feel less like that. The cooldown at that specific duration is usually there for a reason. The rest of the cast suffers from the reduced gain of Heat after using 25% or more of it at a time. Yes, Hakumen's auto-gain is stopped but having reduced cooldown like that would increase his heat gain exponentially (more auto-gain and more heat gained elsewhere), which would allow you much more meter than you should ever need.

I am happy I have this new web plan on my phone so I can check up on posts. XD I will do it after I finish Carl's. I will put those two and my finished Tsubaki & Taokaka write-ups pn the boards when I get home tonight.

Yes, however the gameplan for why and what pressure you're applying depends on your meter and the matchup. I am going off of what I am taking from CS2 Hakumen so far: When you're low on meter, you will want to use your range to keep the opponent out and if need be, use your delayed gatlings to lock your opponent in blockstun for any given time (with stuff like 2A > 5A > 2A > 2B > 3C) and create space. Meanwhile, you use your Drive to counter any holes in your opponent's blockstrings. When you have meter, your pressure becomes a different story as you can cancel your attacks into Gurren or Renka to make them safe and possibly score a hit. Otherwise, you'll want to use it to get an opponent into the corner and keep them there. If they try to escape only to get hit-confirmed into big damage, they'll start panicking. Do not resort to always pressuring your opponent as Hakumen's tools work best punishing your opponent's own attacks. Make them freak out a bit and then use Counters/Hotaru/etc. to capitalize on their mistakes. Hope this helps. I'll be on in a few days so I'll see your reply (if there will be one) then.

I'm leaving for a trip to Tallahassee for a few days so if anyone has a character they want a match-up report for, let me know now as I will do them then. Or any specific write-up you may have in mind.

Moves to use: 4C: Extremely useful. Tager has little to do against it other than to block. One of your best tools to zone Tager out. j.C: Serves the same purpose as 4C, but against air approaches. 2C: Great anti-air to use as it covers a lot of range and will still give Hakumen needed space if it's barrier blocked. 6D/5D: These are amazing to use in reaction to Tager's slow moves. Will not prevent you from being magnetized if you catch your opponent's 5D and the like but the combo afterwards will whittle away most of the time while it's active. 3C: Quite useful along with 4C in the ground zoning game. If spaced correctly, you can stuff a lot of Tager's moves before they have a chance to hit you and score a CH. It is also useful against 6A (super armor doesn't stop lows) when a Tager player is trying to fish for your 4C. Hotaru: Good on wakeup and against Tager's j.C air approaches. Any hit will give you damage and at least breathing room. 5B: Interestingly powerful tool at neutral as it can beat a good amount of Tager's normals if he's too close for C moves. Strategy: This matchup will require a lot of patience and “laming out” but you cannot allow Tager the chance to do anything up close. Use 4C, j.C, and 3C to prevent Tager from advancing. He has very little he can do about this save Spark Bolt. You must constantly be aware of your spacing in the match-up, especially if the opposing Tager is sitting on a Spark Bolt. If you misjudge your range, Tager can backdash to cause you to whiff and CH with Spark Bolt when your pants are down. If you zone effectively, the opposing Tager player will have to resort to riskier tactics to get in. Tire your opponent out and they will get reckless, which you can capitalize on when possible. Avoid getting magnetized at any cost as Hakumen's zoning game becomes very hard as you can be easily pulled farther than expected and get CH. Tager's 5D/6A/2D become viable counters against most attacks. If you score a hit while magnetized, do not be afraid of using meter to extend the combo as much as you can, regardless of the damage. The longer you have Tager in a combo, the less time he'll have to pull you around. NOTE: Magnetism stacks, so if you are already magnetized, the duration of any following magnetism will be added on to the total time (max. 960F or 16 seconds). Last but not least, do not be backed into a corner. Use any openings to get past Tager and out of danger. Character-Specific Details: [*]Instant overhead j.B will work on Tager even if he's crouching. Use this to hit-confirm and cancel into Tsubaki for great damage while avoiding Tager's 360A/B & 720C and stuffing Atomic Colliders at the same time. [*]A character-specific combo that will help very much in this matchup is 6D > IAD j.2C > 2C > JC > j.2A > AD j.2A > j.C. Do the IAD j.2C as you would with Hotaru and you will hit Tager from behind. When you land, Hakumen will already be facing the other way and you can combo Tager into the corner that you were getting backed into. Not only that, but this cost no meter, will give you corner advantage, and much needed breathing room.

I almost thought that there wasn't going to be a Hakumen player that qualified for a minute. This makes me super happy now. Thanks for the update!

Yeah, I agree that the j.2C oki is a great thing. Thinking over about it, Gurren doesn't stunt your automatic and regular meter gain as well so you'll receive the full amount from whatever comes after the j.2C. I am a bit weary on wherever or not you can't just roll out like Ludacris, so I'll see what happens in the lab. Secondly, you are right about the Tsubaki. As much as I hate using meter when you haven't made a solid hit-confirm, you can't land and the instant overhead j.B as I am not sure you'll hit most of the cast when they're crouching. I guess if you don't have meter, you can always go for the 6B after the j.2C. Thanks for the insight. Yeah, I'm trying to work on matchup thread information as I need to take what I put in the Tsubaki subforum and combine it into a suitable format. Plus, there's still a few more matchups I want to get to in terms of absolutely necessary.

I'm not so completely sold on it. Not only do I feel like using Gurren as a combo finisher is a bit funky, but the fact that you'll get beat by anyone who DPs or blocks low after IBing the j.2C. Cancelling j.2C on block into Tsubaki is bad because if they'll already be blocking high, nothing to be gained there. I would rather 2B and cancel into 2/6D if need be then to lose out on damage and waste a magatama. I'll hit the lab with it and see what I can do. I'm interested in this but there has to be a better way.

This board is definitely quiet now. It's quite weird.

You can do both, as I said in my post.

I did it off of Hop Hotaru at first, but I just tested it with TK and it works as well. The key thing is to do the j.C late/low enough to where you have enough time to land, recover, and do Gurren. So basically: Hotaru > IAD j.C > land Gurren > 2C > Corner Loop. If you're too far from the corner, you can replace the 2C with 6C to slide them into it usually. I'm terrible with hop 2C so I haven't tried it yet. EDIT: Also, I'm getting 4.2k off of it.

I don't know if this was discussed, but if you get a Non-FC Hotaru, you can IAD j.C > land Gurren > 2C > Corner Loop and get 3.9k and the same essential combo.

Spencer has a knee drop OTG groundbounce move now? Well, damn. Also, Storm confirmed for having Rachel's Drive. XD

NOTE: “[m]” means with mantenbou and “[e]” means empty-handed (staff planted). Moves to Use: 3C: Use for a CH on moves that are unsafe on block like 2C[m] or whiffed moves. 5D/6D/2D: Your best tools to use to get out of corner pressure and in reaction to 6A and the mix-up OS from 5C[m] (4D[m] or 3C[m]). Also, great to use against mantenbou shenanigans. 2C: To discourage jump-ins. Hotaru: Use this against her IAD approaches, crossups with j.B[m], and to get out of corner pressure. Kishuu/Enma: To go under Straight-Through B, 6B, 4D[m]. 6B: Use its' low invulnerability to beat out 3C and Itsuu A (236A[e]). Use Litchi's extended hurtbox during these to stomp on her from afar. Anti-airing: Hotaru, 2C, 5A/B/C. Zoning: 3C, j.C, 4C. Their game plan: The Litchi player's overall game plan is to get you into the corner, keep you there, and force you to neutral tech to keep the advantage up. They will be looking to punish overzealous and predictable opponents by 2C[m], 3C[m], 6A, j.C[m], j.2D[m] and Straight-Through. A counter-hit with any of these will lead to a combo with a lot of corner carry and leaves you at a great disadvantage. Once they have you in the corner, they will use mantenbou pressure along with their own attacks to cut off your escape routes. Strategy: Both of your gameplans are basically the same: Take advantage of a mistake, put your opponent in the corner because of it, keep them there. Use this to your advantage when trapped in the corner. A simple Back Throw or 5D/2D is all it takes to switch the momentum in this match-up. As with CS1, you will still win out in the A/B attack range. Use your new ground gatlings (delayed cancels) to lock Litchi down while you gain meter. A simple 2B → 2A → 5A → 5B is safe on block and nets you about ¾ of a star. However, she wins at longer range. Don't mash 4C as a good Litchi player can easily deal with that. Play it safe in this matchup, even with meter. Both you and the Litchi player will be looking to punish unsafe moves. If you are put into the corner, don't attempt to roll out and just neutral tech. However, you have an advantage over most characters as you can escape and/or put Litchi in the corner with your Drive. Use the predictability of a launched stick's route to use 5D/6D. Also, do not panic. It may seem like overwhelming but you must pay attention to Litchi in order to block her mix-up. Char specific details: [*]You can buffer 6D during the superflash of All Green to counter the DD. Because of the fact that Litchi lunges forward a good bit, you can connect with the 6D push from much farther than expected. Also, you can buffer Shippu as Yukikaze will not cause hitstop on projectiles. If you do, Shippu's invul frames protect you from All Green and you can cancel into Gurren to combo them into the corner. [*]2D completely neutralizes Litchi's Thirteen Orphans Distortion Drive (Stick Man). If you buffer 2D during the superflash and 2D again after the first, you will toss Litchi into the air and then catch her with the second 2D for 2200 damage and the ability to follow up with the 2D combo of your choice.

DL is back up, let's get this sub-forum moving again! Lots of stuff to research and discuss, let's get to it!

I've (and hundreds/thousands of others) have been having issues with Verizon and latency issues preventing me from accessing a few sites (this one in general) without a proxy. I will be updating this and a few others with some info for discussion tonight but I'll write it down offline and post it in one big go. Sorry for the delay.

After any use of 25% or more of your meter (Two stars or more), auto meter gain is stopped for 3 seconds and any heat you would gain during the time period is reduced by 75%.

I'll be getting on this sometime today. Have a bit of a write-up for it but need to type it up.

Your automatic meter gain is completely stopped and you only gain 25% of the heat you would normally gain from other sources. As such: Drive Counters: 1/4 of a magatama (3.125%) Instant Blocks: ~1/17 of a magatama (0.75%) Attacks: .25(Damage x Situation Rating [if the attack hits, is blocked, etc.] x .3 [Character Rating]) Hakumen has the best meter gain per attack in the game. Secondly, I believe they are trying to lead Hakumen into the "the best defense is a good offense" role. He has delayed cancels now to keep his pressure safe without meter in order to keep the opponent locked down in order to build said meter. Hakumen isn't the type to sit there and turtle. He's the type of character that will make you lament fighting him, lock you down, and make you accept your inevitable fate of losing. Use your normals, lock them down, IB or use your counters offensively between holes if your opponent tries to exploit them, make them fear them fear doing anything.

To properly combo using TK/Hop Hotaru, you will have to wait for Hakumen to land after the hit to IAD. The difference is that you will combo into different things depending on whether or not you got a FC off of Hotaru. On regular hit, you can do IAD -> j.2A -> j.C as well as IAD -> Air Throw. On FC, you can do IAD -> j.2C -> 2C -> Corner Loop if you were anywhere past midscreen when you used Hotaru (see Hakumen Challenge #9). You'll get ~2.3k off of a regular hit and ~4.3k on FC, so the difference is quite big. Hop/TK Tsubaki can only be followed up if the opponent slides into the corner. There are a few combos that you can do after it that are listed in the Combo Discussion thread, I believe. You can combo after Tsubaki midscreen if you are almost directly above your opponent. You can then Air Dash -> j.2C -> 2C -> so on. The reason you can't pull it out on wake-up could be due to a few factors. The first is that you have 4F of jump startup which means at the earliest, Hotaru comes out on frame 5. It can be used on wake-up, however any attacks that's active when you Neutral Tech will hit you in the jump's startup frames (so block). TK Hotaru is great for using when you see large holes in your opponent's blockstrings or to punish unsafe/whiffed attacks. His 2D and 6D come out on Frame 1 so you can use those instead of Yukikaze (6D for high/2D for low). If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

Yo, you're my hero. What's worse is if we became better at it. They would be like "YOU PONEH PLAYA?"