Dreiko

Extend Bang had permanent frkz which meant 5A lead to 5k meterless anywhere and he was actually very strong in that game too, just cause Hakumen also was strong it doesn't mean the MU was in his favor necessarily or that Bang was weak. Ok first and foremost, Bang didn't get weaker in CP, he got HARDER, you had to do more difficult things but the payoff was still just as good (proportionally, since cp is a lower damage game than extend) if not better due to the option of mid-combo poison nails for that extra 800 damage. A lot of people dropped him cause they got used to playing a mid-low difficulty char and he became a high difficulty char overnight. That's really not a good indicator of his strength. The loss of frkz as a permanent tool hurt but he got enough other things to offset it, it's more of a hit in moral than anything. "Nails are ineffectual" is a ridiculous statement, I'm sorry. Yes, tossing them in a stupid or easy to cut/D way sure is ineffectual, but so is it in every other MU, people just block or dodge them in those cases, the punishment for it isn't as bad for Bang but it still is a negative so you shouldn't really base things on how people who wrongly use nails fare. The only thing is that you have to make an adjustment in HOW you utilize nails, not unlike how you do it vs Tager who can sledge them, Nu who can D through them, Valk who can't block while in wolf, etc. etc. In CP, nails for bang are just as much a tool for movement (and I don't mean the bumpers, I mean the actual nails) or for significantly better combos than they are a tool for neutral. Also, have you fought Bang in CP like, at all? If you TKdnails with Bang he flies upwards as they retain momentum in CP similar to how the A nail does. I'm sorry but I think you're going off of ancient info here. Finally, Bang only loses to Hakumen in air to air if you're pre-emptively pressing something and he flies right into it. Bang jB is superior to Haku jB in air to air and his jA is amazing too, Haku jC is annoying to deal with but Hakumen who just jump back spamming jC all day took a nerf to their heat gain so that approach is not as good any more and it still is avoidable due to Bang's superior air mobility. Hell, you can punish jC with A nail when you space it right at nearly zero-risk.

And don't forget j22a completely nullifies Hakumen's Ds even after he counters you with them! :D

I don't know, Hakumen never felt like a bad MU to me. Even in CP it felt about even if not in Bang's favor.

People thought Terumi would be broken too due to his drive. Kneejerk reactions seldom are good. As for the variance of Hakumen's placement, Goro is using Makoto and Dora uses Bang so I'd hesitate to say it's the matchup that makes them think so differently. Maybe Goro hasn't fought enough of him or something.

Nope, both were buffed a ton.

Apparently it does, yes. Rejoice!

I have been hearing Jp Celica since 2011 with the BBCS1 drama cd, not gonna go to a different VA now lol. Nomizu too good. Now onto more gameplay-related stuff, hmm, how bout that online rematch button eh!

The good thing about it there is that it's in a part of the combo where it's so prorated that the only way to land a jD is with the IAD. the usual IAD route for the earlier bits will be the usual one which is better since our Bs prorate way better than 5D and don't SMP.

Nobody posted this here yet, I am surprised lol. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYZJo2TAQz8

Definitely disagree about Axl Leo and Chipp, Millia and Chipp are the same kind of problem, one just dies a little quicker. Bedman is easy and Ram is in the OK group next to El and Zato. Leo should never be able to get in on you and if he does backdash solves him pretty easily. Just 6P and 236H for days, Leo has no safe way of closing in. You can poke him through his fireballs. Axl can do nothing in neutral since chains get poked out by 236H for free. Ky and Sol are annoying but not too much. I'd probably bring El up with them but she doesn't have a dp so I can understand that. Ky's stun dipper is probably the most annoying move in the entire game for Sin since it low profiles and becomes active from f5, outspeeding everything it doesn't low-profile. Even 236K sucks here since it won't become active right off, though this is fixed in 1.1. You have to hard call out stun dipper with 3K (which is a very slow move) or just completely dodge it. Overall though, Ky's projectiles all lose to 236K (even his super ones and the ones that have gone through his seals) so in neutral Sin has the upper hand, the problems arise when you're cornered. Chipp though, hooo boy. You really are too slow to deal with anything he does and he can alpha blade under 236H. His 2D is almost Sol levels annoying, he can teleport and punish your eating from anywhere. He's a pain. Granted he dies in 2 combos but Sin is especially horrible at poking out of pressure so against the master of forcing pressure on you, it's a real pain if he gets in even once.

Bullet gained the ability to special cancel her Ds which allows her to gain sometimes two heat levels in a single combo without rc or gain one fire level while having one(going to lvl 2) and then using the lvl 2 fire move to do high damage, all in a single combo. Basically, she gets a whole lot more reward for everything without needing to spend meter and she can stay fired up for longer which somewhat alleviates her problems with neutral which mainly are there when she is without fire, though she still has trouble getting started. An actual Bullet main would probably be able to offer you greater detail but this is the gist of the character as I see her right now.

The grenade goes away but shotgun stance is still undpable and unbeatable without spending resources of some kind or making a crazy risky read. Also I don't think her hitbox will be adjusted. Sin is stronger overall so the MU will be better but still bad.

While the Sol MU is annoying, the backdash and the range of your normals make it easy to kinda space him out. It's nowhere near as bad as Elphelt though since if she corners you in shotgun stance you have little to do while for Sol the DP is usually a good enough answer. Also, Sol's hitbox allows for the good combos to be performed while Elphelt has the single worst one for Sin combos and forces you to do worse ones. Sol has to take a lot more risks to approach since 236H beats GF and air approaches can get 6Pd while Elphelt just tosses a gliding grenade in the air and is in.

Bang has some combos that ignore SMP with his j623B during OD since it bounces midscreen and you can latch onto it daifunka. Most things however don't have perfect p2 and insane hitstun so they're not as optimal. In his case though he gets to do his optimal low-od-duration combos through SMP abuse.

I don't believe that because it's a useless distinction at this level for the most part when you have a lot of very serious players who have all spent a lot of time and have a ton of useful knowledge to offer. It more often than not is used as a way to avoid having an actual discussion. It's like saying "I won so I'm right" when you could have won just due to having better reaction speeds or having practiced your combos more or just cause you were lucky or something. Of course that doesn't cover every single good result but you get my point. Reminding people of their skill hierarchy for the purposes of debating does little to foster good debate. If someone has to merely flash a badge and gain insta-credibility to whatever they have to say that can eat away at how much effort they put into what they're saying. Hell, I bet SKD himself would prefer it if he had nobody else championing his status so his very well developed points could shine purely out of their own value. Yes obviously one ought to think before they speak...but one ought to be able to speak without being externally questioned by third parties regarding how much thought he put before addressing the great divine.

Look what I quoted. I'm not talking about asking questions here. I'm talking about this line of thinking of "are your experiences even comparable to his? who are you to question him?" and that sort of rhetoric. Everyone's comparable to everyone and everyone can question everyone else. There's no hierarchy, some people just suck a bit less and some win a bit more lol. If anyone has anything they feel they can say that disproves something, they should go ahead and say it. We gain nothing by silencing people for not winning as many majors as the people they're disagreeing with. Even if they end up wrong, them being shown to be wrong is in itself much more beneficial than them simply seeing themselves as unworthy and remaining quiet.

I believe Tsubaki now does 623C>delayedj236A>5C and it works in such a way that j236A does not actually become active but it has almost no landing recovery (or perhaps none at all) so she gets to 5C right away. No microdash needed either.

In the end everyone is just a player hitting buttons. If you put people on a pedestal too much you will be doing yourself a disservice. I remember this video Jiyuna posted about LK and how he was asking this JP player how to become good and the JP player was confused cause to him they were equals already. It's this sorta thing. Just cause you're good or you've done well it doesn't really mean your word is law. To debate or disagree with something someone like that says is fine. I don't even think about all of this in that ego-couched logic of "when you ask questions you admit you're weaker" or whatever that I read here, that's the silliest concept ever. Nobody knows everything and discussion benefits everyone, even the people giving the answers. Ultimately, I'd hold being "starstruck" for different instances of events. People being better at fighters than you just means you get to have more fun improving yourself and challenging them again hoping the result will differ. It's a fun thing. If people expect others to kowtow to their favorite players just cause they themselves are so awestruck, well, that's a silly way to be. :P Nah man, I just wanna have good games. The best way to have good games is against strong opponents and those are found in competitive scenes. Asking questions about something just means you don't know something. Nothing more nothing less. I have known people who get touchy when you explain stuff to them and who get offended by the implications that arise when you explain something (that they very clearly don't understand based on their play) but that's the silliest way to be. I don't think the majority of players think like that.

I don't think having fought a good Bang player will impart to you knowledge comparable to actually having used the character for dozens of thousands of matches over multiple years, though. Just telling me "I fought dora a lot so I know better than you" is not gonna be enough to convince me lol. Also I wasn't saying he was wrong period, more that he is correct but not entirely so. I was specifying in which way I believed he may have misjudged the strength of Jin's mixup when compared to Bang's.

I feel Jin has to actually hit you once for his mixup to become that level of scary though while Bang just needs you to let him get in or let him toss some airdash D nails. That's the main difference. Jin just does frametraps and stagger mixups for days and if he actually lands something then the ice stuff becomes really scary and stable and everything while Bang can transition into mixup from neutral in easier ways and with a more threatening mixup to go to. Of course Jin being consistently high tier in CP and Bang being lower B or whatever he ended up as, Jin will still come on top but I feel it's less due to scary mixup period and more due to his ice mixup once he has already gotten a hit which is less a testament to how good his mixup is and more a testament to how good his ice is in allowing him to set up really hard to deal with mixup in a way that if other chars had available to them they too would be just as scary in the least, if that makes sense.

I was including grabs and bumpers and hover cancel normals in the mixup I was mentioning, not purely high-low. And yeah that's kinda my point, each individual thing is actually meh in a vacuum but when combined with everything there's so many ways one can go that the actual act of defending becomes harder, even if the overheads are actually reactable and the command grab is slow and everything. At least his lows are either + or safe so you can end pressure with them and keep going somewhat.

Regarding throw teching, the window may be 15F but when you add the actual grab startup in there it becomes 22 which is quite reactable, the trick is to look for the grab startup to react to, not for the !!s. Ultimately, good mixup is about a myriad things which, all of them combined, make the guessing game harder. This is why a char with more but slower mixup options like Bang whose fastest overhead is 22f (5C is only 18f when the hitbox is just covering his head, it won't actually hit standing/crouching people until frame 24) feels as though he has more threatening mixup than Jin with his 19f 6A. (and both Bang's 6B and Jin's 6A are not comboable overheads without rc so they're identical in that too).

Also the announcer was saying that it's not just "tk air 360 over and over". He has to hold the 360 with a varied amount of delay for each rep and it depends on char hitbox and stuff. It's very hard to do and he said he could only do 3 reps of it at most.

I *think* he reapplies magnetism by doing additional fingers as the magnetism wears off, rcing, then continuing the loop so that silliness at least cost him 100 meter. Also I believe I read that magnetism duration is extended for a few of his things which is probably one of his most significant buffs. The announcer said there were 23 seconds on the clock when he began the loop so...yikes lol.

Ahh ok, I was the Shana player the Kirito player was fighting, sitting on the p2 chair.